3
   

Stripper as a wife.

 
 
Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:37 am
joefromchicago wrote:
cjhsa wrote:
Another one I didn't really know worked out at my gym. She was a tiny, oh so hot blonde with an a-- tighter than a cheap jew.

Surely you didn't need to add "cheap," did you? I mean, if you're going to indulge in offensive ethnic stereotypes, you shouldn't go half way.


That's a fairly offensive quote (if it was written) but where was it quoted from? I didn't see that anywhere here in this thread.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:42 am
Here you go, Ragman (Found with a simple search for "cjhsa".)
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:46 am
boomerang wrote:
I don't see them cashing in on their looks much different than an athlete cashing in on their talents.
.


Most of the strippers I've seen aren't the top beauties of their class. In fact, many are pretty nasty looking. And these being in "respectable" (god that's a nice word to use here) establishments in decent areas, not the run down "ghetto" clubs.

The point is that ust because you've met a few smart strippers doesn't make them all smart. And just becaseu I've met mostly skanky, dim witted strippers doesn't make them all dumb. But it does alter both our perceptions of a stipper and makes neither of us wrong.

Perception is reality.

And the reality i've seen is that these girls don't have a grip on anything other than being a sex object and the money they can get for being one. They don't leave until they are forced out.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:47 am
nimh wrote:
Never gone to one myself.



It's nice that you haven't even been to one yet you claim to know these girls.

How bout you hit some clubs and come back and tell us then what you think?

I think you'd be mighty suprised at what you find there and what $300 will get you from these respectable, intelligent women.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:50 am
Ragman wrote:
does anyone else here consider this horse beaten to death beside me?


Laughing

And no one is going to relinquish their position so this poor horse is going to be ground round soon.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:53 am
Bella Dea wrote:
It's nice that you haven't even been to one yet you claim to know these girls.

If you're implying there's a contradiction in this picture, I have to ask, why? Like everybody else, these women have lives outside of their jobs, where nice people like nimh can get to know them. By implying that you have to go to a strip club to meet a stripper, or in nimh's case sleep with an escort to know the escort, you are reducing these poor women to a mere sex object, ignoring their personality.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 06:55 am
Thomas wrote:
Bella Dea wrote:
It's nice that you haven't even been to one yet you claim to know these girls.

If you're implying there's a contradiction in this picture, I have to ask, why? Like everybody else, these women have lives outside of their jobs, where nice people like nimh can get to know them. By implying that you have to go to a strip club to meet a stripper, or in nimh's case sleep with an escort to know the escort, you are reducing these poor women to a mere sex object, ignoring their personality.


What?

All I'm saying is respectable, intelligent women don't f*ck strangers for $300.

At least not within my definition of respectable and intelligent. What's your definition?

Work aside, if I f*ck my boss at work, does that make me any less of a rat when I go home to my husband? And just because these women are nice outside of work, doesn't make them respectable, intelligent, stupid, trashy or any other adjective.

It makes them nice.

Which is not the topic at hand.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:10 am
Bella Dea wrote:

What?

All I'm saying is respectable, intelligent women don't f*ck strangers for $300.

I disagree. I see nothing unintelligent or disrespectable in fücking strangers for $300.

Bella Dea wrote:
At least not within my definition of respectable and intelligent. What's your definition?

To me, everyone is respectable unless they betray, injure, kill, or steal from other people. Married husbands who sleep with prostitutes may be disrespectable because they betray their wives. But I see nothing disrespectable about the prostitutes they sleep with, or with prostitution as a profession.

Concerning your point about intelligence, I'll go with Webster's definition 1a and 2 of the term 'intelligence': "the ability to learn or understand or to deal with new or trying situations : REASON; also : the skilled use of reason (2) : the ability to apply knowledge to manipulate one's environment or to think abstractly as measured by objective criteria (as tests)" Sleeping with strangers does neither reduces, nor indicates a loss of, "the ability to learn or understand or to deal with new or trying situations". It neither impedes, nor indicates a disability, to use reason in a skilled way. It neither impedes, nor indicates a lack of, "the ability to apply knowledge to manipulate ones environment ...." Therefore, it tells us nothing about your intelligence if we know whether or not you're sleeping with strangers for $300.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:11 am
Thomas wrote:
Bella Dea wrote:

What?

All I'm saying is respectable, intelligent women don't f*ck strangers for $300.

I disagree. I see nothing unintelligent or disrespectable in fücking strangers for $300.


Given that they could get far more than $300, i'd say it was pretty "unintelligent."
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:13 am
Setanta wrote:
Given that they could get far more than $300, i'd say it was pretty "unintelligent."

Could be true -- I'm not well informed about American prices.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:34 am
Thomas wrote:
Bella Dea wrote:

What?

All I'm saying is respectable, intelligent women don't f*ck strangers for $300.

I disagree. I see nothing unintelligent or disrespectable in fücking strangers for $300.

Bella Dea wrote:
At least not within my definition of respectable and intelligent. What's your definition?

To me, everyone is respectable unless they betray, injure, kill, or steal from other people. Married husbands who sleep with prostitutes may be disrespectable because they betray their wives. But I see nothing disrespectable about the prostitutes they sleep with, or with prostitution as a profession.

Concerning your point about intelligence, I'll go with Webster's definition 1a and 2 of the term 'intelligence'.......


I am jealous of your little dots about your u....

Anyway, I guess I have to retract my intelligent statment. However, I won't retract my respectable statement.

Sleeping with someone for money in a seedy back room doesn't show me that you have much respect for yourself....and you know damn well the guys don't have any respect for the woman doing it.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:39 am
Oh and again, these views are strictly American.

I have no idea what your strippers are like (that sounds weird).

I just know what the ones here are like. And what kinds of women are generally strippers.
0 Replies
 
Chai
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:39 am
Slappy Doo Hoo wrote:
joefromchicago wrote:
Wilso wrote:
I used to know a sex worker who is a registered nurse. She'd spend two days a week doing volunteer work with autistic children.

Maybe that's how Slappy got to know her.


That was a good one.

Speaking of, this thread is retarded. Let's all pretend to agree strippers are actually just a normal sample of society, and as a whole are not coke headed whores who didn't receive enough hugs from daddy.


Oh no slappy, because then no one could act all sophisticated about it.

actually what's been said is actually proving (to me) my point about "call it dancing and it's alright"...all this talk is just cover up for justifying that some want to use women for wank material.

Talking about lust and gluttony and such being desireable traits?

There's a difference, and a big one, between Lust and healthy desire. Same with gluttony and wanting to experience fullness.

Same as for being a Prude and desiring a healthy privacy of one's body.

I really see no need to explain that, surely that is self evident.

Bella, I am glad you showed up this morning. Not so much for support, although that's nice, but to give a more balanced view.

It's natural for the people who are gaining something from objectifying someone over their sexual parts to want to make it all right. It's fair for those who are the ones made to feel like objects to speak also.

Comparing a cashier to a stripper as far as objectification is laughable joe, broken or not. Again, that is something that is not worth explaining.

Moving on...I was surprised...I was googling something like self esteem and strippers (I'll find the link in a while) about the business in Las Vegas....it actually mentioned something about "elevating their title to dancer" in order to basically make it more legitimate.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:42 am
Prostitution was not "created" as a dream job. It was created because those women had no other way.
It was never meant to be a respectable job.

Stripping is a glorified and less skanky form of prostitution. And most women don't do it because they enjoy it. And if they say they do, they are probably lying. Most women don't like being viewed as just tits and ass. At least the ones who have any respect for themselves.

It's like the guy who says he likes cleaning toilets. He "likes" cleaning toilets because that's the only thing he CAN do and it sure beats digging through dumpsters.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 07:48 am
Bella Dea wrote:
Sleeping with someone for money in a seedy back room doesn't show me that you have much respect for yourself.

How about sleeping with someone for money in an elegant hotel? Does the "scene of the crime" make any difference to you?

Bella Dea wrote:
...and you know damn well the guys don't have any respect for the woman doing it.

No, I don't know that. That's why, until proven otherwise, I presume that the guys and the girls have the same customer-client relationship as they would in any other profession. Mind you, this is a presumption, not a confident claim about how the world works. But it'll take evidence, not unsubstantiated assertions, to change my mind.

Bella Dea wrote:
Prostitution was not "created" as a dream job. It was created because those women had no other way. It was never meant to be a respectable job.

I don't know that prostitution was created at all. It seems more likely to me that it happened spontaneously: Some people like sex enough to pay for it. Other people like money enough to have sex for it. The rest is supply, demand, prices, and markets.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 08:04 am
Thomas wrote:
Bella Dea wrote:
Sleeping with someone for money in a seedy back room doesn't show me that you have much respect for yourself.

How about sleeping with someone for money in an elegant hotel? Does the "scene of the crime" make any difference to you?


Yeah. It does. It shouldn't but it does. Saying "I'm only worth $300 for a good screw" versus "I'm worth more than you can afford for a good screw" says something. Maybe not something nice but it says something about how much you value yourself.

Quote:

Bella Dea wrote:
...and you know damn well the guys don't have any respect for the woman doing it.

No, I don't know that. That's why, until proven otherwise, I presume that the guys and the girls have the same customer-client relationship as they would in any other profession. Mind you, this is a presumption, not a confident claim about how the world works. But it'll take evidence, not unsubstantiated assertions, to change my mind.


Are you kidding? I'd like one guy to come forward and say he goes to strip clubs because he respects the women there. I'll bet that's what ever guy says when he's sitting in the Champagne Room..."boy, I really respect you...now get on my dick". Rolling Eyes


Quote:

Bella Dea wrote:
Prostitution was not "created" as a dream job. It was created because those women had no other way. It was never meant to be a respectable job.

I don't know that prostitution was created at all. It seems more likely to me that it happened spontaneously: Some people like sex enough to pay for it. Other people like money enough to have sex for it. The rest is supply, demand, prices, and markets.


Some woman had to decide one day that it was profitable to sell herself for money. So yes, it was created somewhere by someone.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 08:11 am
Bella Dea wrote:
]Yeah. It does. It shouldn't but it does. Saying "I'm only worth $300 for a good screw" versus "I'm worth more than you can afford for a good screw" says something. Maybe not something nice but it says something about how much you value yourself.

I don't see how you get from my "sleeping with someone for money in an elegand hotel" to "I'm worth more than you can afford for a good screw". Maybe the customer can afford both a good screw and a nice hotel?

Bella Dea wrote:
Are you kidding? I'd like one guy to come forward and say he goes to strip clubs because he respects the women there. I'll bet that's what ever guy says when he's sitting in the Champagne Room..."boy, I really respect you...now get on my dick". Rolling Eyes

Why is this more unlikely than telling a massage therapist "boy, I really respect you... now relieve that back muscle tension."? I don't see why it's any more unlikely at all. Different muscle, same relief.
0 Replies
 
Miller
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 08:15 am
Profits from Chicago Prostitution:

People & Events: Minna (1878-1948), Ada Lester (1876-1960), and the Everleigh Club

Ada Lester (1866-1960) and Minna (1878-1948) Jane Addams wrote of the turn of the twentieth century, "Never before in civilization have such numbers of young girls been suddenly released from the protection of the home and permitted to walk unattended upon the city streets and to work under alien roofs." Addams found it difficult to occupy herself, but she had an education and supportive parents to fall back on. Many young women found they had only one thing to sell -- themselves. Prostitution was not illegal in America, and it became a common profession for young women coming into Chicago. In a very few cases, women were able to use the commerce of sex to their advantage.

Ada and Minna Lester were sisters born in Virginia, in 1876 and 1878. They told biographers that they had been to finishing school and had proper social debuts. After two failed marriages, and the death of their father, the sisters took their $35,000 inheritance and opened a house of prostitution in Omaha, Nebraska. As madams, they took the new surname "Everleigh," adapted from their grandmother's correspondence ("Everly Yours," she would sign). In a year, they had doubled their money and were looking for a new location. Chicago was where the money was.

They bought a brothel at 2131 Dearborn Street, fired all the women and completely redecorated the entire building with the most luxurious appointments available. Silk curtains, damask easy chairs, oriental rugs, mahogany tables, gold rimmed china and silver dinner ware, perfumed fountains in every room, a $15,000 gold-leafed piano for the Music Room, mirrored ceilings, a library filled with finely bound volumes, an art gallery featuring nudes in gold frames -- no expense was spared. While the heavyweight boxer Jack Johnson thought the $57 gold spittoons in his café were worth boasting about, the patrons of the Everleigh Club were obliged to expectorate in $650 gold cuspidors.

Enterance to hall of 2133 From the Everleigh Club Illustrated pub. 1909 Gourmet meals featured iced clam juice, caviar, pheasants, ducks, geese, artichokes, lobster, fried oysters, devilled crabs, pecans and bonbons. Musicians played constantly, usually on the piano accompanied by strings. Publishing houses would publicize new songs by having them played at the Everleigh Club. The house was heated with steam in the winter and cooled with electric fans in the summer.

The Everleigh sisters had standards for their employees. "To get in, a girl must have a pretty face and figure, must be in perfect health and must look well in evening clothes." The sisters provided training: "Be polite and forget what you are here for. Gentlemen are only gentlemen when properly introduced.... The Everleigh Club is not for the rough element, the clerk on a holiday or a man without a check book."

Japanese Parlor at Everleigh House Certainly not at their prices. When Everleigh House opened, admission was $10, dinner was $50, a bottle of champagne $12, and then, if you wanted to spend private time with one of the girls, it was another $50. The prices only went up from there, until it was difficult for a caller to leave without spending at least $200. This while a decent working wage was $6 a week. The sisters determined that their girls should work less but for more money, and sell as much wine and food as they did sex. After all, "Contemplation of devilment was more satisfactory than the act itself."

Harrison, Carter H. portrait photograph - Mosher, C D. 1829 - 1897 cabinet card - digital collection In 1911, after a vice commission report, Mayor Carter Harrison Jr., son of legendary Mayor Carter Harrison, ordered the club closed. Minna responded philosophically, "If the Mayor says we must close, that settles it.... I'll close up shop and walk out with a smile on my face." And so they did.

Ada was 35 years old, Minna 33. They took a trip to Europe. With $1,000,000 in cash, $200,000 in jewelry and a $15,000 gold piano, they returned to New York, changed their names back to Lester, and spent the rest of their days going to the theater and hosting poetry reading circles. Minna died in 1948, Ada in 1960.

Minna, the outspoken one, said, "If it weren't for married men, we couldn't have carried on at all, and if it weren't for cheating married women we could have made another million."

Although the Everleigh sisters and their employees earned good money in luxurious circumstances, most prostitutes worked in very different situations.

White slavers would bring teenage girls to Chicago where they would be repeatedly raped before being sold to a brothel. In 1907, an 18-year-old reported that she had been drugged and raped continuously for three days before she was sold for $50, the cost of a meal at Everleigh House.

Many whores worked for 25 cents at a time. Others were shop girls or factory workers who worked a few nights a week to pay their bills or to buy a few luxuries. The Everleigh sisters were savvy and lucky. Most others were not.

www.pbs.org
0 Replies
 
Miller
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 08:17 am
Quote:
Minna, the outspoken one, said, "If it weren't for married men, we couldn't have carried on at all, and if it weren't for cheating married women we could have made another million."


There's more money in illegal as opposed to legal prostitution, or so it seems.
0 Replies
 
Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2007 08:18 am
Thomas wrote:
Here you go, Ragman (Found with a simple search for "cjhsa".)


Thanks, Thomas (I think). While I did the search I still somehow missed it. I feel sad to see it actually. It' all so tedious when there's just no reason for that comment. Just one more example of sick racist/anti-Jewish crap.
0 Replies
 
 

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