Rand Paul is a............

so, wait, you guys are saying that rand paul had sex with hester prynne

i hope this comes out during the election

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Sorry but hate groups that Paul is part of the leadership of is targeting one of the most defenseless groups in our society for roughly the same reasons and the same purposes as the Nazis pick on the Jews 90 years ago.

More utter nonsense. Can you substantiate this charge with anything other than your own fevered opinion?

In the 50s/60s Paul would had been targeting blacks also for the same reason.

And that reason is?

Please take note by the way no real targeting of the people that are offering them jobs in the first place and therefore bringing them into the country.

There is already federal law that addresses employers of illegal immigrants.
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersbcdd Blame the Feds if it is not being properly enforced.
But let's say that precisely right law was enacted tomorrow and a totally suffient enofrcement policy was set in motion. If absolutely no one in America knowlingly hired illegal immigrants, would you be in favor of deporting all of the ones thereafter found?

Talk about the economic harm done to the Arizona by the boycott that would be nothing compared to if these nuts got their wish and all the illegals let Arizona.

Billions of dollars worth of crops would end up rotting in the fields just to start with.

Once upon a time we have an agricultural guest workers programs however the farming interests prefer an illegal work force with no rights at all.

If by some magic we was able to stop all illegal immigrates from working here and force them across the border within weeks we would need to restart the guest workers program and invited them back.

Creating a guest worker program and denying citizenship to children born to illegal immigrants in the US, are not mutually exclusive.

This is analogy to feeding a starving dog pack you had some need of and then one day going out and kicking them for daring to come on your property to eat the food you been placing out for them.

Who has ever had a need for a starving pack of dogs? Brilliant analogy.

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re djjd, so he's a necrophiliac too? yeah, i can get behind that.

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I have serious difficulties with someone who can seriously STILL suggest, forty-five years after it was decided, that property rights trump human rights. Fortunately for him, I don't live in Kentucky. If he ever , gods forfend, hits the national scene, I am going to be very loud. That bonehead statement By RPaul that Obama is unAmerican because he forcefully stated he was going to hold BP responsible for the spill, certainly didn't help the Paul campaign for respect as an intellect either.

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@Thomas,

MM's proposal is, I think, too pat. I doubt very much that the mother would be able to nullify the citizenship of the child born on US soil.

However, even if the child was a citizen, it would deprive the mother of the ability to remain in the country through the so-called Anchor Baby ploy.

I don't believe that every child born in the US to illegal immigrants is part of a plan to avoid deportation nor am I suggesting that the parents of an Anchor Baby do not love their child or would not have wanted it under any circumstances, but it is foolish to argue, as I have seen argued in this forum, that this practice doesn't actually exist as a means for illegal aliens to avoid deportation.

Obviously it creates a moral dilemma for the US which is precisely why it is used, and with good effect.

I wonder how many illegal alien mothers would give up their babies rather than taking them back to their home country when deported. Is anyone aware of statistics in this regards?

Somehow I doubt there would be many, if any.

Yes, the child would be an American citizen, entitled to eventually return here and live as a citizen, and perhaps these mothers would be satisfied with that gain alone.

For the ones who would abandon their children rather than take them back to their home country with them, that's would be a choice they might freely take in an effort to provide their child with a better life than they had.

If a woman in the US is convicted of a crime and sentenced to a prison term, the fact that she has minor children doesn't keep her out of jail.

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@djjd62,

YEah, but he had trouble with ED.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

We both know that torturing/pressuring parents in order to sign away a child birth right under the constitution would not fly under any at all likely future supreme courts.

To come on with that idea and or to support it you need to be a sick sob.

Second we do not have an illegal immigration problem as anytime the government could place an end to it and get those already here to leave by just enforcing heavy heavy fines on anyone who give such people jobs.

So our ruling class is playing games with the rest of us over this matter along with the Pauls of this world

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@mysteryman,

mysteryman wrote:

Yes, but since I'm not here illegally, that is irrelevent.

What would you or wouldn't you do for your children? For instance, would you cross an arbitrary line in the sand if you knew it would open up a world of opportunity for your child? If you wouldn't; you're not much of a parent.
Asking a loving parent to choose between keeping their kids and providing the best possible future for them is heinous. So heinous I'd wager there is NO POSSIBILITY of bigots succeeding in altering the constitution for such a heartless purpose.

Imagine yourself as the illegal alien (assuming you have any capacity for empathy at all.) Would you be any less human? Would you love your children any less? Would you want to provide them the best possible future available? If you can understand these things; how can you be so callous about the brown man feeling the exact same way you do?

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@OCCOM BILL,

Quote:

Asking a loving parent to choose between keeping their kids and providing the best possible future for them is heinous. So heinous I'd wager there is NO POSSIBILITY of bigots succeeding in altering the constitution for such a heartless purpose.

Native Americans were given smallpox infested blankets, the constitution describes Indians as 3/5 [is it?] of a human being, Blacks were raped, beaten, tortured and worked to death long after slavery was made illegal. ...

And you think that there aren't enough heartless bigots available to pull this off, Sanctimonious Bill?

Quote:

Imagine yourself as the illegal alien (assuming you have any capacity for empathy at all.)

cough, cough [choke, sprays cereal over screen and keyboard]

Well over a million children in Iraq since the embargo, how many hundreds of thousands of innocents in Afghanistan and Iraq, tens of thousands of innocents butchered at the hand of the US government in [pick yer C & So American country], millions of Vietnamese, Cambodians, Laotians napalmed, carpet bombed, murdered in free fire zones, murdered in illegal invasions, and where is Empathetic Bill?

The hottest fires in hell are reserved for those who remain neutral in times of moral crisis. The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

Have you the slightest, I mean, do you have an inkling of the meaning of hypocrisy, Bill?

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@JTT,

You are a one note and only one note gentleman.

Yes the US is the most evil country to ever exist in this world or any other possible world.

Now go take your medication.

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@BillRM,

Given your limited mental skills, you shouldn't be the one to venture forth to defend the USA, Bill.

There's no need to go to the absurd as a defense. The USA has committed quite a large number of incredibly evil acts.

The most evil, ever, ... that's certainly open to debate.

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@JTT,

LOL along with saving the world at least three times in the last hundred years from slavery.

I am sure you would had love to be part of the USSR world empire or the German/Japanese empires.

Let see what part of the world are you from?

Hell you would not even have the internet to whine about how evil the US is without a US military program that turn into the net.

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@JTT,

Here is a potential future scenario involving JTT:
man 1: There's a Palestinian man, he broke into my apartment and he threw me out my second floor window. Dear god!! Call the police!! He's raping my wife right now!!
JTT: No! I won't call the police. The Palestinian has been crushed under the feet of the US empire... {blah blah blah American Empire ... civilians killed in Afghanistan ... blah blah}
man 1: Dear god!! What are you babbling about!! Call the police there is an insane man raping my wife in my apartment. I can't stop him as both my legs are broke and ....
JTT: And then we have the invasion of Iraq ...
man 1: I don't know his politics! I'm begging you to
help me!! He may not even be Palestinian. Just call the police or go up there and try to scare him away!
wife: ((screaming)) Someone help me please! Dear god please!!
JTT: Yells to man 1's wife: You shut up!! You too are an American hypocrite as well! {blah blah sanctioned violence against civilians blah blah blah}

15 minutes later:
Palestinian man (who turns out to be just a dark skinned Italian man comes whom man 1 mistakenly identified as Palestinian) out of the apartment: Please help me. I stopped taking my medicine. And I'm afraid I kill....
JTT: The US government continues to commit crimes against {blah blah blah}
dark skinned Italian man: I don't have a cell phone? Why won't you call the police or an ambulance. This man is in great pain! His wife may still be alive.
JTT: {blah blah blah}
~
The moral of the story: JTT is always keen on being irrevocably irrelevant and delusional and dangerously one noted/sided to the suffering of others. Like a broken clock, his antiAmerican criticisms are accurate at least twice a day. In the proper forum, his arguments can be powerful and damning. But most of the time, he sprays and spits out this antiAmerican nonsense and venom in rants that tend to be wildly digressionary and counterproductive to the crisis at hand which others are trying to address and find solutions for.

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@tsarstepan,

You're rarely this stupid, Tsarstepan. Both you and Bill should leave the defense team fortwith.

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@JTT,

LOL come to think about it I am not sure without the US and US citizens you would not now be writing letters by the light of whale oil lamps!

From the 1870s when Edison got rolling to this very moment 80 percent plus of the technology breaks through was done by Americans and a large fraction of the other 20 percents was done by non-Americans working in the US under the US economic system.

The rest of the world has plenty of reasons to be kissing our rear ends.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

We both know that torturing/pressuring parents in order to sign away a child birth right under the constitution would not fly under any at all likely future supreme courts.

Who, other than perhaps MM, is talking about a parent signing away a child's birth right?

To come on with that idea and or to support it you need to be a sick sob.

Who, other than perhaps MM, has raised the idea or is supporting it? Certainly not Rand Paul.

Second we do not have an illegal immigration problem as anytime the government could place an end to it and get those already here to leave by just enforcing heavy heavy fines on anyone who give such people jobs.

You so seldom answer any directly made questions that I'm not sure this is an answer to mine.

Let's say there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the US today. If we estimate that only a quarter of them are actually holding jobs, that's 4 million jobs. Do you think that the government could readily identify all the parties that have hired these illegals? They don't all work for farmers you know.

How could the government possibly identify all of these employers? How do they identify all of the greasy spoon cafes that hire them, the 4 man landscaping companies that are doing strictly cash business, the suburban homeowners who hire them to clean their houses or watch their kids?

There are only two ways and both are impossible and both require confronting the illegal aliens themselves and challanging their status: Regularly inspect each and every small business and home in America or track down all of the illegals and see where they go to work. Neither of these methods will ever be attempted; nor should they be.

Your notion that we dont have an illegal immigrant problem because it is in the power of the federal government to put an end to all employment of illegals is stupendously absurd. Are you suggesting that the Obama Administration could put an end to illegal immigration, but for some (obviously corrupt) reason refuses to? If it could; has been trying to but is constantly thwarted in some way by opposing members of congress, don't you think it's spokepeople would be screaming this fact from the rafters of the White House?

Yes, better enforcement of the laws against employing illegals will help, but it won't solve the problem. The best way to control, if not solve the problem entirely, is to keep them out of the country in the first place and deport them when they are found.

The reality is, however, that there is one entire political party that doesn't actually want to adress the problem. In part because some of its members and many of their constituents believe we should have open borders, but its also because they believe that some sort amnesty progam is inevitable (and it probably is) and they are counting on these pardoned illegals to become loyal voters for Democrat politicians.

So our ruling class is playing games with the rest of us over this matter along with the Pauls of this world

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Quote:

How could the government possibly identify all of these employers? How do they identify all of the greasy spoon cafes that hire them, the 4 man landscaping companies that are doing strictly cash business, the suburban homeowners who hire them to clean their houses or watch their kids?

Sure you could find them as what you do is offer fifty percent of any fine to whoever turn an employer in and even offering to pay said amount to the illegal workers themselves and I would set the fine at 10,000 per worker to start with. And that fine 10,000 per worker would apply to someone who hire one person to be a maid up to Walmart.

So if you are illegal and working for a cleaning firm that you know employ 20 illegal workers you could turn the firm in and go back to Mexico with 100,000 dollars in your pocket.

No bad for someone earning less then minimum wage and it would cost the government nothing as the program would more then pay for itself by way of the fines.

Footnote you could not avoid the fines by using contract firms. If you are a farmer it is your lookout to made damn sure the crew you hire have only legal workers in it.

Given the situation and a few examples you would shortly find no one willing to hire an illegal worker in the US.

Problem solve....................

Oh the problem is jut beginning as you would find is short order you do need those people but the only choice would be then to bring them back legally under some form of guest worker program.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Quote:

The reality is, however, that there is one entire political party that doesn't actually want to adress the problem. In part because some of its members and many of their constituents believe we should have open borders, but its also because they believe that some sort amnesty progam is inevitable (and it probably is) and they are counting on these pardoned illegals to become loyal voters for Democrat politicians.

Sorry you have both repeat both parties happy with the current situation not one.

One because it love the cheap labor and a work force with zero legal protections and the other because they do hope for more votes in the future.

Both are playing the middle class for fools

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@BillRM,

Quote:

LOL come to think about it I am not sure without the US ...

From the 1870s when Edison got rolling to this very moment ...

The rest of the world has plenty of reasons to be kissing our rear ends.

Unable to face the truth and deal with it, and bereft of even a scintilla of honesty or human decency, ugly Americanism rears its head.

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@JTT,

Poor baby it is a damn shame there is no way to send you to a parallel universe where the evil and ugly US never did exist.

I hear that the light from a whale oil lamp is very soothing.

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Rand Paul is a............

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