Attack in London Today

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Well, those, who don't really know how to attack, just can go to the United Stae Justice Department's website and have a look there at the Al Qaeda Training Manual.

Gosh - keep that published but the damned Satanic Verses and the Anarchist Cookbook MUST be banned.

TTF

0 Replies

TTF wrote:

I, for one, am not willing to suspend my God given rights as a human to gain a little short terms freedom at the hands of fear mongers like terrorists or certain government officials.

Hmmm....you sound so sophisticated, blase, and utterly naive, when you talk about "God given rights" and "fear mongers". Those "God given" rights of yours were maintained by hundreds of thousands of brave men a women over the centuries and you dismiss them as something you deserve with a wave of the hand. Furthermore, your God given rights, have never been experienced by billions of people around the glode. How do you account for this?

I also question whether or not you would feel the same way about "fear mongers" if you had witnessed someone blown to bits in front of your eyes or if a member of your family had died at their hands. It is so easy to dismiss the reality of all the horror brought upon our society by these lunatics when you are so far removed by time and distance.

You might want to ask yourself why Steve has so suddenly shifted his stance and whether or not you might be forced to do the same one day soon.

0 Replies

rayban1 wrote:

You might want to ask yourself why Steve has so suddenly shifted his stance and whether or not you might be forced to do the same one day soon.

I am not sure what Steve's previous stance was, but it has been interesting for all of us to read his thoughts on terrorist attacks in his own city.

I, for one, have been wondering if I would have the same thoughts if Chicago was subjected to terrorist attacks.

This is not an easy issue to deal with.

0 Replies

rayban1 wrote:

TTF wrote:
I, for one, am not willing to suspend my God given rights as a human to gain a little short terms freedom at the hands of fear mongers like terrorists or certain government officials.

Hmmm....you sound so sophisticated, blase, and utterly naive, when you talk about "God given rights" and "fear mongers". Those "God given" rights of yours were maintained by hundreds of thousands of brave men a women over the centuries and you dismiss them as something you deserve with a wave of the hand. Furthermore, your God given rights, have never been experienced by billions of people around the glode. How do you account for this?

This is a very good point.

I suppose Bush thinks he will be able to sort the situation out, so that everyone can earn their "God given" right for freedom.

It is, rather silly, though, Rayban to forfeit a few civil liberties just for some security. In World War II, our countrymen fought for our country against the Nazi dictatorship, against that system that took away freedoms in the name of security. If not a "God given" right, then it is an insult to the memory of those that had fought so diligently against so great a foe.

All this talk about war is blowing things out of proportion.

It's giving these terrorists a better name than they deserve. They are not soldiers fighting a war. They're not freedom fighters. They're criminals. These are criminal acts and they shall be dealt with as criminals, not as soldiers.

Lash wrote:

Don't be too rough on Steve. A conservative is a liberal who has been mugged--or bombed.

Would you stop bandying about meaningless terms of conservative and liberal? The world is made of different strokes. Not the two.

It's all very well having these terms to try and simplify things, but as stated in another topic these terms are pretty much meaningless and not indicative of the true multi-layered nature of politics.

0 Replies

Wolf wrote:

If not a "God given" right, then it is an insult to the memory of those that had fought so diligently against so great a foe.

Wolf....I see you're in the sophisticated, blase, utterly naive camp. The God given rights that many people enjoy, and especially those in the UK and the US, were perhaps bestowed by the Creator at birth, but in all cases they were established and maintained by brave men and women. In those countries where the billions of people reside who do not have freedom, those god given rights have not yet been established by mankind. Comprehend?

0 Replies

[wandeljw wrote:

I, for one, have been wondering if I would have the same thoughts if Chicago was subjected to terrorist attacks.

Where the hell were you when the World Trade Centers imploded to a pile of rubble, blood and bone? Is Chicago so isolated from the world that you think it is on another planet?

Shocked

0 Replies

I would think that it would be different being attacked in your own city. I thought it was very clear what wandeljw was referring to.

0 Replies

Intrepid wrote:

I would think that it would be different being attacked in your own city. I thought it was very clear what wandeljw was referring to.

My God.....are you so utterly devoid of empathy that you must actually see someone blown to bits next door, before you can comprehend reality?

Now I begin to comprehend the magnitude of the perception void between left and right.....pragmatism and idealism.......open minded cognitive awareness and myopic left wing blindness.

Wow......pragmatic common sense has a mountain to climb if we ever hope to bridge that gap. We may be forced to create a whole new language that is not constrained by misperceptions of what our language actually means.

0 Replies

You certainly have a way of turning things around to suit your own agenda. I guess we will have to type more slowly so that you can comprehend what is written.

0 Replies

That was one of the most pathetic, self-serving performances i've ever had the misfortune to have read.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

That was one of the most pathetic, self-serving performances i've ever had the misfortune to have read.

Setanta
Are you so gutless that you won't dare to address whomever you are attempting to insult.

0 Replies

Oh, i had thought it was perfectly clear, do excuse me . . . your typical comments are pathetic and self-serving, apart from usually being idiotic.

Gutless? How very childish you always are, especially just before you begin ranting about maturity and civility.

That was one of your more disgusting performances, to put in language which i'm fairly certain even you will comprehend.

0 Replies

At this point I will be mature enough to insert a stopsign and to ask you to please call a halt to this insane "pissing contest" that is escalating between us. You have my pledge to do the same.
rayban

0 Replies

If i see you post idiocy, such as that drivel above, i will comment on it. Get over it.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

If i see you post idiocy, such as that drivel above, i will comment on it. Get over it.

I was merely attempting to show empathy for the other participants.....I can only hope I did not waste my effort. Many have stated a great distaste for our back and forth insulting and name calling. You have stated my lack of comprehension.......I can not comprehend your belligerence now when I ask for a truce. I can comprehend your contempt for my ideas but I cannot comprehend your apparent total disrespect for me as a person.

If this was a different time in history, one of us would now be dead from a duel with real weapons instead of words.

0 Replies

I would gladly offer my services as your second, Setanta Laughing

0 Replies

rayban1 wrote:

I was merely attempting to show empathy for the other participants.....I can only hope I did not waste my effort.

I was attempting to show empathy for Steve. Your response was nonsense, not empathy.

Also if this was "a different time", your rants would have been confined to a local tavern rather than the internet.

0 Replies

rayban1 wrote:

TTF wrote:
I, for one, am not willing to suspend my God given rights as a human to gain a little short terms freedom at the hands of fear mongers like terrorists or certain government officials.

Hmmm....you sound so sophisticated, blase, and utterly naive, when you talk about "God given rights" and "fear mongers". Those "God given" rights of yours were maintained by hundreds of thousands of brave men a women over the centuries and you dismiss them as something you deserve with a wave of the hand. Furthermore, your God given rights, have never been experienced by billions of people around the glode. How do you account for this?

I also question whether or not you would feel the same way about "fear mongers" if you had witnessed someone blown to bits in front of your eyes or if a member of your family had died at their hands. It is so easy to dismiss the reality of all the horror brought upon our society by these lunatics when you are so far removed by time and distance.

You might want to ask yourself why Steve has so suddenly shifted his stance and whether or not you might be forced to do the same one day soon.

Be careful Ray - I am a retired Marine who has lost quite a few friends in this war. My former unit has been there twice and is back again. Tread lightly.

I dismiss nothing - and I dismiss nothing lightly. Before you go forward in your argumentum ad hominem I fought for those very freedoms I defended in my post above. It offends me to use the soldiers names in the lessening of American liberty. I have no clue what you have seen - but I have seen enough.

The rights I am speaking to above are philosophical in nature - not political. Because many in the world have not realized these right means, generally, that other humans have abridged them. However, to restrict American rights in the name of rights is contradictory and counterproductive. I am speaking specifically about the concepts of liberty in all of its instantiations.

I am not willing to certainly give up my freedom for the argument that I may perhaps loose my life. I am willing to loose my life for freedom - I served my country because of this fact.

These should not be lessened due to a fear over life. Protect to the point of lack of restriction of liberty - that is all a free nation can do.

TTF

0 Replies

TTF

Please accept my total unconditional apology. I misinterpreted your words as those of a young college student who was enamored with some wording they just discovered and I was "shooting from the hip" in disgust because I had heard those words so many times from people who I believed had no conception of their true meaning.

I wore the US uniform for 20 years and I volunteered for Vietnam because I believed it was for a noble cause......I still believe it was a noble effort but fought in the wrong manner by a President who inherited it and was encapable of understanding how to fight it and by a Secretarty of Defense who also inherited it and couldn't bring himself to believe in it but who was so dishonest that he would not resign. But that's another story.

I have also seen enough that I become a little over zealous in stating my beliefs and to know that I don't want anyone to stare death in the face because they dismissed the threat with a wave of the hand.

0 Replies

Ray -

I can see how my words can be construed that way.

I understand your passion coming from your background. Thank you for your service - your sacrifice and others should be thanked more often.

You are completely forgiven on my account and it is nice to see a brother in arms feel so passionate and yet be enough of a man to admit (not when he was wrong) but when he made perhaps a misstep.

I think your last sentence gets a big 'no ****' from me (meaning 'I agree and understand'). I see others talk about war and death as if it were something that happens to others and something that will never happen to them.

I reread my and your post and I totally understand your point and where you were coming from.

Charlie Mike Rayban.

TTF

0 Replies

Attack in London Today

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know