Is abortion really wrong?

Scott777ab wrote:

echi wrote:
What? I don't get it, Intrepid.

Of course not. LOL.

I got it.

YOU got it?? Crap... There goes my self-esteem.

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Thanks Scott,

Far more information than I needed, but at least I can stop feeling guilty about treating you like a moron.

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Hey, I have a question for you, Scott. What the hell was Intrepid talking about? (This might be your one big chance to enlighten someone, so you'd better jump on it.)

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Eorl wrote:

Thanks Scott,

Far more information than I needed, but at least I can stop feeling guilty about treating you like a moron.

tOUCHe

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Eorl wrote:

Thanks Scott,

Far more information than I needed, but at least I can stop feeling guilty about treating you like a moron.

Is that the best slam you can come up with? (use a southern accent on the bold words.)

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kate4christ03 wrote:
true i see y'alls point but then i must ask, why do they come in here if not to hear or debate about spirituality and religion....thats about as silly as if i were to go to the law forum ask a question then refuse to hear any answer that includes the law in it.........

Most likely 1 of 2 reasons.

1 - They are open and want to explore new and exciting ways to an eternal future.

2 - They are rabble rousers who want to feel superior.

Basically he is saying that your are either so lacking in spirituality that even though you do not realise it you are seeking something without knowing, and are open to find something meaningful in your life.

Or that you just want to come in these forums and bash and make those who believe in relgion look like morons. So he called you a rabble rouser who wants to feel superior in their ways. Like in Grammar, in proper agruing, or whatever and if someone does not follow the proper ways to do such things then you bash them and TRY to make them feel like MORONS which totally don't work it just makes YOU LOOK STUPID.

Enjoy.

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Scott777ab wrote:

Basically he is saying that your are either so lacking in spirituality that even though you do not realise it you are seeking something without knowing, and are open to find something meaningful in your life.

Or that you just want to come in these forums and bash and make those who believe in relgion look like morons. So he called you a rabble rouser who wants to feel superior in their ways. Like in Grammar, in proper agruing, or whatever and if someone does not follow the proper ways to do such things then you bash them and TRY to make them feel like MORONS which totally don't work it just makes YOU LOOK STUPID.

Enjoy.

I appreciate your getting back to me, although I doubt very much that Intrepid had me in mind when he posted those comments (thoughtful fella that he is). Let me give you some advice that I have found very useful, myself: Don't be too quick to judge... it just makes YOU LOOK STUPID.

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Just to clarify. Please note that the word "they" was used. This was not being directed to any particular person.

It was a generic answer to kate4christ03 for her thought on why some post in religious forums.

Was not a slight on anybody but rather an observation from reading many posts.

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echi wrote:

Scott777ab wrote:
Basically he is saying that your are either so lacking in spirituality that even though you do not realise it you are seeking something without knowing, and are open to find something meaningful in your life.

Or that you just want to come in these forums and bash and make those who believe in relgion look like morons. So he called you a rabble rouser who wants to feel superior in their ways. Like in Grammar, in proper agruing, or whatever and if someone does not follow the proper ways to do such things then you bash them and TRY to make them feel like MORONS which totally don't work it just makes YOU LOOK STUPID.

Enjoy.

I appreciate your getting back to me, although I doubt very much that Intrepid had me in mind when he posted those comments (thoughtful fella that he is). Let me give you some advice that I have found very useful, myself: Don't be too quick to judge... it just makes YOU LOOK STUPID.

You misunderstand once again but that is expected and accepted as a norm from me. I was insinuating that his post was directed towards you sense your the one who piped up on not knowing what he meant. I wasn't judging at all I was insinuating that his post was directed at you, and thereby just trying to ruffle thy feathers a bit. Looks like I did a good job at that.

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echi wrote:

Intrepid wrote:
You seem so absolutely, positively, 100% dyed in the wool certain. Your faith is amazing.

Uh... Certain that you won't persuade the non-religious with religious rhetoric?
I was just trying to help. I'm on your side, you know?

I know it well and am glad of it.

I think there are many like you, Echi, but they are mostly intimidated into silence.

I have posted links to Nat Hentoff on several occasions in regard to this topic (most recently was just a few pages back).

Have you ever read much of his work?

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real life--
I am not familiar with Nat Hentoff, but I will check him out. Thank you!

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Here is a collection of Nat Hentoff links on abortion that I posted previously.

http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~rauch/nvp/hentoff.html

One of my favorite Hentoff quotes is

Nat Hentoff wrote:

Accordingly, I am no longer surprised to find myself considered an external enemy. For years, American Civil Liberties Union affiliates around the country invited me to speak at their fund-raising Bill of Rights dinners. But once I declared myself a pro-lifer, all such invitations stopped. They know I agree with them on most ACLU policies, but that no longer matters. I am now no better than Jesse Helms. Free speech, after all, has its limits.

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real life--
I was checking out that link you posted for Hentoff when I ran across this quote from Jesse Jackson:

Quote:

What happens to the mind of a person, and the moral fabric of a nation, that accepts the aborting of the life of a baby without a pang of conscience?

It's from an article he wrote back in January, 1977, called "How We Respect Life Is the Overriding Moral Issue". Is it common knowledge that he used to be anti-abortion? It's news to me.

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echi wrote:

real life--
I was checking out that link you posted for Hentoff when I ran across this quote from Jesse Jackson:

Quote:
What happens to the mind of a person, and the moral fabric of a nation, that accepts the aborting of the life of a baby without a pang of conscience?

It's from an article he wrote back in January, 1977, called "How We Respect Life Is the Overriding Moral Issue". Is it common knowledge that he used to be anti-abortion? It's news to me.

No, it's not very well known except among some of the pro-life community or folks with very long memories who knew him well back then.

But by the time Jackson ran for President, he was toeing the pro-abortion line of the national Democratic party.

Other Democratic luminaries who used to be much more open to the pro-life view when running for office early in their career include Ted Kennedy, Bill Clinton, Dick Gephardt and Al Gore, until they got ambitious for national office. The pro-abortion litmus test in the national party proved too great for them.

Pro-abortion voters in America are often one-issue voters; so radicalized is this segment of voters that it trumps all else as far as they are concerned.

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real life--

Add to that list Dennis Kucinich. I understand he was anti-abortion/pro-life (whatever) until just a few years ago. I would still consider voting for him, though.

BTW- I prefer the term "anti-abortion" over "pro-life". It's no big deal, really... I just think it's more straightforward and less antagonistic.

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echi wrote:

real life--

Add to that list Dennis Kucinich. I understand he was anti-abortion/pro-life (whatever) until just a few years ago. I would still consider voting for him, though.

BTW- I prefer the term "anti-abortion" over "pro-life". It's no big deal, really... I just think it's more straightforward and less antagonistic.

I didnt know Kucinich used to be pro-life. That is sad. Apparently he too changed his stripes just before running for President.

Pro-abortion Republicans seldom change their stance to gain higher office. They usually lose at the Presidential level if they are pro-abortion, but they at least have the honesty to say what they believe.

As far as the labels, I would be happy to be known as anti-abortion or pro-life. I am both.

Sometimes pro-abortion folks want to label me anti choice. That is fine with me also.

Some choices are not valid and should not be considered valid.

I am happy when they (unknowingly) give an opportunity for that to be pointed out.

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Hi, im back.

After some thought, this is what i think:

a) Abortion is killing a human being, thats fact, no one in thier right mind would condone murder.
b) Killing in war is murder
c) Ciggies SHOULD be illigal, they kill people. (I smoke, but ill get over it).
d) Cars should be covered in enuff bubble wrap to sustain a 120km/h crash, thus dramaticly reducing fatal crashes.

These are some of my ideas to reduce fatalities in our world today.

I am also very glad i`m living in a developed country, and do not in any way feel sorry for people of the world that are starving, the'll die, like anyone gives two hoots anyway.

Peace

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real life wrote:

Pro-abortion voters in America are often one-issue voters; so radicalized is this segment of voters that it trumps all else as far as they are concerned.

What the ... ?

I don't know much about American politics but I doubt this. (Oh, and you meant pro-choice. Almost noboby is pro-abortion.)

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Eorl wrote:

real life wrote:

Pro-abortion voters in America are often one-issue voters; so radicalized is this segment of voters that it trumps all else as far as they are concerned.

What the ... ?

I don't know much about American politics but I doubt this. (Oh, and you meant pro-choice. Almost noboby is pro-abortion.)

OK, when you know more about American politics we'll discuss.

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Xenoche wrote:

Hi, im back.

After some thought, this is what i think:

a) Abortion is killing a human being, thats fact, no one in thier right mind would condone murder.
b) Killing in war is murder
c) Ciggies SHOULD be illigal, they kill people. (I smoke, but ill get over it).
d) Cars should be covered in enuff bubble wrap to sustain a 120km/h crash, thus dramaticly reducing fatal crashes.

These are some of my ideas to reduce fatalities in our world today.

I am also very glad i`m living in a developed country, and do not in any way feel sorry for people of the world that are starving, the'll die, like anyone gives two hoots anyway.

Peace

Your comparisons are very strange, but lets run with them for the moment:

Do you see any difference between a person who takes upon himself the risk of smoking and the unborn who has not made any choice to endanger or forfeit his/her life?

If an unborn child can be shown not to have smoked, should abortion of that unborn child be illegal?

-----------------------------------

Do you see any difference between a person who takes upon himself the risk of driving and the unborn who has not made any choice to endanger or forfeit his/her life?

If an unborn child can be shown not to have driven a motor vehicle, should abortion of that unborn child be illegal?

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Since you continue to link poverty to abortion for some reason unknown, would you agree that if the residents of a state or county or city can be shown to be sufficiently well fed that abortion should therefore be illegal in that state or county or city?

If an unborn child can be shown not to have consumed more than his/her fair share of food, should abortion of that unborn child be illegal?

---------------------------------------

If it can be shown that the unborn has not participated in war nor approved of it, should abortion of that unborn child be illegal?

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Is abortion really wrong?

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