22
   

America Is Becoming Ungovernable.

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 07:26 am
@izzythepush,
Perhaps there will be an amendment: "checks and boycotts" instead of "checks and balances" ...
Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 07:48 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Or maybe they won't accept checks in future owing to their trustworthyness going out the window.

Cash only and balances?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 07:50 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Ah-hahahahahahahahahahahaha . . .

To amend the constitution requires two thirds of both houses of Congress to agree, and three quarters of the states . . .

Ah-hahahahahahahahahahahahaha . . .
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 07:56 am
@Setanta,
http://i1334.photobucket.com/albums/w641/Walter_Hinteler/a_zps8e616af0.jpg
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 12:03 pm
@Setanta,
Another way is for 2/3 of the states to present an amendment(So far this approach has never been utilized)
BUT, in the case of the recent govt shutdown. The US archivist was "laid off" so, technically the Senate and House procedure process would be unattainable
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  2  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 12:24 pm
@IRFRANK,
IRFRANK wrote:

Why does the US have 44 bases in Germany? Who are protecting Europe from?


If one looks at the history of Europe, we are protecting Europeans from themselves, in my opinion.
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 12:38 pm
@Ceili,
Ceili wrote:

Foofie wrote:

not to mention liberating it from Naziism in WWII. It would all be a non-issue, if Europe was just more productive, and then the U.S. would not be the economic superpower that it became after WWII, due to it fortunately being unscathed after WWII.


Would that you would.. not mention it again. I dare you. Try not to bring it in to every argument. It took place 70 years ago. SEVENTY. It's history.
It took place before the advent of computers. Where surprisingly, in the day of age google you, and others like you, whole heartily refuse to see the bigger picture.





I believe that when events are lost in the mist of time (in the past) does it then mean nothing. Otherwise, we have, for example, the Orangemen parading through Catholic neighborhoods for winning the Battle of the Boyne 400 years ago, or so. So, since WWII directly was the cause of the U.S becoming an economic superpower, it is relevant today, considering that beyond Europe rebuilding the bombed out territory, it did not all follow the role model of Germany and learn how to be uber productive.

I just cannot agree that the U.S. owes the world anything. If the U.S. chooses to bite its nose to spite its face, so to speak, by ignoring the global economy, then it might be their ethical right, considering that some European countries do not like the austerity that debt imposes on them. Let's have an even playing field.

Have a nice day, and weekend.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 12:51 pm
@Foofie,
Its true that the US did a lot in the defeat f Germany but really, Russia was the country that suffered the most and did the most. They took on about 60% of German forces
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:00 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
If one looks at the history of Europe, we are protecting Europeans from themselves, in my opinion.
And the US-American base in Israel (Dimona Radar Facility) ... is protecting Israel from the Europeans?
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:05 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

Its true that the US did a lot in the defeat f Germany but really, Russia was the country that suffered the most and did the most. They took on about 60% of German forces


However, as I was once told by someone from the Soviet Bloc countries, the reason that the Russians could survive the Siege of Leningrad was because they are a "primitive" people. I had to laugh. Since Americans are not primitive, I am that much more proud that they handled themselves well in WWII - our Army, our Army Air Force, our Navy. Now put your right hand over your heart, and let's say the Pledge of Allegiance together...
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:07 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Foofie wrote:
If one looks at the history of Europe, we are protecting Europeans from themselves, in my opinion.
And the US-American base in Israel (Dimona Radar Facility) ... is protecting Israel from the Europeans?


I have no idea. I do not follow the defense facilities of Israel. And, there are qualified people to handle the U.S. defense facilities, I am sure. I can relax and sleep well.

But, your bringing up this arcane point is for what purpose, or inference? I have no interest in what the U.S. is doing in Germany. You do seem to maintain a great awareness of what Israel or Jews are doing. Thank God you're a philo-Semite. I'd hate to see you on the other side of philo-Semitism, what with your great knowledge of Israel and Jews.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:17 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
But, your bringing up this arcane point is for what purpose, or inference?
I've responded to your post:
Foofie wrote:

IRFRANK wrote:

Why does the US have 44 bases in Germany? Who are protecting Europe from?


If one looks at the history of Europe, we are protecting Europeans from themselves, in my opinion.

... and asked a question about it.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:19 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:
I have no interest in what the U.S. is doing in Germany.
But you did post that above copied response.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:21 pm
That jackass Miller/Foofie will either believe anything, or is willing to tell any lie to prop up the bullshit she posts. The Russians are not more "primitive" than any other people in the industrialized world, and they definitely were a part of the industrialized world even before Germany invaded. I think this "someone from Eastern Europe told me" is all an out and out, knowing lie. Leningrad held out because they could bring in supplies across Lake Ladoga, the surface of which freezes thickly enough in winter that they could bring in truck convoys. Even though the Finns were nominally allies of Germany, the refused to advance beyond their 1939 borders, and so cut off the city.

Miller/Foofie is a nasty, hateful, bigoted bitch, who despises anyone who is not a Jew. Any time this idiot spouts off about the United States in the Second World War, any honest, decent and will-informed American ought to be embarrassed.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 01:53 pm
@firefly,
I don't think I'm kidding myself.

I never wrote that I believe we should be oblivious to the interests and concerns of the rest of the world, or that if we are it won't have undesirable consequences, but I can't see how taking to heart the generally uninformed and ideologically biased critiques of foreign columnists and comedic actors is of much value.

I feel fairly certain that the movers and shakers across the world have a better way to convey their concerns to our movers and shakers than through an interview with Eric Idle.

I also don't believe our credit-worthiness was ever in serious doubt. This latest standoff ended as I always expected...with a "compromise." The only thing that was ever in any level of doubt was which side would blink first.

All the high dungeon being breathlessly expressed regarding tea-baggers taking the nation (and the world) down was directed by one side of the conflict with millions of willing bit players mouthing the scripted message as if it were God's Honest Truth.

What you call a temper tantrum a whole lot of people think was a principled effort. You may be right and they may be wrong, but common sense would seem to dictate that one side can't be 100% correct while the other is 100% wrong.

Both sides were willing to accept national sacrifices to buttress their stand, and if you think this wasn't the case for the Democrats, you are hopelessly biased or quite naive.

Unfortunately, in the midst of these battles of principles, most of the narcissistic warriors have personal gains as much in their sights as what is best for the country. Again, if you think this is only the case of Republicans...

With the possible limited exception of the founding of our nation, it has always been this way, and always will be.

Think Achilles.

Finally, once and for all (as far as I'm concerned) we are not citizens of the world. Yes, we live now in a world where inter-dependency is more acute than ever before, but this hardly implies that we are all part of one grand group with truly unified interests.

If we are world citizens then so must everyone else on the planet be as well, and yet the vast majority of our fellow earthlings don't behave as if this is so, and certainly not the ones who long to murder their fellow world citizens.

Considering ourselves world citizens and making decisions based on such a consideration is the equivalent of unilateral disarmament.

Some people, apparently, think, in the abstract, that if we act the "right way" then the rest of the world will too, and if they don't, at least "we" will go down knowing we did what's right.

An individual can come to this noble decision if he or she is the only one to pay the price of "principle," but there is nothing noble (quite the opposite) about someone insisting that we all do so to make them feel good about us all.

We are citizens of the Unites States of America with all that entails. We are not citizens of "The World."

farmerman
 
  3  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 03:25 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:

I also don't believe our credit-worthiness was ever in serious doubt.
Thre was a "mini" default tht occurred in 1979 or 1980 (I was beginning a career and investing).
The default occurred over a weenie security glitch in a computer and resulted in a measly 3 day "defult". Everybody knew the money was there and eventully bemde good. The rulting S&P drop in bonds ratings resulted in severl yers worth of shakiness that was more responsible for the Recession than wa Carter or Reagan"Omics".

The probem with the teabaggers is tht they are plying with gsolin qnd don't know it. A Rep even stted tht default would be "cleanisng for our economy".

Izzat your brain trust?
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 03:28 pm
@farmerman,
" gsolin qnd don't know it. A Rep even stted tht default"

Huh?
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 03:31 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

That jackass Miller/Foofie will either believe anything..

Miller/Foofie is a nasty, hateful, bigoted bitch, who despises anyone who is not a Jew. Any time this idiot spouts off about the United States in the Second World War, any honest, decent and will-informed American ought to be embarrassed.


Thus speaks The A2K Historian.

With this I can see how you have a few faithful followers.
JPB
 
  3  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 04:03 pm
Dylan Ratigan (from Ceili's youtube) is a little excitable sometimes, but he does have a valid point. Our congress is bought and there are real problems with that. They're all paid for. The Republicans have been more open with the fact that they're puppets controlled by outside groups like Heritage and Club for Growth, but the Dems are in bed with outside purse holders too. That was part of the earliest manifestations of what became the Tea Party, until they too were bought and paid for.

Now we have puppeteers who are more than willing to shut down government because it doesn't affect them. Hell, Wall Street barely blinked. But defaulting? Whoa, now we're talking about something that would affect the folks with the wallets. The financial losses in market capitalization alone would have been astronomical. To say nothing about the bond markets. As soon as it became obvious that the Dems weren't going to piecemeal opening this or that portion of gov't the word went out that the Canadian had to take a fall. I don't really think McConnell, Reid, Pelosi and Boehner ever had much fear of a default. They're all seasoned players of the game. They simply had to leave enough time to get a deal done before midnight on Thursday and make sure that the new kids knew just who was still in charge.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 17 Oct, 2013 04:22 pm
@JPB,
JPB wrote:

I don't really think McConnell, Reid, Pelosi and Boehner ever had much fear of a default. They're all seasoned players of the game. They simply had to leave enough time to get a deal done before midnight on Thursday and make sure that the new kids knew just who was still in charge.


Nope, they didn't, and therefore we are left with the question of "Why the hyperbolic warnings?"

I dont necessarily find fault with Democrat politicians for casting the situation in the most dire of terms possible. That's the way the game is played.

I do, however, find vacuous the partisan Chicken Littles, in this forum and elsewhere, who have been bleating about tea-baggers destroying our nation.

These dolts actually believe this to be the case, and they have the nerve of considering themselves above such manipulation.
 

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