Rand Paul is a............

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Was it the intention of the Founders
to grant citizenship to the progeny of illegal aliens?

I'd say yes.

A
R
The children of the founding fathers were the progeny of illegal aliens.

@OmSigDAVID,

No, it was the intention of the descendants of of the founders to grant citizenship to the progeny of illegal aliens.

Surely you know that the Founders only included the first 10 amendments?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

Quote:

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

1 Reply

@DrewDad,

Yes. I take your point; thank u.

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@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

Was it the intention of the Founders
to grant citizenship to the progeny of illegal aliens?

It was the intention of the founding fathers to maintain blacks slavery so maybe we should go back to that state?

Second note it was what would had been GOP party members today who pass the first law increasing the time period for citizenship for France immigrates from two years to five years.

Cannot have all those Frenchmen voting for the Federal party after all right off the boat.

The more things change the more they are the same.

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13th Amendment.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

The 13 and the 14 amendments are tie together in making sure you can not denial full citizenship right to former slaves and their offsprings.

They still found ways to do so for the next 100 years but that was the intent.

Anyone who would wish to find a way to denial full citizenship rights to anyone born on US soil because of who their parents happen to had been, wish to undo the work of the Civil War generation in ending second class undergroup /slavery in this country.

Amazing the lack of shame the right wings nuts have is it not?

2 Replies

@BillRM,

Please show me anyone that is trying to deny citizenship to anyone.

And dont say me, because I was quite clear when I said the choice would be up to the parents, not the govt.

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@mysteryman,

mysteryman wrote:

Please show me anyone that is trying to deny citizenship to anyone

You are trying to bar American children from enjoying the benefits of their citizenship, using their parents' immigration status as a wedge. You're also using linguistic trickery to conceal it, but that doesn't change what you're doing.

1 Reply

@Thomas,

I'm not trying to bar anyone from anything, except for those here illegally.
If a parent chooses to take a child home, its not the place of the govt to stop them.

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

That would be the linguistic trickery I was talking about.

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@Thomas,

So now its linguistic trickery to allow a parent to choose?

1 Reply

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

The 13 and the 14 amendments are tie together in making sure you can not denial full citizenship right to former slaves and their offsprings.

They still found ways to do so for the next 100 years but that was the intent.

Anyone who would wish to find a way to denial full citizenship rights to anyone born on US soil because of who their parents happen to had been, wish to undo the work of the Civil War generation in ending second class undergroup /slavery in this country.

Amazing the lack of shame the right wings nuts have is it not?

I dunno; WHAT do u define as "full citizenship rights" Bill ?

David

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

No one would dream at stopping a parent from moving a child out of the country however that is not and never was the issue and no matter where you move him he is still a constitution US citizen and you can not get around that fact by pressuring a parent to sign some form of papers.

If you wish to try to change the Constitution feel free to try but short of that anyone born here is a citizen and as an adult he or she can come back into the US as a full citizen with even the right to run for President.

1 Reply

@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

That would be the linguistic trickery I was talking about.

What is the "linguistic trickery" Thomas ?
I read the thread, but it was not immediately apparent.

David

0 Replies

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

No one would dream at stopping a parent from moving a child out of the country however that is not and never was the issue and no matter where you move him he is still a constitution US citizen and you can not get around that fact by pressuring a parent to sign some form of papers.

If you wish to try to change the Constitution feel free to try but short of that anyone born here is a citizen and as an adult he or she can come back into the US as a full citizen with even the right to run for President.

I must dispute u, Bill.
I woud dream of doing that,
if the kid refused to leave.
That has already HAPPENED, when commie parents
tried (in some cases succeeded) to move a kid against his will
into a communist country.

David

3 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

I dunno; WHAT do u define as "full citizenship rights" Bill ?

The same rights as anyone else born here have such as running for the office of the President.

A full Constitutional citizenship can not be removed by congress or the courts as can other forms of citizenship such as for example naturalized citizenship can be.

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@OmSigDAVID,

The parents can force him to leave in most cases depending how young he is however as soon he turn 18 he can return as a full citizens.

Second, somehow I do not think that the courts would look kindly on the government trying to do an end run around the 14 Amendment by pressuring the parents to removed the child in the first place.

But no matter what the outcome would be of that issue at 18 he or she can return.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

That has already HAPPENED, when commie parents
tried (in some cases succeeded) to move a kid against his will
into a communist country.

That kid was not an American citizen of any kind and his remaining parent wish his return case closed.

Oh what will as he was a very young child indeed at the time.

Not the same as dealing with a US citizen in any case.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

David wrote:

That has already HAPPENED, when commie parents
tried (in some cases succeeded) to move a kid against his will
into a communist country.

BillRM wrote:

That kid was not an American citizen of any kind and his remaining parent wish his return case closed.

Oh what will as he was a very young child indeed at the time.

Not the same as dealing with a US citizen in any case.

Elian was a very unfortunate kid, doomed to a life of slavery,
because of his age. Other kids were not that unlucky
and remained here regardless of their commie parents' desires.

Obviously, taking a kid to live in communist slavery
is the worst, foulest degradation and child abuse that a parent can perpetrate.

David

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@OmSigDAVID,

He seem very happy indeed for a slave and once more he was not a citizen or at an age where he could have adult or near adults opinions at the time.

If he had been a least a middle teenager he would had more then likely not had been return over his wishes and if he had been a citizen and a middle teenager then he would not had been return to Cuba again his will.

0 Replies

Rand Paul is a............

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