affair

trfirst, is he guilty about leaving his children or leaving his soon to be ex-wife also ? Has he been open about his feelings towards her ? I would continue seeing the counselor but I think I would also just pull back. If he is unsure about his feelings towards her yet then I would for sure pull back. He's being really selfish and you deserve so much more. I would let him know. I know you are worried that it will look like you are not supporting him but seriously enough is enough. You "have" supported him but there is also a point when he needs to realize how much you have already sacrificed for him and he should "Thank you" and start acting like a responsible adult. This is my view.

I guess right now I don't know if its guilt for the kids or her, all along he has said he feels guilty for the kids but since the accident he told me that maybe god was sending him a message that he made a mistake and was giving him a second chance since no one was hurt. I am trying to back away in my own way, I don't call him or email him I am letting him make the moves. I told him his happiness was more important to me than anything besides my kids. So if he thinks that happiness is going back home then he needs to do that or at least look at it and talk to his ex. I can only hope he goes to counseling as well because he is very mixed up right now.

trfirst--

Is he doing anything right now for those kids of his--the kids who just survived an accident? Or is he just feeling "guilty" but taking no action?

This is the way he treats you. Does he treat his children differently?
Would he be likely to change just to make you happy?

This sounds bad, but the accident didn't happen "for a reason". That's nonsense thinking, but it's a good excuse to use if your not sure of what you want to do. For sure he needs counseling. I think he has treated you very unfairly. You know the old saying "if you love something set it free, if it comes back it was yours, if not it never was". I would just cut it off for a while. Give yourself a time period. Tell him he needs to think and you will stay out of the picture for some time being so his thoughts are clear. Then he will either miss you... since he's been without and realize he should continue with you, or be prepared if he doesn't. Right now he is missing and feeling guilty over his ex since she's not in his life. He can't be missing you since your their for him everytime he calls, visits, emails, etc. He doesn't know what it's like without you but he knows what it's like without them. Do you know what I am saying ? It takes strength but I personally think that's the best thing to do. If he loved you he would honor your wishes and understand this is for him. Just some FYI.

I think trfirst will have to get more fed up and achieve some distance before she really hears all of us. One's heart seems so clear a notice to one's mind. Our view of ourselves and our roles is hard to break into, and I suppose that is often a good thing, in terms of natural biological survival.

A lot of time can go by, though, without getting emotional sustenance, while one is being the thoughtful lover. It gets to be - somewhat - that the decision revolves around who you think you are; for example, the kindly loving forebearing one.

My own view is get away. Go have a life. Perhaps he'll find you. Or you may meet someone who does treasure you. Even if not, you'll be acting to develop yourself.

He is suppose to go on a trip with his kids Thursday for a week, I believe I will tell him to not worry about calling me while he is gone and to give this time away to think about what he wants.

trfirst--

Good idea. Uninterrupted time with the children he loves so much should be illumninating for everyone concerned.

I agree. That will also give you time to reflect. I also agree with occobusco, you will have to get to the point were you just had it. Your not there yet. You'd know if you were. Good luck !!! It's hard, I know !

Well he went to the counseling session. The counselor feels his guilt is coming from not being comfortable with his decision to leave his marriage, that he still has a lot of unanswered questions. He is going to talk with his wife tonight and see what they have left together not including finances the house or even the kids just what do they have left between the two of them. As much as this hurts me and believe me it does I haven't stopped crying all day but I also have to be big enough to understand we could never have a true healthy relationship until he knows in his heart he is doing the right thing. There is a part of me that would love to tell him not to try again and just love me but that is the wrong thing to do and I know this. I told him there is always a bond in the first marriage especially when there are kids involved, my ex and I will always have a bond because of our past and the kids but I know that bond holds no future and he needs to know that with her. I am trying very hard to be supportive and not show a lot of emotion to him so he doesn't feel guilty for my hurt, but my god what a hard day today. Well I have been through many disapointments in my life and made it I will make it through this as well. Thanks to everyone for caring enough to reply when you don't even know me and even when you felt I may not want to hear what you have to say.

Trifirst--

Beginning of a beginning? Beginning of an ending? Who knows?



Why are you treating this guy like a fragile little boy? Why shouldn't he feel guilty for your hurt?

He sees himself as anguished and torn.

Outsiders see him as a selfish SOB.

Do you really want a man who has to be protected from the results of his own actions?

We talked last night and he spoke with his wife, he is going to try and make it work with her. He is probably doing the right thing so he can either move on with her or put it in the past. I myself am sick to my stomach I just can't imagine never seeing him again or talking to him. I have never in my life through divorce or my mother's passing vomitted and I have vomitted 3 times last night, this is much harder than I thought it would ever be.

trfirst--


Last night did he tell you, "Thank you so much for helping me through a painful time in my life. I feel really miserable and low down that in our relationship I have been the taker and not the giver. You have helped me see my life clearly and I am a better person for having known you?"

I bet not. I bet he told you how anguished he was about being forced to choose between two women and how hard this was for him.

All the same, learning about love can be hard, hard, hard.

Stay strong.

He better of said how much he appreciated you for being supportive. You should be honest and let him see how painful this is to you. What a truly SELFISH person he is ! I am so sorry. It's hard to see since your on the inside and it's all fresh. In a few years you will see how much better you are without someone like him who takes and takes and never gives. You will be glad your not with him. How selfish. He should of never gotten envolved or lead you on if he had doubts. How dare he ! Sorry, I'm just pissed off. That's just WRONG ! You deserve so much better then this !
That's all I am saying.

{{{{trfirst}}}}

You most certainly deserve better than what this man has given you. It's hard, but it will get better.

Take gentle care of yourself.

He called last night, my phone was off so he left a message. He wanted to see how I was doing and he was thinking about me. I called back left a message and told him not to worry about me, that I was terribly hurt by all this but I am going to my counselor today to help me see what this whole thing was really about. He told me he was sorry for ruining my life because of the rumors, I told him to not give that a second thought because there is a big world out there and I will not let a few shallow people from the Elks ruin my life. I did tell him that him not saying he loves me tells me everything and I need to open my eyes and move on from this. I sound really strong don't I but honestly this is killing me, I can't even explain the pain I feel, I want so bad for it to go away. I have always been a strong person and able to move on just fine, but I am having a really tough time with this one. I truly thought I found my soul mate, I can tell you this I have no plans on getting involved with anyone until my kids are raised anyway.

trfirst--

I'm guessing that part of your anguish is coming from trying to believe two incompatable concepts at the same time.

Unless you are a lousy, rotten person, your ex-lover cannot be both a Soulmate and a lazy, manipulating SOB. He used you. He abused you. He discarded you.

He doesn't care how you are doing any more than he cared for your feelings during the affair. His call was to mitigate his "guilt" (and perhaps to relish the last few embers of his little fling). He wasn't interested in your pain and anguish while your affair was going on and he's not particularly interested now.



A "few shallow people from the Elks"? Remember? He allowed them to blame you. He gets to reconcile with his wife and look like a redeemed sinner. You get to carry the reputation of "homewrecker".

He is "sorry". Wonderful. You are in pain because of his actions. Not so wonderful.

Not only are you juggling the Lover As Soulmate and Lover as Selfish SOB, you're facing the fact that the love, patience and understanding that you invested in this man were a waste of time and energy.

Everyone has moments of being a damn fool. You realize your folly, and comprehend the nature and complications of your folly and then you move on.

If he's such a wonderful guy, you must be the bitch and homewrecker and he was right to leave you. Of course this line of reasoning creates unbearable anguish in your psyche.

Stop forgiving him and get on with the business of forgiving yourself.

Hang in there.

He did only call to make his guilt feel alittle better. I think you did/said the right thing. I think for him to hear your strong and moving on and make him accountable for what he put you through is the best. I am sure he will try to contact you from time to time to keep this going. You just be strong. I know it's hard. You can't eat, sleep, feel sick to your stomach. It's really hard. Been there, did it, done it. I am not the first to tell you it does get easier. Let yourself feel bad, get it all out. Don't for a minute think you did the wrong thing, if you would of done this - this would of happened mayber, or if you did that... He was a user, and when he drained all your energy he moved on. Like I said before, you will look back at this and see the true light. It will come to you one day and smack you in the face and you'll say to yourself "What the Hell was I so into that SOB for? What a jerk" (I call it the pissed off stage) The who in the heck ( I of course use much stronger words then these, but you have the idea) do you think you are, how dare you do that to me you $&%^# ! " You'll get there. Trust me.

After reading this thread from beginning to end it has made me realize that love or psuedo love (as if it was real love, he wouldn't have treated you so wrongly and the way he did) blinds us all, regardless of age or gender.

Additionally, your struggles don't appear to necessarily subside as you age or become older. I thought that your 40s would be the prime of your life, with your establishment of your career, children, and generally direction in life, but it appears my conclusions are a bit skewed.

My only question is how do you avoid yourself of these things? Since love is blind and the actuality of the situation to you isn't necessarily the real actuality. *Sigh* Life...

Don't lose hope Borealis, there is true love out there.
It might not come at the age you wish for, but as they say:
better late than never!

You are always so optimistic. How do you maintain such a level of character? I look at the world so negatively sometimes. It's not that I purposely want to but rather it has become a natural functioning.

Also, it would be so nice if we could just have a little erase button everytime we encounter traumatic events or turmoil. I know it's not realistic and is rather a sheltered existence as your capacity for happiness is a functioning of your capacity for misery. You may never mature since these experience evolve you as a person--but still!