"the whole time I'll be wondering if he's thinking about a girl that he's seen in a movie"
I'm wondering, how many men are wondering if their wives are not secretly thinking of Mel Gibson when they make love?
And if it's just a few, is it because women don't ever occasionally drift off in thought about, like, Mel Gibson or Rudolph Valentino or that hunk they saw in the street today when they get groovin'? Yeah, right.
So why then? Why do men not care, apparently, as much (just happy that she's getting all in to it in the first place?) - or decide to brush their insecurities aside? Why is it such a bigger issue for so many women? Not talking about any pathetic over-use of hard porn, but simply about the "if he's thinking of / looking at someone else, he's hurting me and he shouldn't be with me" thing.
Would be interesting questions to consider, before battling anything out with each other, imho ...
Wed 22 Sep, 2004 10:54 pm
don't give a damn
I honestly don't care if my husband is thinking about someone else when we have sex or any other time . . . I just don't want to know about it. When married men are into porn I think it lets the woman know that you aren't the only thing that he wants in his head or on his mind. I think it's disrespectful. Sure, everyone has fantasies but you don't need to have them expressed visually. I think in the case of pornography vs. wives it is an out of sight out of mind situation. If you don't see that he's looking at other woman then it doesn't worry you as much because you have no way to judge his thoughts.
Btw, I'm right beside you ChArMed, and I think I'll use that excuse when I divorce my husband over lying to me about looking at porn. It's not something that I will allow myself to live with for the rest of my life . . . the lying or the porn. From all of the posts related to this subject that I have seen on this site we should start a club for wives whos marriages were ruined by porn. Keep me posted on how everything goes hun. When I check my husband's computer in a month, if I find any porn on it I'll be packing my bags and sending him divorce papers.
Good luck to every other woman dealing with this problem. I know there are alot of you out there.
Thu 23 Sep, 2004 01:57 am
i have to disagree with all of you...
the reason men become secretive is due to a nagging wife
Wed 13 Oct, 2004 08:01 am
Here is what is happening at my home. My boyfirend (soon to be husband) looks at internet porn. He is on there in the mornings before and even at night after I go to bed. He sets the alarm clock just to get up early so he can look at the porn. When I am at home and walk in the room, he always minimizes the screen and when I walk away, I can here the mouse clicking like crazy to delete what he was looking at before I come back over to the computer. Anytime I ask him about it, he gets really angry and tells me to quit snooping that he is a grown man and nobody will tell him what to do. This has really hurt me. The thing that has hurt me the most is when I walk over to the computer when he is on it, to give him a simple kiss or hug and he clicks the porn off the screen (after I have seen the reflection of it in the window), and he has an erection. This makes me feel like I am not enough for him. That he has to resort to nasty porn girls (and sometimes guys). Our computer was down for 2 weeks and our relationship was better almost overnight. He was more observant of me and wanted to spend more time with me. Well now as you see, we are back online and it's back to the same thing. Sometimes I go to bed crying thinking well I guess he would rather be looking at porn than being in bed with the one who he claims he loves. Am I over reacting? Is this a phase that will pass or get worse and lead to actual sexual things?
That's a terrible situation safire, and no you're not overreacting ...
That is a lot of time to be turning away from you and hiding things. It certainly sounds obsessive.
Is he unhappy or uncomfortable in his current life in general, do you feel? Just asking cause it sounds like such massive escapism ... though it also sounds like some sexual obsession ...
In any case I can just imagine how unnerved you must feel.
Wed 13 Oct, 2004 08:45 am
All of these posts have one thing in common: The husband or boyfriend is lying about the porn or hiding it. Please please please please please realize that the problems you are expressing are not about the porn! They are about the lying and the deception. Your relationships are not being ruined by porn! They are being ruined by deception!!
Wed 13 Oct, 2004 08:45 am
My sympathy, safire. How lonely & confused you must feel.
Wed 13 Oct, 2004 08:48 am
All right All right...I think we realized it 300 posts ago. Now let's help safire bring the addiction to a confrontation like they do in AA and NA so she can get on with her life.
Wed 13 Oct, 2004 11:07 am
Re: porn hurts
My boyfirend (soon to be husband) looks at internet porn. He is on there in the mornings before and even at night after I go to bed. He sets the alarm clock just to get up early so he can look at the porn.
There is nothing wrong with good clean (no underage models) porn in moderation (moderation is a vague term but lets pretend we are all on the same page) however he is addicted to porn. And, like any other addiction he is addicted for life. It is now a question of him willing to admit to himself and to you that he has a problem and that he is willing to get help for controlling this problem. Something tells me this will not happen.
When I am at home and walk in the room, he always minimizes the screen and when I walk away, I can here the mouse clicking like crazy to delete what he was looking at before I come back over to the computer. Anytime I ask him about it, he gets really angry and tells me to quit snooping that he is a grown man and nobody will tell him what to do.
I see several dynamics occurring here. 1. He is secretive which means he is willing to do things behind your back. 2. He is disrespectful to you. Yes he may be a grown man who has the right to do what he wants to do however one day he will be bound to you by vows. Is he willing to be loyal to those vows or is he "a grown man and nobody will tell him what to do." 3. He is not sensitive to your feelings. He may be in love with you however he does not love you. There is a difference. A man who loves his lady would be sensitive to her feelings.
The thing that has hurt me the most is when I walk over to the computer when he is on it, to give him a simple kiss or hug and he clicks the porn off the screen (after I have seen the reflection of it in the window), and he has an erection. This makes me feel like I am not enough for him. That he has to resort to nasty porn girls (and sometimes guys).
He is obviously very turned on with porn and is not likely to easily give it up. He is also inclined to be bisexual. I am straight however I have known gays and I have noticed one thing about them. They are very promiscuous. I know it is a stereotype and not all gays fit this mold however most do. Stereotypes exist because there is some truth to them. It is likely that he may not see cheating on you with another man as cheating on you or at the very least see it as a lesser cheating act. The other problem is disease. And, although HIV is a scary thought a lot of people overlook hepatitus especially the C strain. This is the incurable and deadly one. It is also highly contagious. Has he been checked for HIV, hepatitus C, and other venereal diseases? How about you?
Our computer was down for 2 weeks and our relationship was better almost overnight. He was more observant of me and wanted to spend more time with me. Well now as you see, we are back online and it's back to the same thing.
I am one step ahead of you on this. Getting rid of the computer will not help. Although he appeared to cool it for a few weeks while his computer was down how do you know he didn't pick up any pornographic materials to "read" or spend time at one of those porn shops with movie arcades?
Am I over reacting? Is this a phase that will pass or get worse and lead to actual sexual things?
You are under-reacting. Knowing all of this you still sound like you intend on marrying this man. As far as it being a phase it is highly unlikely. Yes this may taper off over the years however will this be due to his lebido also tapering off? What is left for you years down the road after he puts this down? How do you know if his addiction with sex has reached its plateau? It may be that his addiction to porn is only a gateway to something even more serious. Are you sure this is the man you want to spend the rest of your life with?
Sun 17 Oct, 2004 08:21 pm
Well folks I have read this forum and the others like it. I am another person in a similar situation. It is driving me nuts. I don't regularly look at my boyfriends history on his computer but i came across this issue when i was ill and had taken to wearing ear plugs and mask to bed. Yet while ill, while he thought i was asleep. yep! out came the women of endless material. We talked he was shifty. The next time i found out accidently. long story but simple scroll down on google. I have my own PC so i don't often have to use his but after that i so found an excuse or two to use it, justifying it to myself. He was simply embarrassed and i spent time explaining that I wasn't bothered by the women it was the secrecy the fact I wasn't included, that if he couldn't talk to me about something so insignificant what will happen when we have a real sex problem, what if i got cancer and had to lose a boob? What if he lost his mojo? I explained I understood 'curious porn' and i didn't want to to know about that ..i wanted simply for us to have a relationship where each knew the other mastibated but we were cool with it..i admitted occassionally i like to look myself so perhaps we needed to address spicing up the sex (although he insisted it was great and the porn was a private thing)and that after seeing what i saw him look at, perhaps he should write to some of the sites as the download times where very ****, and complain about the pop ups. I also made the point that I wasn't always going to be happy and would try to get used to it, as I had never known anyone to see it so much. I joked about it but inside i was gutted I thought we had it perfect ! . I explained I didn't want to be a part of it all. Just sometimes with baby oil and candles ... this works well every now and then, but.. now and again i get insecure about what i'm doing wonder if i'm handling it right and check his history. He knows I think and shamefully thats whats destroying me, two way deceit something i hate. In total I have looked 3 times in just over a month.
I'm at the beginning of the journey. I have to fight the urge 'to know' what he's been looking at. I've asked him to delete all history so i don't always know.
WHY? i'm scared. really scared because as much as i love him i know he won't stop. ever. I trust him. He trusts me. We have a great time together and although he said if it upset me he would stop. I couldn't agree to that as I know the reality is I would force him into lying. So I'm trying something else. To be sensible. Not make it seem brilliant and dirty. Just make it sound fine but not everyday thanks. If I'm tired I say go and let the media girls 'save me a job' i'm hoping this will make him think they are second best and it will lose a bit of the excitement, make him feel he has to use them because i'm not interested enough in him, that its my choice. well hell it makes me feel better.
I don't like it but these days I know few guys who i trust don't do it. very few. I tried competing with the bloody women'[s huge boobs but I can't - I know I can see other guys if I want to and to be honest I'm thinking about it. Only as I know perhaps the problem may be worse in later years. **** what if technology gets so good they havee 3d downloads and hollygrams??? can u imagine? I mean the viruses he computer gets means he's and expert at removing them.
The good things that have come from it are well, I'm not embarassed to go on the net and use it myself on my own. The trouble I find is there aren't any sites directed at straight women that have the balance right between good looking hunks (not greasy twats!) that if he checked my history he could get a bit stressed or feel a little uncomfortable with. (quick download times please and free).
I think he is going on less. I am more aware to bonk more randomly like we used to.
I am gradually not obbessing about it so much.
The sad side is: I know he loves me, however I think he is losing out on me and my mind is harder towards him. Before I would make every effort be there all the time and fit my job around him including my days off. Now I am stopping i feel it. I feel sad about it but I am only human and it wears u down, even though i wouldn't mind if it was now and again, and which ever way I try to see it, I get less sex than i used to, when i worked less - so its going to the media girls. Thats not a good pill to swollow. I felt myself getting hardened to him. I want to adore him but its hard. I hate this. we used to bonk lots. I used to be very happy with things.However I am trying 100% till the end of jan05 and then if I think he hasn't made an effort with us as much as I am: from quick F 'ing to making love by then. I will leave. Everyone deserves a chance and I would never ask him to stop completely but less is more for me!!
I watched my mum wait for my dad to change for 25years after every hint and he just got lazier (not to do with porn it was an attitude thing).
Porn is the mans lazy wank. They do become desensitised to things and I know i am a sexy woman. I realise everytime I go out, everyday, and I am lucky. I make my mans life as easy as i can as that is my feeling on relationships, you do as much as u can to make the other one happy.
But since this?
I started backing off. he had too much time on his hands so now I'm doing less (he's a student and i work full time). I do my stuff. He can wash and his fold his own clothes and do more house work so i'm less tired and more ready for sex (once i thought perhaps my tiredness drove him here) and flirting and going out. I want the good stuff.
It would be nice if I had hours to satisfy myself everyday whatever my whim!
But I don't.
So i'm saving just incase. I'm looking after him and then re-address the balance in Jan. I am human and every now and again i'll feel hurt, everynow and again the pain is crap as i think i wonder if we didn't do it today because he looked at porn. Every now and again i laugh about it, and sometimes i watch some and do it myself and it reminds me he's human too. Just a bit too curious.
Sun 17 Oct, 2004 08:44 pm
Re: hum hum
he had too much time on his hands
thats not the only thing in his hands
Mon 18 Oct, 2004 03:53 am
hee hee i know what u mean.
Well today i'm working till 8 so i guess he'll be at it again today.
Thu 21 Oct, 2004 10:02 pm
This is so depressing.
This is so depressing. Now that I realize how wide-spread this is, it really gives me no hope. I can't handle it anymore. I've only read a couple of pages so far, but it really is making me sad. This is exactly what I go through every couple of months. I go along believing that he will stop, that he will not look at any porn except the stuff that we made with eachother. I finally get to the point where I feel like I trust him. It always happens this way; I feel really confident about our relationship, then bam, I find some crap on his computer. It absolutely crushes me. I feel so betrayed, and degraded. You have to understand that I've tried to make concessions. I understand that he might need to be visually stimulated. He says to me that the images remind him of things that we do, and then he is able to pleasure himself. This leads me to believe that if he were to see images of me, then it would allow him to pleasure himself when I am not around, or even with me, as a mutual kind of thing. Of course when I find out that it is apparently not enough, then I feel absolutely horrible and stupid. I can see that I am rambling. I'm sorry. Basically this has gone on for a couple of years now. For some stupid reason I keep allowing myself to be dragged back into believing him. Now though, I realize that I can not delude myself anymore. It's come to the time where I have to accept the fact that he feels such a strong need to, or not continue on in this relationship. I don't want to end the relationship. I know that he loves me. I know that he understands how I feel, and that when we hash it out, he really does stop for a couple of months, because it kills him to hurt me. But he has admitted that it is like an addiction. He says that after awhile it just gets to him. Seeing all these posts is really bringing the point home. I guess that he really is addicted, and I can sort of understand addiction, as I've been exposed to addiction before. I just wonder if I can stand what looks to be a long road of trying to treat his addiction. I'm getting that there are ways to help, but can we really go the distance and maintain a relationship where there is such a painful issue between us?
Fri 22 Oct, 2004 01:53 pm
I know how you feel. I have taken a new step I talked again to my man about it last night, I explained about this forum (not which one!), I said how so many women feel the same and how since the first time I saw him I have to really try to stop myself snooping. He said that he would give it up and I said that I knew reality was he couldn't completely but I would appreciate if he cut down rather than lie, (at the mo he's not doing it alot compared to others on this site) I explained how women feel that its fun to a point, that once they feel it interfers with their sex life, finances and/or quality time with their lover and of course the trust side and being sneaky that we feel deflated and I explained my wall goes up and I feel that i don't want him at all. He was visually saddened and said he had also thought about it and how it was clearly upsetting me which he hated. He said he wanted to work through it and that I should remember he's looking at the sex and not the actual women. I said 'you know how u feel when i say cor brad pitt is sooooo yummy' (he gets a bit funny and even didn't like me having him as my background on the pc - he replaced it with his bum once!) yes he said see you do something similar ... but you honestly hate it? and he admitted he did and then he said I see where you are going and I can see it must hurt. how would he feel if i touched my self (actions here girls as men are visual) and he was mych more receptive to listen. We haven't finished talking about it. But before i went to work he said if i wanted he would tell me when he has done it (yes i'd add 10%!!) I said no but if I ask and you have please don't lie. I hate the sneaking) I said can he cover his tracks well as well so i don't get a sudden shock because not finding anything means i'm less tempted to look and more likely to build trust up again. I explained when I think media girls are getting my willy i think well if u are allowed visual simulation to feel good then I should be allowed mental conversation with hansom men to stimulate me - and so want to go out to flirt a bit but not do anything more! Because lets face it thats what the men are saying that they aren't naturally manogomus ... well hell neither are we! shook him up a bit me thinks...also i said well if u want i can get a vibrator for when u work late? anyway came home today and he's folded all my clothes up and done the washing! ha ha... anyway will keep you posted. Its his birthday soon so am going to get naughty undies and lots of saucy things and let him download porn to watch together .... what you think?
Fri 22 Oct, 2004 03:26 pm
i think keeping it open honest and fun is the best policy and the only way if you want a succesful relationship
getting all serious and jealous and negative like many others do is the sure way to doom and an unhappy ending
i think if it is possible to change him, then you will only do it through loving him the way he is...
what you are doing having an honest and open and reasonable discussion without accusation is definatley the way forward putting him in your position and asking him how he would like it is also a great idea
for his birthday id ask him what he wants, i wouldnt do anything to surprise him too much...
keep talking, communication is the universal solvent...
sometimes reality and fantasy are best kept apart
Fri 22 Oct, 2004 06:36 pm
Open and Honest Relationship
I agree that having an open and honest relationship is the way to go. I told my boyfriend that obviously I couldn't go on deluding myself that he would actually stop completely. Going on with that belief just hurts both of us. I told him that I would definately prefer he did not, that he use some of the other ways to pleasure himself; but I also knew that eventually he would do it again. I asked him to let me know about times that he ends up looking at porn. (besides our stuff) I didn't want to know details or anything. Just that I wanted to know when it happened, and to talk to him about how it doesn't mean he doesn't love me. That he is attracted to me, and that he really cares about me. What I'm hoping will happen, is that it will allow me to become more comfortable with it, and to alleviate the shock of discovery on my own. Also that when he gets to the point where he cannot stop the desire to look at porn, we can work on doing things to spice up our sex life. Give him the extra excitement that was perhaps waning at that time, and causing the urge to look at porn again. Communication is a wonderful thing. We've become better at communication in other aspects of our lives, and it has made things a whole lot better. I'm hoping that communication will help with this as well.
As for your situation, I'm glad that talking has helped and that things are getting better. You should totally do some spicy stuff for his birthday. Although, perhaps asking him about what he wants is good advice as it will be tailored to his tastes, and create some nice anticipation for him.
I'm glad for you that he has some understanding of how it makes you feel. My guy definately understands my feelings on it, and I think that we can probably work this through. I guess it just takes time, and some work. But I guess that's true with all relationships.
Sat 23 Oct, 2004 06:06 am
Hey guess what I'm another in the same situation
Hey guess what I'm another in the same situation my boyfriend is a porn addict but won't admit it. For as long as I've known him hes watched porn, read porn you name it, and like most of the other posts it didn't bother me. Our sex life was great, we watched porn together. I'm the one who went to the fetish nights at the clubs. But then I got pregnant with our son. His excuse started as he didn't want sex as it might harm the baby and it "felt weird" he turned to the porn more and more as I put on weight. (I had a car accident at eleven weeks so had to have my feet up for the whole nine months) as you can imagine with cream cake and cherry coke cravings my size and shape changed. After Max was born it got no better, he still chose the porn over me. I tried and am still trying really hard to lose weight but so far with no luck. He says he still finds me attractive and loves me and I also know im so wrong for thinking its my fault. Now he just spends as much time as he can viewing porn. He isn't that good with computers so doesn't hide it well (although he tries). I've suggested we watch it together but he wasn't keen.. although he did suggest watching me with another woman would turn him on Yeah right!!!!!! Dream on boy!!!! God he even jerks off in front of our seven month old little boy! I've gone beyond being upset and am so angry with the constant sneaking and lying. I've confronted him many times, cried, got angry, tried talking it through but he won't have any of it. He says he under stands but the next day back to the lesbians he doesn't seem able to admit or understand how upsetting I find it the reply is usually "so I looked at a few pictures big f****ing deal" Its driving me to depression, my already low self esteem is plummeting. If it weren't for our little boy who loves and idolizes his daddy I'd probably leave. I do love him ( I think) and I don't want it to be like this but I can't see a happy future for me. I need to make this relationship work for my little boy who means more than anything to me. How do you talk to someone who won't listen??
Sat 23 Oct, 2004 08:49 am
I found out my husband was looking at porn over a year ago now, and it broke my heart. The thought of my husband looking at this makes me feel sick.
My husband told me looking at porn did not turn him on, (well why look at it then?) he says he was curious, I don't think has heard of the saying curiosity killed the cat!!
Anyway I forgave him, and things where good for a couple of weeks, how do I know that, well I checked the pc's History, files downloaded that sort of thing.
But now I have a problem, my husband has installed all these different tools onto the pc. They remove all history, cookies, down loads, ect.
So now I cant check to see if he is still looking at porn, I know he is though, why else would he have done this?
So my question is to anyone out there, is there a way to get round all his sercurity that has been put on the pc.
I know some of think I am taking this too far, but I need to have proof that he is still looking at porn on the internet. Once I have my proof then our marriage is over its as simple as that.
Its not just about the porn, its all the lying & deception that goes with it.
Sat 23 Oct, 2004 08:59 am
Volcanas post should be required reading for all you women who are flooding A2K with tales of porn misery. You should all try and catch up on the hundreds of pages of discussion we have had. Just click search at the top of any page and then insert porn in the subject window.
Zeldas, your struggle for control of the PC does not bode well. I reiterate: porn itself is not evil, but the struggle to hide it will destroy a marriage. And I think nobody should be forced to enjoy something that they are not morally comfortable with.