9
   

Israel's Amazing Medical Breakthrough

 
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 04:02 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:
Presently, most people in the USA want to reduce or eliminate money going to Egypt. This is due to its ruling Muslim Brotherhood.


That would be good, it would release Egypt from its obligation to toe the line.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  4  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 04:13 pm
@Advocate,
The US didn't have Israel under the thumb of brutal dictators. Really, do you guys know anything absolutely anything at all about history?
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 04:15 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
As said, you don't have an idea about Art. 176/177 (Liberazione condizionale) of the Codice penale.
For life sentences it's 26 years, btw.


No, I know about that as well. Since it is almost never granted to prisoners, I just didn't factor it into my calculations.

Guede's chances of ever qualifying for it are one in a million.



Walter Hinteler wrote:
There's nothing said about returning at night - that would be "open prison", but still 'prison'.


That's because you're looking at the wrong part of the law.

This article should describe the type of parole that you mentioned above:
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberazione_condizionale

This article should describe the freeing of prisoners during the day once they have served half of their sentence:
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semilibertà

And this article should describe shortening their overall sentences by a quarter if prisoners are well behaved:
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberazione_anticipata

It's all in Italian, so you might need Google translate unless you can read Italian.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  3  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 04:18 pm
@Advocate,
Quote:
Presently, most people in the USA want to reduce or eliminate money going to Egypt.


Such sanctimonious assholes!

If we can't have our choice of brutal dictators, you can kiss the money bye bye.
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 05:22 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
Presently, most people in the USA want to reduce or eliminate money going to Egypt.


Such sanctimonious assholes!

If we can't have our choice of brutal dictators, you can kiss the money bye bye.


Look at it like a consumer. Don't throw good money after bad.
JTT
 
  3  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 06:11 pm
@Foofie,
Quote:
Look at it like a consumer. Don't throw good money after bad.


Better yet, Foofie, look at it with a measure of reality.

Though the US talks a good game, the US, and way way too many of its war mongering citizenry, doesn't give a damn about those millions murdered, the scores of millions terrorized, tortured, raped, sickened, their lives torn and ruined.

But you keep on deluding yourself. You're really terrific at that. You can't even pretend you are a sanctimonious asshole.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 06:59 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
As always, I think you are mistaken regarding most of the crimes you believe we have committed.


Quote:
A second candidate for most extreme act of Mideast international terrorism in the peak year of 1985 is a car-bombing in Beirut on March 8 that killed 80 people and wounded 256. The bomb was placed outside a Mosque, timed to explode when worshippers left. "About 250 girls and women in flowing black chadors, pouring out of Friday prayers at the Imam Rida Mosque, took the brunt of the blast," Nora Boustany reported. The bomb also "burned babies in their beds," killed children "as they walked home from the mosque," and "devastated the main street of the densely populated" West Beirut suburb. The target was a Shi'ite leader accused of complicity in terrorism, but he escaped. The crime was organized by the CIA and its Saudi clients with the assistance of British intelligence. NOTE{Boustany, _Washington Post Weekly_, March 14, 1988; Bob Woodward, _Veil_ (Simon & Schuster, 1987, 396f.).}
Moment-in-Time
 
  2  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 07:47 pm
@JTT,
There seem to be no end to US' support for dictators with closed eyes to the native population. One of the US greatest crimes, after the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, was the illegal invasion of Iraq by the US Coalition and one of the consequences of that action was Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse.

During the War in Iraq, human rights violations, committed from late 2003 to early 2004, in the form of physical, psychological, and sexual abuse, including torture, reports of rape, sodomy, and homicide of prisoners held in the Abu Ghraib prison (currently known as the Baghdad Central Prison) came to public attention beginning in early 2004 with Department of Defense announcements. These acts were committed by military police personnel of the United States Army together with those of additional US governmental agencies.
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 07:51 pm
@JTT,
By 1985, Reagan was pretty senile and was led around by his handlers, including head of the CIA, Wm. Casey. Casey, while lying in his deathbed, a very conniving person, allegedly admitted to Bob Wardward that he arranged the bombing. Who knows what is true.
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 07:51 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
As always, I think you are mistaken regarding most of the crimes you believe we have committed.



Quote:

...

The secret to understanding US foreign policy is that there is no secret. Principally, one must come to the realization that the United States strives to dominate the world. Once one understands that, much of the apparent confusion, contradiction, and ambiguity surrounding Washington’s policies fades away. To express this striving for dominance numerically, one can consider that since the end of World War Two the United States has:

Endeavored to overthrow more than 50 foreign governments, most of which were democratically-elected.
Grossly interfered in democratic elections in at least 30 countries.
Waged war/military action, either directly or in conjunction with a proxy army, in some 30 countries.
Attempted to assassinate more than 50 foreign leaders.
Dropped bombs on the people of some 30 countries.
Suppressed dozens of populist/nationalist movements in every corner of the world.[2]

The United States institutional war machine has long been, and remains, on automatic pilot.

See,

http://able2know.org/topic/212447-1

0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 07:55 pm
@Advocate,
Just considering the enormous evil that we know the US has committed since its inception should scare the living hell out of any sane person who only just begins to imagine that which is actually still hidden.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 08:14 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
There seem to be no end to US' support for dictators with closed eyes to the native population.


Actually, that end came decades ago, when the Cold War ended.

Closed eyes? Nonsense (even before the end of the Cold War).



Moment-in-Time wrote:
One of the US greatest crimes, after the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki,


Military targets bombed at the height of a brutal war.
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Fri 12 Apr, 2013 08:21 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
Actually, that end came decades ago, when the Cold War ended.

Closed eyes? Nonsense (even before the end of the Cold War).


Feigning ignorance becomes you, OralBoy.

contrex
 
  2  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 02:07 am
@JTT,
JTT wrote:
Feigning ignorance becomes you, OralBoy.


His shows of ignorance are strangely convincing, aren't they?

In particular, saying Hiroshima & Nagasaki happened at "the height" of a war, after Germany was defeated and occupied and after the surrounded and exhausted Japanese had made attempts to bring about an end to the war without loss of face, and in total ignorance of the views of:

Eisenhower: " I voiced to him [Stimson] my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives. It was my belief that Japan was, at that very moment, seeking some way to surrender with a minimum loss of 'face'."

Leahy: "It is my opinion that the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender because of the effective sea blockade and the successful bombing with conventional weapons."

Herbert Hoover: ""...the Japanese were prepared to negotiate all the way from February 1945...up to and before the time the atomic bombs were dropped; ...if such leads had been followed up, there would have been no occasion to drop the bombs."

MacArthur: "MacArthur's views about the decision to drop the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were starkly different from what the general public supposed." He continues, "When I asked General MacArthur about the decision to drop the bomb, I was surprised to learn he had not even been consulted. What, I asked, would his advice have been? He replied that he saw no military justification for the dropping of the bomb. The war might have ended weeks earlier, he said, if the United States had agreed, as it later did anyway, to the retention of the institution of the emperor." (Norman Cousins, The Pathology of Power, pp 65, 70-71.)
Moment-in-Time
 
  2  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 11:45 am
@contrex,
Quote:
He replied that he saw no military justification for the dropping of the bomb.


I have often heard it speculated the motive for dropping the Atomic bomb was to see just how powerful this weapon was and to show other countries....to make them fear the US! Even though this occurred before I was born, I still have grievances against the US. OK, the US dropped one bomb on Hiroshima but why Nagasaki?! Why the barbaric cruelty which was so very unnecessary?!?!?
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 12:11 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Quote:
Why the barbaric cruelty which was so very unnecessary?!?!?


Barbaric cruelty defines the US, MiT. It's the unceasing propaganda that dupes folks into thinking the US represents the white hat guys.

For fifty years the US has been heaping terrorism upon the people of Cuba. They have been relentless in their barbaric cruelty.

All one has to do is look at the interaction of the US with any country and barbaric cruelty will leap to the fore.
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 12:32 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:
All one has to do is look at the interaction of the US with any country and barbaric cruelty will leap to the fore.


I once read an account, by a British war correspondent, of his visit to a US unit during the Korean War. It was composed mostly of young Midwest conscripts supervised by a grizzled sergeant, a World War II veteran. The British guy observed the young Americans using the local Korean farmers for target practice, often with fatal results. He asked the sergeant how this could be, and got the answer "There is no more cold-blooded killer than your average American farm boy."
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 12:38 pm
@contrex,
contrex wrote:
In particular, saying Hiroshima & Nagasaki happened at "the height" of a war, after Germany was defeated and occupied


Just for the record (since you don't know much about history or geography): the bombs were used against Japan, not against Germany.



contrex wrote:
and after the surrounded and exhausted Japanese had made attempts to bring about an end to the war without loss of face,


You drastically exaggerate both "attempt" and "loss of face".

Japan was trying to end the war in a draw, without surrendering at all (much like the way the Korean War later ended). That is quite a bit more significant than merely avoiding a "loss of face".

And their "attempt" involved nothing more than going to the Soviets and begging to talk to them about some vague plot they had. As attempts go, it was pretty feeble.



contrex wrote:
and in total ignorance of the views of:


Boy, I know more about this subject than you know about everything in the universe.



contrex wrote:
Eisenhower: " I voiced to him [Stimson] my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives. It was my belief that Japan was, at that very moment, seeking some way to surrender with a minimum loss of 'face'."


Ike was alone in these views. Stimson just called him an idiot and never bothered to tell anyone else what Ike said.



contrex wrote:
Leahy: "It is my opinion that the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender because of the effective sea blockade and the successful bombing with conventional weapons."


Leahy only said that years after the end of the war. And he only said it as part of a disingenuous argument that the Navy pretty much won the war all by themselves, so they should not have to suffer as many post-war defense cuts as the other branches of the military.

The only thing Leahy had to say about the bombs during the war was: "I'm an expert in explosives and I can assure you that these things will never work!"

More to the point, if Japan was ready to surrender, they were free to do so. No one was stopping them.

If Japan was truly ready to surrender, but they waited for no reason and let us keep bombing them, that was their own folly.



contrex wrote:
Herbert Hoover: ""...the Japanese were prepared to negotiate all the way from February 1945...up to and before the time the atomic bombs were dropped; ...if such leads had been followed up, there would have been no occasion to drop the bombs."


Another post-war claim. Hoover, of course, was not in a position to oppose the bombs before they were used, because he did not know about them.

Hoover's claims are wildly inaccurate. Japan's first offer to start negotiating with us came the day after Nagasaki.



contrex wrote:
MacArthur: "MacArthur's views about the decision to drop the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were starkly different from what the general public supposed." He continues, "When I asked General MacArthur about the decision to drop the bomb, I was surprised to learn he had not even been consulted. What, I asked, would his advice have been? He replied that he saw no military justification for the dropping of the bomb. The war might have ended weeks earlier, he said, if the United States had agreed, as it later did anyway, to the retention of the institution of the emperor." (Norman Cousins, The Pathology of Power, pp 65, 70-71.)


Well, one thing in there is accurate. MacArthur wasn't even consulted about whether to use the bombs.

However, his wartime views on the bombs are on record, and are quite different from what is being claimed. What MacArthur thought about the bombs during the war was that they would certainly help, but Japan would still refuse to surrender, requiring a large ground invasion.


The part about "retaining the institution of the emperor" is wrong in so many ways at once it is scary.

First, what Japan was asking was that Hirohito retain unlimited dictatorial power as Japan's living deity. Unlimited dictatorial power is quite different from merely retaining the Emperor.

Second, Japan was only willing to surrender with this condition after both A-bombs had already been dropped on them. The notion that we could have ended the war earlier if we had only been willing to agree to it, is nonsense.

And third, contrary to the claim, we did not in any way agree to Japan's request. Our reply to Japan told them that Hirohito was going to be subordinate to MacArthur.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 12:46 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
I have often heard it speculated the motive for dropping the Atomic bomb was to see just how powerful this weapon was and to show other countries....to make them fear the US!


And you have, just as often, seen me utterly demolish such ignorance.



Moment-in-Time wrote:
Even though this occurred before I was born, I still have grievances against the US.


Why? Did you want Japan to massacre even more innocent people?



Moment-in-Time wrote:
OK, the US dropped one bomb on Hiroshima but why Nagasaki?!


Because Japan hadn't surrendered yet.



Moment-in-Time wrote:
Why the barbaric cruelty which was so very unnecessary?!?!?


Because that's what you do during a war. You keep attacking the enemy until they surrender.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Sat 13 Apr, 2013 12:47 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
Stimson just called him an idiot and never bothered to tell anyone else what Ike said.


Just what you would expect a vicious war criminal to say.

Odd, isn't it, how Americans try to say all the right things to disguise their horrific war crimes, their relentless terrorism.
 

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