Clemency for Tookie?

You would be surprised just how far left I am!! I just think we make death row way too comfortable for those who are in it. I am one of those "bleeding heart libruls" the rightwingers whine about. I just think that death row is a joke. If I had to go to jail, I'd want to make sure I was on death row. Private, quiet cells removed from the rest of the prison population. Private exercise time, TV, 3 squares a day. Excellent health care, at least in California. Yea, if I'm going to jail, I'm making sure it's serious enough to get on death row!!

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ralpheb wrote:

I feel I am as compasionate for murderers as they are for their victims when they are killing them.

So, then, you put yourself in the same category as them? You don't think that you're better person than a murderer is?

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I am in a much better catagory. I havent kiled them. I just believe that they should be killed.

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blueflame1 wrote:

McGentrix, Tookie was innocent. He was framed. The real killer got away with it. As for FDR, JFK and Clinton, they are gone. Bushie cant hide behind them. He's very much under the gun for lying us into war and his days are spent trying to convince America that he really, really didn't lie us into war. Americans are not buying that by a wide margin.

Basically, I don't even care what the hell W had to do to take down the baathist regime in Iraq. It's overwhelmingly clear that Hussein and his baathist party were responsible at least for the anthrax attacks which followed 9-11 and I don't ever want to see ANYBODY get away with **** like that. I don't care if W had to put his hand on a bible and claim two and two are five to set that one straight.

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I think we need to get blue a soap box.

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IronLionZion wrote:

I have been to prison, and it sucks, but it's preferable to death by far. If it wasn't people wouldn't be fighting tooth and nail to avoid the death penalty.

Heh. Five minutes after I wrote this post I got a call from my new job telling me I was fired because a criminal background check exposed my record.

Go justice system!

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IronLionZion wrote:

IronLionZion wrote:
I have been to prison, and it sucks, but it's preferable to death by far. If it wasn't people wouldn't be fighting tooth and nail to avoid the death penalty.

Heh. Five minutes after I wrote this post I got a call from my new job telling me I was fored because a criminal background check exposed my record.

Go justice system!

Those CORIs are a bitch. I know. My sympathies, Lion.

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Stevepax wrote:

IronLionZion wrote:
I have been to prison, and it sucks, but it's preferable to death by far. If it wasn't people wouldn't be fighting tooth and nail to avoid the death penalty.

Like I said, we make it way too comfortable for the inmates. If I were running it, they would WISH they were dead.

You're a moron. Jail is a horrible place where brutality reigns supreme. People come out of jails fucked up for the rest of thier lives. Yet, you'd make it harsher. The problem with morons like you is that you don't realize these people - people like me - are going to be released one day. Do you really want a man who has ben hardened bya decade of Darwinian brutality to be released on to the streets?

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ralpheb wrote:

I feel I am as compasionate for murderers as they are for their victims when they are killing them.

So you admit to stooping to thier level?

Good post.

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IronLionZion wrote:

IronLionZion wrote:
I have been to prison, and it sucks, but it's preferable to death by far. If it wasn't people wouldn't be fighting tooth and nail to avoid the death penalty.

Heh. Five minutes after I wrote this post I got a call from my new job telling me I was fired because a criminal background check exposed my record.

Go justice system!

Were you fired because of your record, or because you lied on your application?

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Tico,

Hi! I am curious. If you put on your application that you have been convicted of a crime, they can't fire you later because of it, can they?

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Momma Angel wrote:

Tico,

Hi! I am curious. If you put on your application that you have been convicted of a crime, they can't fire you later because of it, can they?

They may not hire you because of the felony conviction. It depends on the particular state you are in. Some employers will inquire about the circumstances of the prior offense. They should only consider the felony conviction as it relates to the applicant's suitability for the particular job they are applying for, and have a sound business justification if they refuse to hire because of the conviction. Obviously, different employers approach it differently. In many cases a criminal record will not automatically disqualify you for employment. However, falsification of the application will almost always disqualify you, regardless of how well qualified you are otherwise. And all will fire the employee if they falsified their application, and the employer finds out about it later.

ILZ's experience might be different. His experience might be that he doesn't get hired if he is truthful, so he believes his best chance at employment is to falsify his application.

Either way, it would not be a good situation to be in.

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Thanx Tico. I appreciate you explaining that. I think if someone is honest enough to tell the truth and if they are truly trying to be a productive member of society they should be given every chance. Once someone's sentence is served, I think they should be given every chance, just like everyone else.

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IronLionZion wrote:

Stevepax wrote:
IronLionZion wrote:
I have been to prison, and it sucks, but it's preferable to death by far. If it wasn't people wouldn't be fighting tooth and nail to avoid the death penalty.

Like I said, we make it way too comfortable for the inmates. If I were running it, they would WISH they were dead.

You're a moron. Jail is a horrible place where brutality reigns supreme. People come out of jails **** up for the rest of thier lives. Yet, you'd make it harsher. The problem with morons like you is that you don't realize these people - people like me - are going to be released one day. Do you really want a man who has ben hardened bya decade of Darwinian brutality to be released on to the streets?

Let me see. I'm a moron, and you're the one that's been in jail. That's some logic you've got going there!

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Moratorium on Executions in California Proposed
Written for the web by C. Johnson, Internet News Producer

The controversy and publicity generated by the execution of Stanley Tookie Williams is focusing attention on a measure that would suspend California's death penalty law for three years.

Assembly Bill 1121 would put executions in the state on hold until January 1, 2009. The bill's authors say that would give lawmakers time to study a review of the state's death penalty procedures being undertaken by The California Commission on the Fair Administration of Justice. The commission is one year into its study, which must be completed by December 31, 2007. Legislators and criminal justice experts would have 2008 to go over the report and make recommendations, if necessary.

Unless lawmakers act on the recommendations or extend the suspension of the death penalty, the moratorium would end January 1, 2009.

With more than 100 death row convictions overturned since the 1970s because the accused were found to be innocent, the authors of "California Moratorium on Executions Act" say they fear an innocent person may be wrongly executed under current state procedures. "We can't gurantee that we don't have innocent people who have been put to death in California or will be," said AB 1121's co-author Sally Lieber, D-Mountain View.

Lieber said she wouldn't be surprised if a review of California's procedures reveal a troubled system similar to that in Illinois. In 2000, after 13 people on Illinois' death row were exonerated, Illinois Gov. George Ryan declared a moratorium on executions in his state. "There was evidence of racial bias and that situations like inadequate council in capital cases was affecting the number of cases that should be commuted," Lieber said.

Those who favor keeping California's capital punishment law in place argue death penalty cases are the mostly thoroughly reviewed of any criminal cases. "The amount of review, the Williams' case is one of them, 24 years in that case, hundreds of separate appeals. There are no cases in the country or in the world that are as closely looked at as a California death penalty case," said David LaBahn of the California District Attorneys Association.

Court challenges overturned California's death penalty law in 1967. It was reinstated in 1977. Since 1992, 12 inmates have been put to death. Two others are scheduled to be executed in January and February.

According to the state Department of Corrections, there are more than 640 men and women on death row in California.

AB 1121 is scheduled to be heard in committee next month. For the full text of AB 1121, click on the above weblink. http://www.news10.net/storyfull2.aspx?storyid=14772

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Stevepax wrote:

Let me see. I'm a moron, and you're the one that's been in jail. That's some logic you've got going there!

You may be surprised to learn this, but not everyone who goes to prison is a moron.

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Schwarzenegger Stadium in Austria to be renamed: report
Dec 15, 2005, 13:47 GMT

Graz - The Arnold Schwarzenegger Football Stadium in Austria's second-largest city Graz is to be renamed as a sign of displeasure with the city's most famous son, a local newspaper reported Thursday.

A majority of members on Graz City Council voted to rename the stadium after the Austrian-born governor of California approved the execution earlier this week of Stanley 'Tookie' Williams, according to Kleine Zeitung.

The Terminator-turned-governor was born six kilometres outside Graz in the community of Thal.

Representatives from the Social Democrats (SP), the Greens and the Communist Party (KP), traditionally strong in Graz, joined forces to push through the proposal, despite the objection of Mayor Siegfried Nagl of the conservative People's Party (VP).

'It's getting on our nerves that we're again and again being criticized for Schwarzenegger's actions in California,' said SP Vice Mayor Welter Ferk.

'We're not exactly basking in glory for being brought into the public limelight in connection with the death penalty. Therefore I'm in favour of renaming the stadium,' he added.

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You'll forgive me if I'm not shedding tears.

My remarks were aimed more at Death Row. If you read the part I posted about the amenities of Death Row you'll get that. I don't think being sheltered off from the rest of the prison population in a private room is punishment. Access to TV, computers and internet, in the room 23 out 24 hours, 3 regular meals a day, excellent health care, time to write childrens books, etc, etc, etc.

The very nature of the kind of crime it takes to reach Death Row would dictate hard time to me. I mean truly breaking rocks, very hard time. Back breaking, ball busting hard time! That's what I'm talking about. I think Tookey should have been left alive, with a drastic change in regimen.

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blueflame1 wrote:

Moratorium on Executions in California Proposed
Written for the web by C. Johnson, Internet News Producer

. . .

"There was evidence of racial bias and that situations like inadequate council in capital cases was affecting the number of cases that should be commuted," Lieber said. . . .

This sentence is atrocious. Lieber has murdered the English language. And, if the "internet news producer" is going to quote someone's words, he should attempt to quote those words correctly. The correct word is "counsel," NOT "council."

Clemency for Tookie?

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