U.S. middle east policy, pros and cons: discuss

@ossobuco,

ossobuco wrote:

Do you? Why not? or, Why?

He's just a Muslim expressing hostility towards non-Muslims, and in the same breath blaming non-Muslims for his hostility.

I'd say DroneStrike him, but whoever replaced him would be at least as bad, if not even worse.

In the end, Israel is going to have to wantonly bomb Egypt to rubble, recapture the Sinai, and rebuild their old settlements there.

Israel will be able to achieve all this without direct US involvement, but we should still be at the ready to equip them with whatever supplies they need during the war.

0 Replies

@ossobuco,

I also agree with his opinions about the Middle East, but that's far from what our government has done and will continue to do that infuriates many citizens of the ME and around the world. Our blind support of Israel is wrong-headed in every way; they are not a "democracy" by any stretch of the imagination or definition. They continue to steal Palestinian lands at will, and nobody in our government acknowledges these crimes. Our government has been broken for many decades, and I see it getting worse.

3 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

You are correct in everything you said. The Isralie president should get out of our politics and go home and try to solve his own problems without our help. Without us they would have come to an agreement long ago.

2 Replies

@ossobuco,

There's nothing new here. Morsi is just re-stating the old official Islamist line -- America's support of Israel and Israeli ambitions is what's causing a certain hostility against America and Americans in the Near East. <Yawwn> What else is new?

I'd note that without US support Israel would have been ground into dust years ago and without continued support it will get so ground.

5 Replies

@RABEL222,

Interesting point, Rabel.

0 Replies

@Lustig Andrei,

I take all you say as true, that people say this ( I do, although I figure things are complicated) and that US support has been important to Israel.

I started out extremely pro Israel and have changed on that.

Are you pro Netanyahu?

0 Replies

@Lustig Andrei,

Quote:

There's nothing new here. Morsi is just re-stating the old official Islamist line -- America's support of Israel and Israeli ambitions is what's causing a certain hostility against America and Americans in the Near East. <Yawwn> What else is new?

No, there's nothing much new, Andrew ... (apart from the recent events of the "Arab Spring" which were significant developments, yes?)
But just because you've heard some of these arguments before, you don't think there might be some truth in them? From a middle eastern perspective, at least?
Why are you so dismissive of the validity of these arguments?
I agree with Morsi's perspective, for the record.

2 Replies

@msolga,

I'm not dismissive of the validity of the arguments, msO. I'm dismissive of the whole geo-political mind-set which makes a constant repetition of the Arab position necessary. So much of it is not much more than a kind of left-handed apology to the USA for the trashing of their embassies and murder of some USians. Israel makes such a handy scapegoat; it's their excuse for why they hate America. The picture is so much, much more complex than that simple little red schoolhouse explanation. I have yet to read anything by any Near East politician or statesman that I would actually trust to be objectively accurate.

3 Replies

@Lustig Andrei,

Much of the misinformation of Americans can be blamed on the media - including, but not limited to, the hatred of Muslims and the belief that most are terrorists.

1 Reply

@Lustig Andrei,

I get things are complicated.
I don't take Israel as a scapegoat, though I can understand their moves.

Red schoolhouse?

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

I also agree with his opinions about the Middle East

Stands to reason that evil people agree on their support of evil.

cicerone imposter wrote:

but that's far from what our government has done and will continue to do that infuriates many citizens of the ME and around the world. Our blind support of Israel is wrong-headed in every way;

There is nothing blind about our support of Israel. And there is nothing wrong-headed about our support of Israel.

Israel and the US are both good guys, and we are natural allies in our opposition to evil scumbags.

cicerone imposter wrote:

they are not a "democracy" by any stretch of the imagination or definition.

Yes they are.

cicerone imposter wrote:

They continue to steal Palestinian lands at will,

Stop lying. Israel has not acquired any land since 1967, and since then has only given land back.

And no land west of the separation fence will ever belong to the Palestinians.

cicerone imposter wrote:

and nobody in our government acknowledges these crimes.

That is because your fabrications are not real-world crimes.

0 Replies

@RABEL222,

RABEL222 wrote:

You are correct in everything you said.

Not really. All he did was lie about Israel and then express bitterness over the fact that the US is opposed to evil.

RABEL222 wrote:

The Isralie president should get out of our politics and go home and try to solve his own problems without our help.

Iran is our problem just as much as they are Israel's problem.

And we are in Israel's politics just as much as they are in ours. We're the one who keep pressuring Israel to hold off and not bomb Iran.

RABEL222 wrote:

Without us they would have come to an agreement long ago.

The Palestinians would still refuse to negotiate and make peace even if no one else were involved.

0 Replies

I don't discuss anything with Oralloy; I'm fine with others discussing with him.

0 Replies

@Lustig Andrei,

Lustig Andrei wrote:

I'd note that without US support Israel would have been ground into dust years ago and without continued support it will get so ground.

Israel did pretty good against the Muslims before the US started providing military aid.

US aid has given Israel the security that allows them to be less aggressive towards their neighbors. Without that aid, Israel would have to go back to being more proactive about keeping their neighbors beaten down. However, Israel would certainly survive in such a case. Their neighbors would just be a bit more worse off.

And if Israel ever found themselves confronting an invader that they could not handle conventionally, they would just fire a barrage of atomic artillery shells at the invading army.

0 Replies

@Lustig Andrei,

I think it's about years & years of interference in the middle east.
They've kept saying the same things over & over because the interference continues. With no end in sight.
Yes, I agree it's a complex situation. But I believe this is the basis of the "repetitive message".
I'm not sure what a simple little school house explanation actually means.

1 Reply

Some people are just totally ignorant about world facts.

Total Jewish population in the world is 13.3 million. Total Muslim population in the world is over 2-billion.

2 Replies

@msolga,

msolga wrote:

No, there's nothing much new, Andrew ... (apart from the recent events of the "Arab Spring" which were significant developments, yes?)
But just because you've heard some of these arguments before, you don't think there might be some truth in them? From a middle eastern perspective, at least?

There is not a bit of truth to the arguments.

msolga wrote:

Why are you so dismissive of the validity of these arguments?

I can't answer for him, but for me at least, the fact that the arguments are entirely based on lies from beginning to end, sort of makes dismissing them out of hand the obvious choice.

msolga wrote:

I agree with Morsi's perspective, for the record.

I don't think you do. You are not the sort of person who tries to murder innocent people and then blame your victims for what you've done to them. You come across as far too nice for anything even remotely like that.

I think you just have the wrong idea about what Morsi actually stands for.

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

An not all of them alike. But getting more so, given, from my view, provocation.

1 Reply

@msolga,

msolga wrote:

I think it's about years & years of interference in the middle east.
They've kept saying the same things over & over because the interference continues. With no end in sight.

Interference?

Is that when we tell a Muslim that he will not be allowed to pour strong acid on the face of a six-year-old girl to punish her for trying to learn to read?

Is that when we defend ourselves when Muslims attack us or our allies?

Is that when we don't allow Muslims to commit genocide against non-Muslims?

Criminals complain when the police "interfere" with them as well.

0 Replies

U.S. middle east policy, pros and cons: discuss

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know