29
   

Why I left the Democratic Party

 
 
camlok
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 28 Jan, 2018 07:47 pm
@layman,
You too, and a lot of others, layman. How do you figure hijackers were able to melt WTC steel, how were they able to vaporize WTC steel?

This photo is from FEMA.

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-62abcbaaa641bb9170b15db20eb1110f-c

None of the alleged hijackers want anything to do with the Dem Party, the Repuglican Party or the wholly crooked USA.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 28 Jan, 2018 08:06 pm
@camlok,
Weren't you suspended once for off-topic 9/11 gibberish?

I'm not reporting you or anything. I'd just hate to see you suspended again.

Why don't you forget about the off-topic 9/11 gibberish, come on over to the Hiroshima thread, and post some tasty Hiroshima gibberish for me to munch on?

Note that regardless of your choice, I'm bored with 9/11 gibberish, and will not be responding to that sort of gibberish in any thread.
camlok
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 28 Jan, 2018 08:43 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
I'm bored with 9/11 gibberish,


That is one of a number of similar memes that screams,

"Holy ****, if that is true, and it has to be, how could alleged hijackers with jet fuel/office furnishings [max 1,500F] vaporize WTC steel [4,000+F]? I just saw the pic of WTC7 vaporized steel!! Discovered, studied and reported by FEMA, a US government agency.

That leads me to the inescapable conclusion that my government has unjustly accused many millions of people, most of all OBL and the totally unproven 19 Arab hijackers. And murdered some 3,000 of my own. I better use my escape meme."


Quote:
I'm not reporting you or anything.


Don't worry, there are many slime balls who don't give a rat's ass about freedom of speech or the truth.
0 Replies
 
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Sun 28 Jan, 2018 08:58 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
come on over to the Hiroshima thread, and post some tasty Hiroshima gibberish for me to munch on?

I was going to say the same thing to you.
Real Music
 
  2  
Reply Sun 28 Jan, 2018 09:57 pm

Rachel Maddow Explores Right Wing Lying Echo Chamber
(November 2010)

0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 28 Jan, 2018 11:17 pm
@Glennn,
Glennn wrote:
I was going to say the same thing to you.

That wouldn't make much sense. I'm already posting in the Hiroshima thread. And I'm not making off topic posts in this thread -- unless this post I'm making right now counts as off topic (the thread isn't supposed to be about me, and I doubt that Edgar would appreciate having his thread derailed).

JTT/Camlok has in the past cut-n-pasted volumes of anti-Hiroshima nonsense. Some of the nonsense (while still ultimately nonsense) was of a much higher quality than the run of the mill Hiroshima nonsense, and I enjoyed having to confront arguments that were a bit more challenging than what I usually face.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  5  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 05:23 am
Please please please do not ruin another thread with this nonsense.
camlok
 
  -4  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 08:29 am
@maporsche,
Isn't "truth and justice" the American way, maporsche?

What part of totally impossible do you not understand?
0 Replies
 
camlok
 
  -4  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 08:51 am
@maporsche,
Just two posts before yours, m, the following was posted, Rachel Maddow Explores Right Wing Lying Echo Chamber .

Aren't lies of this magnitude, of this seriousness being spoken, screamed out by the silence everyday?

Again, you are not facing nor are you and others facing up to the fact that this picture of molten and vaporized WTC steel, taken and described by FEMA, can not possibly have happened, that is it is a totally impossible event according to the Republican and Democratic Parties' shared fable.

There are myriad other eyewitness reports of molten steel in the ruins of the twin towers and WTC 7. Even from Leslie Robertson, one of the designers of the twin towers described "a little river of flowing molten steel".

Aren't lies of this magnitude, lies of this significance, lies of this weightiness, a really good reason why everyone should leave the Democratic Party and the Republican Party?
0 Replies
 
Below viewing threshold (view)
camlok
 
  -4  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 09:51 am
@layman,
Quote:
This Man Decided To Put "Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams" Conspiracy Theory To The Test

https://www.buzzfeed.com/javiermoreno/this-blacksmith-addresses-the-jet-fuel-cant-melt-steel-beams?utm_term=.slOoz3nJN#.pvaoqV0gr


No, that isn't at all what he tried to do, layman. He actually helped prove that the US government official story is impossible.

You only illustrate your ignorance and that of most Americans/people on this issue.

Even the Buzzfeed article illustrates a high degree of ignorance. They call the 1/2" steel rod used by Tye a "half inch steel beam".

"To illustrate his point, Tye uses a half-inch steel beam ... "

It was NOT a steel beam Tye used. He couldn't lift a steel beam.

What you should notice, and this is crucial, so pay attention, is that even though Tye heated his 1/2" steel rod in a forced air forge he was not able to melt it.

WTC temperatures were nowhere near that of a forge. They were, in fact, not above 800 C/1,472F. That is about 1,300 degrees F below the melting point of steel.

And these maximum WTC temperatures mean air temperatures, not the temperature of the massive steel beams/columns. NIST, itself described that it had found no steel that had risen to temperatures above 250C/482F.

Something else that had no legal/legitimate reason to be at WTC was used to melt/vaporize WTC steel.

The WTC steel had been VAPORIZED, as described by FEMA, as anyone can plainly see by looking at the picture. The boiling temperatures of iron is over 5,100 degrees F.

As you and everyone can plainly see, jet fuel and office furnishings can't come close to melting steel, let alone vaporizing it. Science doesn't lie. But we all know who does.

There is no better reason in the world for leaving the two US parties. They really ought to be disbanded and all who voted for the illegal invasions of I & A sent to prison.
layman
 
  -3  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 10:31 am
@camlok,
OK, just rave on, Cambo. Aint nobody gunna listen, but hijack away, perv.
camlok
 
  -4  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 12:11 pm
@layman,
Quote:
Aint nobody gunna listen,


That certainly is a telling remark as to the state of the "adults" here at A2K, layman.

That is so decidedly un-American. Americans always face the truth, truth is supposed to be of their essence. Discussion leading to the truth is supposed to be of great importance to Americans.

Instead we have children who steadfastly refuse to face up to reality.

This illustrates just how dismal are the two parties, just how dismal Congress is, the presidency is, just how dismal the entire US political and legal system is.

And its citizenry, good dog almighty, are there bigger intellectual cowards anywhere in the world? Of course this doesn't apply just to Americans as there are these same intellectual cowards from other countries too.

Why do supposedly sentient adults refuse to address simple truths, even simpler science, incredibly simple logic. These incontrovertible facts are available to everyone, from your own government and its agencies.

FEMA hasn't been disbanded, has it? Are they still doing science?
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 01:20 pm
http://therealnews.com/t2/story:20753:Undoing-the-New-Deal%3A--Eisenhower-Builds-an-Arsenal-of-Nuclear-Weapons-and-a-%0D%0ACabinet-of-Millionair
So, we're picking up the tale, sort of after Truman comes Eisenhower. There's been an ongoing debate in the United States, and it's still not over, about the relationship of military spending and social programs and where is the money gonna come from to pay for the social safety net to pay for the New Deal. The right-wing conservatives, they have always, and this has been going on for a long time but of course, we're seeing a renewed bout of it now. In fact, as we talk, the Republicans are passing new tax legislation and essentially it's lower taxes, lots of military spending, and taken out of social programs. This debate ain't new, so talk a bit how this reflects itself toward the end of Truman and the Eisenhower years.
PETER KUZNICK: One of the things we need to mention to start off with is NSC-68. NSC-68 was proposed in 1950. It was drafted largely by Paul Nitze, who was very, very hawkish. NSC-68 was a new approach to defense spending. It called basically for quadrupling America's defense spending. The idea was that now American policy has to be based on not what the Soviet Union was likely to do, but what the Soviet Union was capable of doing in a worst-case scenario. It looked like it was dead on arrival when it was first introduced in 1950.
However, the Korean War intervened. Once the Korean War started on a large scale, then they were able to push NSC-68 through. So, we see as after World War II, the demobilization, the decrease in defense spending, Truman tries to ramp it up again in 1946/1947 and then we've got a slow but steady increase in defense spending up to 1950. Then we see a quadrupling in defense spending. So, the military budget has gotten tremendously bloated between 1950, when NSC-68 was introduced and 1953, when the Korean War finally comes to a halt.
PAUL JAY: We've talked about to a large extent was the response to the deep crisis of unemployment, deep crisis of global capitalism, but by the end, coming out after the Second World War, most of the American elites don't think there needs to be such an appeasement with the American workers. A lot of the elites want to undo some of those reforms. You have this big increase in military spendings. You have the Cold War, which helps justify all this. You have McCarthyism and, as we talked about earlier, even before McCarthy starts holding his hearings, there's congressional hearings of Un-American Activities Committee purging the unions, purging schools, purging government, purging Hollywood of progressives and left-wingers. So, it's all in this environment that the 1950s evolves. So, what happens to the New Deal-type reforms as Eisenhower comes to power in all of this?
PETER KUZNICK: Well, Eisenhower is a particularly interesting figure. He's a military man but he's a military man in a new era, in the nuclear era. I think it was three days before Eisenhower was elected in November of 1952, the United States tested its first hydrogen bomb. It was over the island of Elugelab. There was a mushroom cloud something like 60 miles long and the island of Elugelab disappeared into the sea. It was gone. That was our first hydrogen bomb test.
Eisenhower's vision was that the greatest threat to the United States economically and security-wise was an unbalanced budget. He thought we could sink ourselves by too much spending. So, Eisenhower's strategy was to actually cut defense spending. Eisenhower wanted to effectively minimize the army and go with the Air Force and our nuclear programs. The reason why Eisenhower was so hawkish when it came to nuclear weapons was because they were so much less expensive, they believed, than conventional defense spending.
So, what we see with Eisenhower is when Eisenhower takes office, United States has a little bit more than 1,000 nuclear weapons. When Eisenhower leaves office, United States has more than 22,000 nuclear weapons. When Eisenhower's budget cycle is finished, United States has almost 30,000 nuclear weapons. So, that was the bargain that Eisenhower made with the devil, that the United States would be able to cut defense spending, cut budgets overall in the 1950s, but do so by this massive increase in nuclear weapons. So, the vision that a lot of the scientists had and Henry Wallace had in 1945, this fear of this apocalypse that we were creating potentially, now came to fruition under Eisenhower. We've got the capability, this overkill capacity, by the end of the Eisenhower administration to not only eliminate ourselves, let's eliminate everybody on the planet several times over.
PAUL JAY: Eisenhower often gets quoted, there’'s this famous quote of Eisenhower about "Beware of the military-industrial complex." But when you read that, it's not that he doesn't think there needs to be a military-industrial complex, he does, he just thinks beware of how the political effect of having such a massive part of the economy devoted to arms manufacturing. But he's not really for minimizing it, he's just for being beware of it.
PETER KUZNICK: He's afraid that it was growing out of control and he had good reason to fear that because he had created the military-industrial complex. Eisenhower, almost as much as anybody, perhaps more than anybody else, can be considered the father of the military-industrial complex, in the worse sense of the military-industrial complex, in the sense that we're creating the seeds of our own annihilation through this process.
So, it wasn't only the extent to which they subverted normal democracy in America, and we've seen the effects of the arms lobby. In fact, in the original draft of the speech that Malcolm Moos from Johns Hopkins had written of the military-industrial complex speech, along with Williams, they talked about the merchants of death. They go back to the 1930s term that was so popular to talk about the arms merchants from World War I, and they bring that up at the first draft. Eisenhower said he wanted to go with that kind of vision about a military establishment that was out of control, in bed with industry, threatening us all, but his final version was not actually as strong as the initial versions that were drafted for that speech.
PAUL JAY: Now, what happens in terms of the New Deal legislation during Eisenhower?
PETER KUZNICK: Well, I think that Adlai Stevenson probably got it correct. Adlai Stevenson was the Democratic candidate who ran against Eisenhower in 1952. Eisenhower said "The New Dealers have all left Washington and been replaced by the car dealers," and that was the Eisenhower administration. It was a cabinet of millionaires. Now, that's not so shocking. Now, we've got a cabinet of billionaires. But the idea in the 1950s that you would have a cabinet of millionaires seemed obscene to many people, and so Eisenhower told them be careful. Let's not say anything that's gonna offend public sensitivities when it comes to how wealthy this cabinet is.
Unfortunately, they didn't all get the message. There were two Charles E. Wilsons at the time. There was “Engine Charlie,” the head of GM and then there was “Electric Charlie,” the head of GE. Well, “Engine Charlie” became the Defense Secretary in the 1950s. He made some comments talking about the unemployed as kennel-fed dogs, which is the opposite message that Eisenhower's trying to set. The word started to spread at time that Wilson, when he was head of GM, developed the automatic transmission so he'd always have one foot free to put in his mouth.
But this was the kind of cabinet that they had, it was a very wealthy cabinet and the administration policies, Eisenhower was fortunate, in a sense, that the 1950s were a time of relative prosperity in the United States in which everybody seemed to be, standards of living seemed to be improving across the board. Of course, they went up faster for some people than they did for others but there was still a time despite the fact that there was a major recession in '57, that there were periodic declines in the 1950s but it was a time of relative stability. You have to remember, the '50s was the time when we have suburbanization, we have a rapidly growing middle class and you've got people buying cars, buying automobiles, buying their own homes. The GI Bill made a lot of this possible.
Now, the people who benefited the most from the GI Bill were mostly whites, of course, but they moved out to the suburbs and so you've got these Levittown kind of communities developing. Many of them had covenants that said they weren't even allowed to let blacks move in, other minorities move in. This was a time when the Donald Trump Seniors, the Fred Trumps, are having their restrictive covenants in their housing, in the apartments that they're building, or they're refusing to rent to African Americans. So, you've got this white suburbanization process developing in the 1950s at a time, again, of relative prosperity. And so...
PAUL JAY: Can I add when you, I think it's important to say “relative prosperity” because-
PETER KUZNICK: Relative...
PAUL JAY: ... it was these sort of upper sections of the working class, the unionized sections in places like auto that were doing very well. The poverty rate was actually was very high.
PETER KUZNICK: And that's why there's gonna be a war on poverty in the 1960s, because poverty had not been eliminated, certainly. But we see the rise of the gun belt in the 1950s, rise of places like Los Angeles, the Southwest, Atlanta, areas that are gonna be profiting from the vast defense spending and the aerospace industry. We gotta remember the aerospace is really gonna get a huge boost in the 1950s, especially in the aftermath of Sputnik. We're gonna see a shift in the economy once the Soviets launch Sputnik, which was launched on October 4th, 1957.
Sputnik, Eisenhower downplays the effects of that. He says "Oh, I'm not impressed. They've launched one small ball into space." He says, "Not a big deal." In fact, he went out and played, I think it was five rounds of golf that week to show that he wasn't impressed with Sputnik. However, the next month, November 1st, the Soviets launched Sputnik 2. Now, this is serious. Not only did they send the dog into space but Sputnik 2 weighs six tons. That creates a tremendous crisis in American society because the Soviets had already tested an intercontinental ballistic missile prior to launching Sputnik 1, and the Americans started to panic. We set up a committee, the Gaither Committee, which issues a very, very frightening report. The Washington Post has a big front-page article saying that the United States is now facing the gravest crisis in its history. This is an existential crisis for the United States.
The view in the United States was that the, not only in the United States, actually around the world, was that the Soviets were ahead of the United States in scientific, technological and defense capabilities. Of course, it wasn't true. Allen Dulles later commented, he said, the head of the CIA, or I think it was Allen Dulles, might have been John Foster Dulles, who said "I wasn't concerned. I could see every blade of grass in the Soviet Union. I knew exactly what they had and I knew how far ahead we were." Eisenhower had that same sense of certainty and security because we were having our U-2 flights and we were actually getting very, very good intelligence and we knew the Soviets were not ahead. The Soviets were actually far behind the United States but we still increased defense spending.
Eisenhower actually tried to tamp down the fears and tamp down the increase in defense spending, again, fearing we would bankrupt ourselves. But there is a lot of pressure then to reform America's education system. The question was, while we're so concerned with how plush the carpet is gonna be and with the fins on our cars, while the Soviets are spending money on education, on science and technology and they've outflanked the United States and they're far ahead of us. That becomes a crucial issue in American society. The Democrats realize they've got an issue that can put them back in the White House. They can use this to run against the Republicans in 1960. Lyndon Johnson's aides give him a memo that Johnson later trumpets, that says this is gonna put the Democrats not only in control of both houses but also in control of the White House again.
And Kennedy, John Kennedy is one of the ones who runs based upon what was called then the “Missile Gap,” the idea that the Soviets have got a vast abundance, a vast superiority in missiles, intercontinental ballistic missiles over the United States. And so, Kennedy and others do a lot of fear mongering about that, attack the Eisenhower administration for being weak on defense, for allowing the Soviets to get ahead of us and then in 1959, allowing the Cuban Revolution, a Communist revolution, 90 miles off the coast of Florida. This all comes together and becomes crucial in the 1960 election when Kennedy defeats Nixon very, very narrowly despite all that Kennedy had going for him.
PAUL JAY: Now, I think it's important to kind of elaborate that sections of the American working class really benefited from all of this militarization. They benefited from the Post-War Expansion. Europe had been laid waste and so had the Soviet Union. American capital and goods were expanding all over the world. American hegemony was being asserted. A section of the American working class was going very well in riding this gravy train but a large section was not, and it wasn't just all black. Unorganized white workers were not doing anywhere near as unionized white workers were. A real division was developing and this starts to build up as we head into the '60s. But when we get to Kennedy, we actually see another leap in militarization.
PETER KUZNICK: One of the things that we saw in the '50s, as we discussed, the Labor Movement takes a big hit when the Communists are forced out of the unions. But in the mid 50s, you have a pretty conservative leadership under...but you've got the merger of the AFL and CIO in mid-decade, which is gonna give the Labor Movement a little more strength. You've got the Reuther wing of the Labor Movement, the industrial unions that really had been making progress in the '40s and '50s.
I think, and don't quote me on this for sure, but I think the percentage of American workers who were in unions peaks around 1948 but it's still strong in the 1950s. It's not until the 1950s that we begin to see a relative decline in the industrial sector compared to service and white-collar kinds of jobs. But American industry is still thriving and going strong in the 1950s. Based upon that, you've got more and more workers being brought into the middle class, or at least into having what we defined then as middle class standards of living, suburban lifestyles, owning their own homes, and so you've got a big, expanding middle class in the 1950s. But as you were saying, many, many, many workers are gonna be left behind and we're gonna see the relative decline in the percentage of workers who are unionized beginning in the 1950s really.
PAUL JAY: And with Kennedy, as I said and you said, I think it's actually the largest increase in military spending, was it, in US history, outside of a war? Am I right in the ...
PETER KUZNICK: I'm not sure if you're right in terms of the largest increase but we do so a sharp increase in military spending. I like to divide the Kennedy presidency into two periods: from Kennedy's election until the Cuban Missile Crisis in October of '62, Kennedy is a real defense hawk. Kennedy is a Cold War liberal from '60 to '62, but then Kennedy sees the light in '62. And the last year of Kennedy's presidency, he's trying to roll back the hawkish Cold War policies that defines his earliest presidency. He begins, I guess off on a very bad foot with the Bay of Pigs. It was a fiasco. It was Trump-esque in its absurdity. Kennedy-
PAUL JAY: For people that, get it really fast for people that don't know what the Bay of Pigs was.
PETER KUZNICK: In April of '62, the United States-
PAUL JAY: You're gonna have to, well, let's wait till that's over or take it off or something.
PETER KUZNICK: It'll just stop in a second. Okay, ready?
PAUL JAY: Let me think about ... We're at 20 minutes now. Alright. Well, let's really quick, we'll do what Bay of Pigs is and then we'll probably, is there anything specific about Kennedy and the New Deal legislation? Does he do any of that kinda reform stuff?
PETER KUZNICK: Not really. Kennedy didn't achieve very much in terms of domestic policy.
PAUL JAY: Well, we should say that. Okay. Well, let's start with Bay of Pigs and then we'll maybe end with that. Okay, go ahead. The Bay of Pigs.
PETER KUZNICK: Yes. Kennedy inherited a plan from the Eisenhower/Nixon administration to overthrow the Castro government in Cuba. The CIA trained a large force of Cuban exiles to invade Cuba in 1961 with the understanding, the promise that they would be greeted as liberators when they arrived and the Cuban people would rise up and overthrow the Castro administration. Kennedy had his doubts from the beginning. He warned people that he was not gonna send in American forces to back up this Cuban exile force if they were in trouble. The assumption in the intelligence community and the Pentagon was that Kennedy would be forced to do so. So, the group goes in there, they invade, there's no public uprising in support. The Cubans were ready for them. They captured or killed the entire invading force. It was a fiasco.
In the midst of it, you had the heads of the CIA and top officials of the Pentagon who had a midnight meeting with Kennedy, saying "You've gotta send in the American forces to bail them out." Kennedy refused to do so. That's when Kennedy begins to develop his doubts about the wisdom of the military and the intelligence people. He refers to the "CIA bastards, those joint chief sons of bitches." He takes the power away from the CIA. He puts the CIA in every country under the ambassadors in those countries.
He says "I'm gonna smash the CIA into a thousand pieces and scatter it in the winds." He says to his closest advisors, he says "If somebody comes in to talk to me about unemployment...," he said, "I can challenge him, I can debate with them." He says "But the military and the intelligence people, you always assume they've got some kind of superior understanding intelligence and insight." He says "I've learned my lesson." Another occasion, he said "First thing I'm gonna tell my successor is don't trust the military." He says "Even on military matters, they don't necessarily know what they're talking about." So, Kennedy learned a very important lesson at the Bay of Pigs and he begins to doubt the military.
But then in June, he's got a disastrous meeting with Khrushchev in Geneva and then after that things get very tense, and in July of 1961, we've got the crisis beginning, the Berlin Crisis. Kennedy makes a speech July 25th, which he announces an increase of defense spending of $3.45 billion. That sounds like chump change now compared to the level of defense spending we have, but at the time, that was considered an astronomical increase. Kennedy calls for a 25% increase in the size of the army. He wants to call up National Guards, call up American Troops, reservists as well. He calls for a big fallout shelter-building program in the United States. And then the Soviets respond with building the Berlin Wall.
Kennedy actually says that "In some ways, that's a relief because a wall is a lot better than a war," because it looked like the US and the Soviet Union were about to go to war in the summer of 1961. But then we've got this increase in harsh rhetoric continuing through 1962, continuing through the very, very, very dangerous Cuban Missile Crisis in October of 1962.
PAUL JAY: Alright, Peter. Let's pick this up in the next part. We'll talk about the nature of the Cuban Missile Crisis. But as the main focus of our series is on what happens to domestic legislation, but you can't look at domestic legislation without looking at the military expenditure, as I said in the beginning. So, these two questions go together and obviously continue to. Alright. Thanks, Peter. And thank you for joining us on The Real News Network. Join us for the next segment in our series with Peter Kuznick on Undoing the New Deal on The Real News Network.
Comments
Baldimo
 
  -4  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 01:22 pm
@layman,
I've noticed that there is no mention of some study he talked about all last year, that was suppose to be completed in 2017. No word must mean the study was a bust, hence the reason he is still using the same old BS to push his propaganda.

camlok
 
  0  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 03:07 pm
@edgarblythe,
This puts to rest the silly ideas that Eisenhower was some kind, benevolent man worried about mankind, speaking out against the MIC, doesn't it, Edgar?

He was, as every US president since WWII has been, just another war criminal/terrorist.

"Well, what about Eisenhower? You could argue over whether his overthrow of the government of Guatemala was a crime. There was a CIA-backed army, which went in under U.S. threats and bombing and so on to undermine that capitalist democracy. I think that’s a crime. The invasion of Lebanon in 1958, I don’t know, you could argue. A lot of people were killed. The overthrow of the government of Iran is another one — through a CIA-backed coup. But Guatemala suffices for Eisenhower and there’s plenty more." - Noam Chomsky

That begs the question,

Why did you, anyone, ever join the Democratic Party?



0 Replies
 
camlok
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 29 Jan, 2018 03:21 pm
@Baldimo,
The University of Alaska study is as conclusive as all the other evidence you are desperately trying to avoid, Baldimo.

Its conclusion: "There is zero chance that the NIST investigation has any chance of being accurate as to how WTC7 came down. You can't get lower than zero.

But everyone knew that long before the study was started. NIST admitted, actually, the gross liars at NIST were forced to admit, that WTC7 fell at free fall speed.

These faux scientists were trying to pass off yet another of their famous panoply of lies and they were caught outright in that lie. You should see the video of their squirming and fidgeting. It's a joy to see liars caught like that.

That too is a total impossibility for a gravity collapse. The ONLY way it can happen, the only way it has ever happened, the only way it will ever happen in the future is with a controlled demolition.

That is the very definition of free fall - no structural resistance at all.

How do you think Democratic Party Congress folks, Republicans too, think that the alleged hijackers were able to melt and vaporize WTC steel?

How did all the molten steel last in the rubble until February 2002?

Quote:
As late as five months after the attacks, in February 2002, firefighter Joe O’Toole sees a steel beam being lifted from deep underground at Ground Zero, which, he says, “was dripping from the molten steel.” [KNIGHT RIDDER, 5/29/2002]


Why don't you return your membership card? You don't like supporting people who support those who murdered about 2900 Americans/westerners, do you?

What better reason can anyone have for abandoning these two criminal political parties than they support people who will kill your own.

And remember, in March of 2017, in a PEOPLE Magazine interview, George Bush described the bombs and explosions that were going off in the twin towers, concussing the firemen and first responders.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 30 Jan, 2018 04:22 am
@edgarblythe,
edgarblythe wrote:
Eisenhower's vision was that the greatest threat to the United States economically and security-wise was an unbalanced budget. He thought we could sink ourselves by too much spending. So, Eisenhower's strategy was to actually cut defense spending. Eisenhower wanted to effectively minimize the army and go with the Air Force and our nuclear programs. The reason why Eisenhower was so hawkish when it came to nuclear weapons was because they were so much less expensive, they believed, than conventional defense spending.

Ike wasn't hawkish when it came to nuclear weapons. The man was a bloody menace to US security.

Ike was the one who established the rule that we could not hit a target with a weapon larger than 2MT unless the military could first justify why a lower-yield weapon was not sufficient to destroy the target.

When the military made a proposal for weapon systems that would be able to destroy 90% of Soviet weapons, Ike told them that he'd be happy with the ability to destroy 70% of their weapons.

And Ike continuously undermined the development of large weapons by publicly lying that there were no plans to test weapons larger than 15MT, and then when the weapons labs tried to go forward with such tests, Ike would tell them that they'd be making a liar out of him if they did.

Ike made a liar out of himself. Why American defense should suffer because of his lies no one has ever been able to explain.
camlok
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 30 Jan, 2018 09:24 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
The man was a bloody menace to US security.


The man, a Class A war criminal, like all the other presidents, was a menace to world security and the safety of innocents.

Quote:
Well, what about Eisenhower? You could argue over whether his overthrow of the government of Guatemala was a crime. There was a CIA-backed army, which went in under U.S. threats and bombing and so on to undermine that capitalist democracy. I think that’s a crime. The invasion of Lebanon in 1958, I don’t know, you could argue. A lot of people were killed. The overthrow of the government of Iran is another one — through a CIA-backed coup. But Guatemala suffices for Eisenhower and there’s plenty more.
https://chomsky.info/1990____-2/



Quote:
Ike made a liar out of himself. Why American defense should suffer because of his lies no one has ever been able to explain.


All US presidents are Class A liars, as are most USians.

Look at all the lies of 911 that were told and swallowed whole by people who REALLY do know better.

Arab hijackers simply could not suspend Newton's Laws of Motion and cause WTC7 to fall at free fall speed. You all know this is true.

Arab hijackers simply could not suspend Newton's Laws of Motion and cause the twin towers to fall at accelerating speeds. You all know this is true.

Arab hijackers simply could not melt and VAPORIZE WTC steel with jet fuel/office furnishing fires. You all know this is true.

Why so much absolutely stunning cowardly intellectual behavior?
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 30 Jan, 2018 11:33 am
By Michael Sainato
Several grassroots and progressive congressional candidates are facing expensive lawsuits from the Democratic establishment, which is challenging their ballot petitions in hopes of clearing the primary field.

Anthony Clark was one of the first congressional candidates to receive the backing of Brand New Congress, an organization founded in late 2016 by former Bernie Sanders staffers aimed at replacing current members of Congress, Republican and Democrat. Clark is running as a Democrat against Rep. Danny K. Davis (D-IL), who has held the seat of Illinois’ 7th Congressional District since 1997. Davis’ campaign has tried to file several legal complaints to remove Clark and another primary opponent, Ahmed Salim.

On January 22, a judge overruled several objections filed by incumbent Rep. Davis’ surrogates, former State Senator Ricky Hendon and his staffer Cherita Logan, that alleged Clark’s signatures to get on the ballot were fraudulently obtained. This week, the board of elections will decide on whether to accept the judge’s recommendations.

The Davis campaign’s efforts to remove Clark from the ballot failed, but they did force Clark to spend vital campaign resources on legal fees. “At the end of the signature challenge it was clear, we were roughly 497 signatures over the minimum requirements,” Clark told The Real News Network. “It was his strategy to keep us off the campaign trail to have us expend a lot of our money. After that, instead of being done, he had his lawyer file a Rule 8 motion.”

That motion claimed Clark and his mother fraudulently obtained signatures to make the ballot, and targeted signatures from lower income communities where it would be more difficult to subpoena individuals to deny the claims. Clark noted, “A lot of their evidence was thrown out because it was hearsay. They tried to get notaries sign off on basically third-person accounts.”

According to Clark, his campaign spent $12,000 on legal fees and had to coordinate for people to testify on his behalf. He alleged Davis supporters engaged in intimidation tactics against his campaign throughout the process, from harassing phone calls to social media trolling. Throughout this entire process, Clark’s campaign was essentially on pause, and many local activist groups and organizations were apprehensive about formally supporting his campaign until his place on the ballot was secure.

The court hearing officer ruled in favor of objections made by the same Rep. Davis campaign surrogates against the third candidate in the race, Ahmed Salim, who will not be on the ballot as a result. “It is sad to see individuals who work for a politician take advantage of the system in order to protect their own interests,” Salim told The Real News Network in an interview. “If challengers are pushed off the ballot as a campaign tactic, the only ones who suffer are the people of this district.”

Challenging ballot signatures has been a frequent tactic used by establishment Democrats and the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. In the 2016 election, the DCCC handpicked Mike Parrish, a former Republican and CEO of an oil company, to challenge Republican incumbent Congressman Ryan Costello in Pennsylvania’s sixth district. Leaked documents first obtained by The Hill revealed the DCCC was coordinating with Parrish’s campaign before he formally announced his candidacy.

Lindy Li, a 25 year old Princeton graduate, emerged as a surging progressive opponent against Parrish. She secured endorsements from Rep. Ted Lieu (D-CA), and Rep. Grace Meng (D-NY), but dropped out of the race after Parrish challenged Li’s signatures on her nominating petitions, because the notary who stamped the petitions made a mistake in not signing them or keeping a log. “He made technical complaints, like people not using their full first names or middle initials or not spelling out cardinal directions (eg, s street as opposed to south street),” said Li in an email to The Real News Network. Parrish lost by over 14 percentage points even though Hillary Clinton won the district in the 2016 presidential election.

In Arizona’s 8th Congressional District, Gene Scharer and Brianna Westbrook are currently facing legal challenges to try to remove their names from the ballot. Westbrook and Scharer are running to replace Rep. Trent Franks (R-AZ) in a special election after he resigned last year amid reports that he solicited his staffers to serve as pregnancy surrogates. Scharer was the Democratic nominee who lost to Franks in 2012, and Westbrook is running on the People’s Platform of progressive issues. The Democratic Party establishment candidate with endorsements from five Democratic congressional representatives, Dr. Hiral Tipirneni, is not facing a challenge as the lawsuit was filed by her supporter, attorney Lynda Vescio.

"Our campaign feels that we have, like many others, faced legal challenges backed by personal wealth," said Brianna Westbrook in an interview with the Real News Network. "Often we have been told this is an acceptable political tactic, but more and more we are seeing this be used as a political tactic by the wealthy on the poor. This is not democratic, this is class-based discrimination,” she added. “This is the type of tactic the Republicans pull. We are better than this."

On January 22, the Maricopa County recorder certified Westbrook had enough signatures, but that Scharer did not, effectively removing him from the ballot for the February 27 primary. In a statement to the Real News Network, Attorney Lynda Vescio claimed, “I filed the lawsuits against two of the candidates because they had small margins and I had information that they may not have had sufficient signatures.” She noted that once Westbrook had the required amount of signatures, she dropped the lawsuit and has not pursued it further.
http://therealnews.com/t2/story:21008:Democratic-Establishment-Tries-To-Keep-Progressives-Off-Congressional-Ballots
 

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