24
   

Is that stuff that JTT says about America true?

 
 
wandeljw
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 09:40 am
@JTT,
Tell us more about yourself, JTT. Why are you obsessed with only the negative aspects of U.S. history?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 09:56 am
@GracieGirl,
Think Iraq and Vietnam. Both wars were started on lies, and we ended up killing tens of thousands of innocent people.

maxdancona explained it very well, IMHO.
PUNKEY
 
  5  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 10:37 am
Gracie - hope you are getting through all these posts . . .

You asked: Is that stuff JTT says about America true?

Could be. Probably, in some degree.

JTT tends to blame modern American politicial figures and America's current military for all these atrocities, kind of like blaming America for the invention of the torture machines or of slavery or of men raping women. Truth is, these kinds of horrible things have happened since mankind learned how to wage war and, yes, could be happening now. But light is being shed on these issues and open debate is taking place about military tactics. (Watch for increase in the use of drones in the Mid-east along with the withdrawal of American soldiers)

Hopefully, you will hear all sides of the issus when you study world history. Good thing is that now you have enough knowledge to ask the right questions of your teachers! When you study the history of war and the actions of mankind to one another, it will make you weep. JTT should be ranting about the events taking place in Africa TODAY.

(BTW - I objected to one of JTT's posts when he/she ranted about our military in Iraq and how our soldiers were "raping and murdering" the citizens over there. Since my son was there, as a part of the National Guard, I objected to that blanket statement. (His unit helped citizens of that country identify relatives (from thousands of bodies recovered from shallow graves - murdered by the previous Iraqi government. )

That's what I don't like about JTT - the blanket generalizations and obsessiveness about the flaws in America's military operations since the 60's. I suspect that something happened to JTT sometime during those years and there is a fixation on American politics and military. JTT's rantings are specifically anit-American)

izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 11:44 am
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:

I don't think he's a nurse either.

(I was referring to the Carry On, Nurse and similar Doctor movies).

I see I'm piling on and will stop.


I imagine he says 'O0h Matron' quite a lot.
RABEL222
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 02:38 pm
@izzythepush,
Give him his due. He isent rational where the U.S. military is concerned, but he isent completely wrong in his beliefs.
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 02:46 pm
@RABEL222,
Quote:
but he isent completely wrong in his beliefs.


Of course he is not completely wrong as no nation in the history of the world is without sin.

That go even more for a world power however he is completely insane not just wrong with his drive to convicted others that the US is the most evil nation that had ever existed.
talk72000
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 02:55 pm
The US is doing it to their own soldiers with depleted uranium arsenal.

Quote:
During the war, US and British forces shot ammo made from Depleted Uranium (DU), a radioactive and toxic waste that is suspected as a cause of some illnesses affecting veterans of the 1991 Gulf War.
DU Patient

Scientists believe respiratory irritation caused by sand storms, oil fires, and concentrated vehicle fumes during Operation Desert Storm weakened the blood/brain barrier and allowed DU to enter the central nervous system of soldiers in the field resulting in slowly developing neurotoxic responses. Their brains, in effect, were slowly poisoned.

The brain is a 'target organ' for dissolved uranium. Tests on some Desert Storm vets show lowered ability to think and solve problems, as well as lowered motor skills in subjects with above average uranium levels.

During the latest operations in both Afghanistan and Iraq, American and British tanks fired thousands of depleted uranium armor penetrators. American A-10 and AV-8B aircraft shot hundreds of thousands of small caliber depleted uranium rounds.

Many troops in Iraq are being exposed to some level of DU, and the exposure this time may be far more long-term. The longer troops stay in theater if they are in a contaminated area, the more exposure they will have. DU is also toxic to the kidneys, and is known to cause cancer from inhalation. It is reasonable to assume that neither skin exposure nor swallowing particles of DU is wise.

The exposure to DU combined with the exposure to extensive combustion products from oil fires and blowing sand from the desert environment, however, is unique and the extent of exposure to respiratory irritants during this war was probably greater than in previous wars. These exposures for some soldiers may be more intense and more sustained now than they were in 1991.


http://stgvisie.home.xs4all.nl/depleteduraniummap.gif
http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://stgvisie.home.xs4all.nl/depleteduraniummap.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.xs4all.nl/~stgvisie/ud_main.html&h=459&w=472&sz=36&tbnid=_F-HNyM1hm_fMM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=93&prev=/search%3Fq%3Ddepleted%2Buranium%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=depleted+uranium&docid=M5twCmXMOHUfKM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=jomgTtDeLbLOiALihNFp&sqi=2&ved=0CFYQ9QEwBQ&dur=2393

http://stgvisie.home.xs4all.nl/PentagonPoison.html#mismanagement-veterans

Quote:
Multiple studies using cultured cells and laboratory rodents suggest the possibility of leukemogenic, genetic, reproductive, and neurological effects from chronic exposure.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:00 pm
@RABEL222,
Nobody is completely wrong in their beliefs. Gungasnake talks a lot of sense when it comes to capital punishment.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:01 pm
@BillRM,
Ossy and I were talking about Hawkeye. I don't think you are, now I don't know about 22.
0 Replies
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:17 pm
Do any of you actually believe that Gracie is getting anything whatsoever out of the psychotic diatribes of the previous two or three pages? That she cares what Poster X thinks about Hawkeye or Poster Y has to say about BillRM or Finn d'Abuzz? Or even whether JTT is incoherent at times?

Sheeesh...
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:22 pm
@PUNKEY,
Good post, Punkey.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:38 pm
@RABEL222,
Many of us - not all of course - agree with you on that. We have said so over the years. But it goes on and on, not only in appropriate threads, but all over the place.

As I said somewhere, I think I had some of his (I trust jtt is a him) opinions before he did, though I can see sides of issues and underlying sides of sides of issues.
At this point, I think of him as an internet brat, which is too bad.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:45 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Of course she can't follow it, neither can I - I was just commenting about jtt to Rabel, which seems to be a big mistake.

Hey, though, Andrei, this is often like some real life conversations.
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:46 pm
@talk72000,
Quote:
with depleted uranium arsenal.


http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/AboutDefence/WhatWeDo/HealthandSafety/DepletedUranium/DepletedUraniumAndHealth.htm


Depleted Uranium and Health
There is no reliable scientific or medical evidence to link DU with the ill health of either Gulf or Balkans veterans or people living in these regions.


Many independent reports have been produced and researchers continue to consider the battlefield effects of using DU munitions. The most important reports include work by the Royal Society, the European Commission, the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP), the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) and the World Health Organisation (WHO). Although these reports were produced some time ago, more recent work shows their conclusions are still valid.

None of these organisations has found a connection between DU exposure and illness, and none has found widespread DU contamination sufficient to impact the health of the general population or deployed personnel. There are only some very limited and localised areas, such as in armoured vehicles hit by DU munitions, where precautions to prevent DU inhalation would be prudent if long-term exposures were likely.

Serving Personnel

The MoD believes that DU presents a minimal health risk and to ensure that information is communicated effectively we issue specific safety instructions to all personnel who may come into contact with DU in operational situations. Safety instructions issued during both Gulf conflicts are publicly available. Radiation dose meters are issued to those who spend time in tanks loaded with DU munitions.

To provide reassurance in the adequacy of the safety instructions, MoD’s policy is that all military personnel and civilians on recent operations, such as Op Telic, and any future operations involving use of DU are offered a test for total uranium in the urine. A test for uranium isotopes, which determines whether the uranium is depleted, is offered if the initial test for the total uranium gives anomalous results. If personnel are known to have been exposed to DU or there is high probability that they have been so exposed, the isotope test is offered straight away. So far over 390 individuals have been tested, and of those only a small number have been found to be excreting DU in their urine. These are personnel who were injured in blue-on-blue incidents.

Veterans

An independent committee called the Depleted Uranium Oversight Board (DUOB) was established by the MoD in 2001 to develop a screening programme for Gulf 1990/1991 and Balkans veterans concerned about possible exposure to DU. Urine testing was made available from September 2004 to January 2006 and a total of 496 people took part. None was found to be excreting DU. The DUOB has since been disbanded but its final report to the Minister for Veterans can be accessed from the link on the right.

Local Civilians

There is no reliable scientific or medical evidence to link DU with the ill health of people living in regions were DU has been used. Media reports of DU-induced cancers and birth defects in Iraq have not been substantiated with credible scientific evidence. Many other factors need to be considered as possible causes, for example, some scientists have blamed the former Iraqi Government's use of chemical weapons on its own citizens. Furthermore, there is no evidence that illnesses of the type reported are uniquely associated with or indeed consistent with exposure to DU. Of course, the Government would consider carefully any reliable medical or scientific data that may emerge concerning the incidence of ill health in Iraq.









Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:47 pm
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:

Hey, though, Andrei, this is often like some real life conversations.


Unfortunately, that's true.
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 06:27 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Lustig Andrei wrote:

ossobuco wrote:

Hey, though, Andrei, this is often like some real life conversations.


Unfortunately, that's true.


Unfortunately, the original poster has not given any feedback on the discussion.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 06:50 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Psychotic diatribes?

Did I miss something keeping JTT ignored?

I figure Gracie got she wanted from this thread.

Thomas was nice enough to offer to tutor her on historical American atrocities, but she apparently has declined his offer.
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 09:44 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
Thomas was nice enough to offer to tutor her on historical American atrocities, but she apparently has declined his offer.
How many young people do you know who want to pursue education? She like most seems most interested in entertainment.
RABEL222
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 10:48 pm
@hawkeye10,
There you go again. Putting down someone you dont know. As someone said maybe she got the information she wanted and left because of the vitriol on this site.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 10:59 pm
@RABEL222,
RABEL222 wrote:

There you go again. Putting down someone you dont know. As someone said maybe she got the information she wanted and left because of the vitriol on this site.
I qualified my statement with "seems" which puts me ahead of most people around here who seem convinced that they know other peoples motives for fact. I have no information that she has left yet either, but if she is here for entertainment she will soon enough, as we are a pretty serious bunch these days. We have never suffered fools well but we have taken it to the next level since the revamp. I don't think this is a bad thing, as the internet is full of vapid victim culture meeting places, it does not need another one.
0 Replies
 
 

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