6
   

What was Trump doing in the Middle East?

 
 
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 08:55 pm
@oralloy,
Is there a two state Israel?

No.

Rejected.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:08 pm
@neptuneblue,
Israel has not rejected any proposals made by Bill Clinton, Obama/Kerry, or Donald Trump.
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:11 pm
@oralloy,
They haven't accepted it either.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:11 pm
@neptuneblue,
Yes they have.
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:14 pm
@oralloy,
Really. News to the world.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:21 pm
@neptuneblue,
It shouldn't be. The peace process was covered pretty thoroughly in the news.

Mr. Netanyahu's recent acceptance of Mr. Trump's proposal was pretty open and public.
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:26 pm
@oralloy,
Huh.

Yet I have not heard of this 2 state Israel policy going into effect.

Go figure.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:32 pm
@neptuneblue,
The two-state solution does not go into effect because Palestinians are war criminals who refuse to ever make peace.

Neither Israel nor Donald Trump are responsible for Palestinian aggression. Palestinians are responsible for their own aggression.
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:35 pm
@oralloy,
So, you lied. There is no 2 state policy.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:39 pm
@neptuneblue,
You cannot point out anything untrue in any of my posts. Your own history of dishonesty and dishonorable behavior is quite long however.

There is very much a proposal for a two-state solution. And Israel has repeatedly accepted it.
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:41 pm
@oralloy,
A proposal isn't a policy in effect.

Your own history of presenting opinion in lieu of fact is egregious. Stop lying.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:47 pm
@neptuneblue,
The only person here who is lying is you. Your lack of honor and integrity is quite shameful.

I do not provide opinions "in lieu of" facts. I provide a copious amount of facts to go along with my opinions.
neptuneblue
 
  3  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:51 pm
@oralloy,
You offered:

Quote:
The two-state solution does not go into effect because Palestinians are war criminals who refuse to ever make peace.


That, in fact, is a lie. There is no policy that will go into effect.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 09:58 pm
@neptuneblue,
Wrong again. My statement there is entirely true.

Even if I had been mistaken, my statement still would not be a lie. But since I am 100% correct, we don't need to go into that.
neptuneblue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 10:03 pm
@oralloy,
We don't need to get into how you present your opinion as bull ****. A story for another day.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 10:10 pm
@neptuneblue,
I don't present my opinions as BS. I have a lot of respect for my opinions.

It's almost as if you were desperate to fling an insult there, but you just weren't quite smart enough to come up with something that made any sense.

I can't fault you for your lack of intelligence, but shame on you for resorting to name-calling.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 10:18 pm
@neptuneblue,
Quote:
We don't need to get into how you present your opinion as bull ****. A story for another day.

Someone has lost the argument and is crabby.
InfraBlue
 
  4  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 11:00 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
Your claims about international law are not true.

Yes they are.

oralloy wrote:

International law does give Israel the right to exist.

Not when Israel's existence is predicated on the oppression of the Palestinians.

oralloy wrote:

International law does give Israel the right to use military force to protect their existence.

Not when Israel's existence is predicated on the oppression of the Palestinians.

oralloy wrote:

International law says that Palestinians are war criminals for pledging unending war against Israel until they are destroyed.

No it doesn't.

oralloy wrote:

Your claims about DNA, history, and archaeology are also not true.

Yes they are.

oralloy wrote:

DNA, history, and archaeology show quite clearly that Zionists are the original indigenous population of the West Bank area.

No they don't.


oralloy wrote:

By refusing to ever make peace with Israel until they are destroyed, Palestinians forfeit their right to any land in the West Bank. International law does not require Israel to give land to a race of war criminals who refuse to ever make peace. Now it is OK for Israel to take whatever land they want and give Palestinians nothing at all.

That's completely wrong.

oralloy wrote:

Since they have to go someplace, Palestinians will likely still end up with the Gaza Strip. But Palestinians should not expect to be able to keep living in the West Bank. Nor should they expect any land swap to compensate them for their loss of the West Bank.

Nor should Israel expect peace.

oralloy wrote:

We may as well start referring to Palestinians as Gazans, because that is what they are now.

Your delusions are duly noted.

oralloy wrote:

Threats that Israel will not see peace if they do this are empty and hollow. You've already pledged that Israel will never see peace until they are destroyed. So if Israel takes the West Bank for themselves and gives Palestinians nothing beyond the Gaza Strip, any violence that Palestinians offer in response will be no different from what those Palestinians would be doing anyway.

So Israel will never see peace.

oralloy wrote:

Your hopes for Palestinian violence are somewhat forlorn as well. Israel is doing a pretty good job of walling Palestinians off so they cannot harm people. And if Palestinians get too rambunctious, it is pretty easily for Israel to bomb them relentlessly until they give up and settle down again.

So the Israelis are war criminals that will never see peace and their state must be eliminated and replaced with a truly democratic one for all peoples in Palestine. Understood.
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 17 Feb, 2020 11:14 pm
@InfraBlue,
Quote:
replaced with a truly democratic one for all peoples in Palestine. Understood.

What is understood is Islam wants nothing to do with democracy. That you can lie like that is even more reason to ignore your hateful non fact based opinion. The only fact you have is Islam's hate for Jews.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 18 Feb, 2020 12:18 am
@InfraBlue,
No. Your claims about international law are completely untrue. You should familiarize yourself with UN Security Council Resolution 242.

In particular this part:
Quote:
1. Affirms that the fulfilment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
Quote:
(ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force;
https://unispal.un.org/dpa/dpr/unispal.nsf/0/7d35e1f729df491c85256ee700686136


You should also read the UN Charter, particularly this part of Article 2:
Quote:
4. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations.
https://www.un.org/en/sections/un-charter/chapter-i/index.html


So Israel does have the right to exist under international law.



You are similarly ignorant of DNA, history, and archaeology. There is clear evidence that Zionists are the original indigenous population of the West Bank area.

As one example of this:
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/epiphenom/2009/01/shared-genetic-heritage-of-jews-and.html



And no, "Land for Peace" does not ask Israel to give up land to someone who refuses to make peace. If Israel will never see peace, then Palestinians will never be given any land outside the Gaza Strip.

Calling them Gazans is no delusion if the Gaza Strip is the only land that they will ever have.
 

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