Was I assaulted?

This thread has a bizarre side for me, two of my favorite spirited posters annoying the hell out of each other.

What "tender age"? You have no idea how old the two people described in the OP are.
They might be in their teens, but they might also be in their 20's or 30's. All sorts of assumptions are being made about the situation in the OP without any basis in fact.

One reason I think the OP is a hypothetical, rather than an actual situation, is because it omits so many specific details, like age, how long ago this happened, the psychological effect on Travis, how it affected the relationship with the gf, etc. It's just ambiguous enough to provoke discussion about male rape in general, and I think that was its purpose.

Unfortunately, issues relating to male rape have been the one topic that hasn't been seriously dealt with in this thread in any way that would truly be helpful to a male of any age who had been raped by a female. In fact, some posters, like Oliver, seem unable to imagine a male who doesn't want to have sex, and he doesn't think this type of rape was so bad because it didn't involve physical pain or injury, and he really fails to see the lasting psychological and emotional harm Travis might experience as a result of this rape. As a final fillip, Oliver throws in the fact Travis experienced some pleasure, due to a reflexive erection and release, so he must have enjoyed being raped, and beside, he shouldn't have been in bed with a female if he wasn't prepared to have intercourse, or wanted to avoid being raped.

That's the usual crap females who have been raped have to put up with, but I'm really surprised that the men here aren't more sympathetic to a male victim. If Travis, a heterosexual male, had been in bed with a male friend in that cabin, just two friends sharing the same, and only available, bed on a camping trip, and the other male suddenly turned him over, held him down, and penetrated him anally, saying, "Try it, you'll like it", maybe they could relate more to an experience of genuinely unwanted sex. Just because it was a female in the case of Travis, doesn't make it any less of a forcible rape, or traumatic experience.

Why are you so concerned about the implications for the female who sexually assaulted Travis, if she winds up being prosecuted, convicted, and given sex offender status? Stop assuming she's "a child", because the OP describes her behavior as quite unchildlike. She quite intentionally overpowered an unwilling partner, who had set clear boundaries, and forced sexual intercourse on him, not because she was driven by wild passion, or feelings for him, but because she wanted to dominate, and possibly humiliate him--she had previously told him she wanted him to "put out" and she was callous to his distress the next day--and there is nothing in the OP to suggest otherwise about her. That sort of sexual aggressiveness is definitely not the sort of behavior that's typical of a female "child" or adolescent, and there is nothing benign about it. But it is typical of the acquaintance rape behavior exhibited by male rapists.

If a female, of any age, knowingly chooses to violate consent boundaries, and to consequently violate sexual assault laws, why shouldn't she be subjected to legal consequences for her actions, should her victim choose to report her crime to the police--and it is his choice whether to do that. If she's a young adolescent, the court might take that into account in determining her punishment, but if she's an adult, she deserves whatever the law specifies. Her actions were no less serious than a male who rapes a female under similar circumstance.

So, let's stop engaging in the fiction that the female described in the OP is a "child"--she might well be a 25 year old woman, and her actions certainly suggest an individual who is an adult woman, and not a much younger female.
And let's focus on the situation for the male victim of a rape, because that's who started this thread and sought our help. Whether he wants to report this as a crime is entirely his business, and it wasn't legal advice he was seeking.

Male victims of acquaintance rape can, and do, suffer similar long-term psychological and emotional effects to those of female victims--shame, anxiety, depression, PTSD, etc., but it is more difficult for men, and boys, to deal with these effects because of the messages about "masculinity" they receive-- men are supposed to be strong enough to fend off females, they are supposed to welcome and want sex, and they should be happy about losing their virginity--and there are fewer support services exclusively for male victims, and it may be even more difficult for male victims to talk about their feelings and what happened to them.

Look at the questions Travis asked in his OP

I tried to address those questions in the one post I made directly to Travis, and I think a few others did as well. Yes, she was definitely wrong, being in a relationship makes no difference, no, you're not overreacting, and no, it is not wrong for a guy to not want sex. And you should seek out a counselor or therapist to discuss your feelings about your experience with.

But mainly the messages he's getting here seem to be telling him he's overreacting, she might have been trying "to help him get over his sexual hangups" , he shouldn't regard this as a big deal, and he shouldn't even consider wanting to report this because that might be damaging to her

Male rape just isn't taken very seriously around here, and that's unfortunate. And maybe that's the real reason for the pretense that we're talking about children, not that that should make any difference, and focusing on how it should be handled when the perpetrator is a child, rather than really helping a male victim of sexual assault deal with the questions he's actually asked of us.

LOL, just helping you with your fantasy of playing an English version of Dirty Harry and killing by slow torture the claimed rapist of your daughter.

No damn police or courts needed................

Why would you be surprise at Izzy being in a state desperation or for that matter trying to charge posters here with being pedophiles and rapists for that matter.

Why do you need to defend yourself against a bogus claim? If this is him bullying you you're just fueling his fever ....

I would be very surprised if the issue was not about kids. I just can't see Travis being 30 (or even 20) and writing what he wrote.

Just for the record, when I came to the thread, Izzy and Germlat were discussing whether the OP was genuine. I started off stating that the OP story looks genuine, and that the described case was technically rape. I explained to Germlat that it was possible for a man to be aroused but not willing to have sex. She got the point, proving once again that when one poster discusses calmly with another poster, understanding can actually happen.

So I totally agree that this is technically a rape. The only issue on which I disagree with Chai, Izzy and you, is about whether that girl deserves to be reported to the cops. Let's at least agree on what we disagree about.

Thank you for giving me an opportunity to respond... Right or wrong ... From the get go I posted this as a purely hypothetical situation. I didn't take into consideration the maturity of the individuals involved.. I was wrong. When Olivier mentioned the concept of maturity...I knew I couldn't possibly be right. It made me think that if this wasn't a fake post I was being most insensitive. It's a matter of maturity for me....I may still learn more. In the end-- if it were in a courtroom I would not have been as flippant. Still --I was not right to make such assumptions...having said that--it was a learning opportunity for me. Not only as to the situation, but also as to how people respond...I've been attacked in numerous ways--even if I stated I didn't believe it was a true scenario from the get go. I've even been called a pedophile, told my husband couldn't get an erection, my son would simply go along with me to avoid conflict, even called disgusting...I'm surprised at people...even some I had whose opinions I respected in the past...

Sex without consent is rape.

That's the only condition.

There's no "if you were aroused", "if you enjoyed it", "if you didn't fight enough" etc. No means no, if someone forces you into sex (through whatever means, be it physically, coercion, ignoring their pleas etc). The OP said no, therefore it was rape. Not just assault, rape. Consent to one act (in this case, touching) does NOT mean consent to all.

This means he was raped by her.

The thing is, people are capable of words. We're capable of saying "yes" and "no", "I want this" and "I don't want this" respectively, so we don't have to rely on things like state of dress or body language or states of arousal to ask if someone wants to do something or not.

We can ask, we can say yes and no. He said no.

In regards to the other posts.



AS HE SHOULD IF I DID DO ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
Lucky enough for me, I'm not a ******* rapist.
So I have nothing to worry about.



Ew. Don't make me the subject of your perverse fantasies, you pair of sick fucks.

He could be...but a highly unusual one. I suppose one must consider every possibility. I love a saying my grandmother employed, " if, if, if, so what... We can consider possibilities forever, yet...does that mean if my grandmother had wheels She'd be a bicycle ?" I loved that quote...she was Greek and very opinionated. She also went on and on about Greek civilization being the cradle of western civilization ..I remember her fondly.

An yes might mean no under the invalid consent theory.

An yes....no and then yes might be no.

I wonder how people would handle this in a courtroom. Would this lady do time?

Are people ok with handing over a verdict of pedophile online? WTF? There's something SICK and sadistic about that! Bill...Quit defending yourself. Unless someone can post your picture and an actual case disposition. Otherwise, people have a mind of their own....

He does not need external fuel as his own sick mind contain enough fuel of that type for a thousand years of postings.

An you do not allow such charges to go unanswered except for Firefly who I just block ever since the time she ask me if I am into child porn trading and she edit my reply as follow: "Yes, I trade child porn with federal judges" to just "Yes I trade child porn" and then wet her panties claiming my response was an admission to that sick crime and not a sarcastic response to her question.

Izzy is a sick SOB but not a dishonest SOB like Firefly.

Well, sadistic minds...and believe me they'll never not exist and are out there. Pay no mind...they're sick and derive great pleasure at inflicting pain. Don't rent out space in your head. I'm appalled more people don't designate them as trolls...

I question if any prosecutor would take it to court in the first place and if it was taken to court if you could get a jury to convict.

Take note in cases of young teenagers and adult women when they are convicted they get very light sentences or probation for the most part where men get decades behind bars.

So you're Izzy's daughter?

Even when a man gets a charge for purchasing a prostitute's services he is designated as a sexual predator ..and must register as a sexual offender...I read about this the other day.

Surely she's not posting from prison ...

Why would you be surprised? Because you can't imagine a male of 20, or 30, still being a virgin? Well, they do exist, and I personally know of a 30 year old male who is still a virgin--he's just never had a girlfriend, and he only wants to have sex with someone he really cares about. Elliot Rodger, who was a college student in California, in his early 20's, went on a killing spree last May, essentially because he couldn't get a girlfriend and get himself laid, in order to lose his virginity-and lots of men on the internet apparently empathized with his predicament in that regard, if not with his murderous rage.

So, not all men are experiencing casual sex, beginning at an early age. There are men in their 20's and 30's who might still be virgins, for all sorts of reasons, including lack of opportunity, religious reasons, or because they don't feel ready for it, or because they lack a real desire for it, for whatever reason. Travis might be one of those, and this might have been his first girlfriend, and he just didn't feel ready to engage in intercourse with her yet, and he had made that clearly known to her.

If you read his OP, he didn't even want to go to "second base "with her, he did that only in response to her demand that he "put out". So he had no strong sexual desire to engage with this particular female--yet--and he had made that clear to her, and she had seemingly accepted the boundaries, he was certainly entitled to place, on their sexual activity.

I've already discussed, in my previous post, why the type of demanding sexual aggressiveness, and need to dominate, described of the female in the OP, just does not believably comport with the actions of a female who is "a kid"--it is much more likely to describe the actions of an adult woman with domineering tendencies.

And nothing in the way that Travis expresses himself suggests he is anything but an adult or possibly a young adult. He does not sound like a younger adolescent, or "kid", at all.

In terms of whether she"deserves" to be reported, the answer would have to be "yes", given that she knowingly violated the consent boundaries she had agreed to, and the sexual assault laws in the process, and committed a forcible act of rape on an unwilling partner. She "deserves" to be reported because of her own unlawful behaviors. This wasn't "technically a rape"--it would actually be a quite real rape, one in clear violation of the law, if it actually occurred. It's a textbook description of a forcible acquaintance rape.

Since you have no idea, at all, of the age of the two individuals in the OP, try reimagining them as two 25 year olds and see if that changes your view of her behavior. You, in fact, do not know she wasn't in that age range.

As to whether she should be reported, I think that's a matter for only Travis to decide, and I think it should be a secondary matter for him. He should first seek help for the emotional distress and confusion he was left with--those questions he addressed to us at the end of the OP--and then decide for himself whether or not to report the incident.

You're focused on the ramifications to the female, the rapist in this situation, if he reports this incident, and you overlook the ordeal for the rape victim when they report their assaults--they are often not taken seriously, or even believed, they are blamed for their own rapes, and often their complaints aren't fully investigated--the legal process can be a demeaning and humiliating ordeal for the victim, and considerably more so for a male victim than a female victim. So that's a consideration for a male in deciding whether to report it. It depends on how he feels about wanting to see her held legally accountably for what she did to him. It's entirely his choice, and one he should have support with, if that's the course he wants to take.

I think we also differ on how seriously we regard the issue of male rape. You keep coming up with all sorts of reasons to trivialize the matter. Maybe you do that
in the case of female rape victims as well, but, in this case, we're discussing a male, and you don't seem to regard what happened to him very seriously at all.

Let's rejoice about that. Kids don't belong in jail if you ask me, except for the most obvious and grievous crimes.