And he too is a Chicken Hawk.

@Joe Nation,

If only his name was "Bill Clinton".

Then the GOP would be all over him like stink on ****.

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@Joe Nation,

Poor Romney. He couldn't do what he "longed in many respects to do" because --- uhm --- why exactly? Maybe the Army didn't accept volunteers in those days. Yes, that must be it.

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@Thomas,

Quote:

Maybe the Army didn't accept volunteers in those days.

Huh . . . they accepted me. Maybe i wasn't holding my mouth right.

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@Joe Nation,

Not that I will shed a single tear on his behalf but can this guy shoot himself in the foot any more than he has? He keeps spinning himself out of any chance of winning the election.

My prediction is Obama will win by about 5% points. Gawd knows how the Electoral College of Clowns will vote!

Huffington Post lists the most recent poll for Florida as far as Romney vs. Obama at 1.2% in favor of Obama..and the gap is trending toward an increase. 46.5% vs 45.3%

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Quote:

and in some ways it was frustrating not to feel like I was there as part of the troops that were fighting in Vietnam."

In some ways it's frustrating to realize just how big a weasel this guy is.

Sorry. Weasels, I mean it in the contemporary use of the word and it is in no way a reflection of how I feel about actual weasels, whom I find truly endearing, wait....maybe I'm thinking about otters.

Next, let's go see if we can find any participation on his part in the advancement of Civil Rights.

Joe(Oh, I wished I was in Dixie...away, away....)Nation

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I don't understand why this is so hard for politicians. Obama seems to be an honorable exception here. He admitted right from the beginning that he did drugs as a juvenile, and I don't remember any Republican who tried to make it an issue. The story was already out there, so there was nothing left to expose.

Why didn't Romney do the same thing? "I didn't seek to get shot, but I didn't dodge the draft either" is a perfectly acceptable story. Why not just stick to it? But Romney, like most politicians in a pinch, can't seem to do it.

1 Reply

@Thomas,

At the time, Thomas, those without access to a draft deferment, had a very good chance of achieving Mr. Romney's dream of being in Viet Nam, but not because it was their choice, their number had come up.

Yahoo Answers:
Total draftees (1965-73) 1,728,344.
Draftees accounted for 30.4% (17,725) of combat deaths in Vietnam.
Last draftee: June 30, 1973.
25% (648,500) of total forces in country were draftees. (66% of US armed forces members were drafted during WWII).

Others, myself included, had the same opportunities, four of them in his case, to join the US Military Forces by choice, instead he applied and got four deferments. Now he says "I shoulda, woulda, wishda."

Yeah.

Joe(Tell that to them when you visit The Wall.)Nation

1 Reply

And now this:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/07/classmates-mitt-romney-im_n_1575680.html?ref=topbar

Joe(are we at the bottom yet?)nation

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@Joe Nation,

Dont worry about Mitt. The billionares will buy the election like they did in Wisconsin. By the time the election gets here the voters will have been brainwashed by the "liberal" media.

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I don't harbor animosity for those who as a matter of conscience refused to go to Vietnam. But, the hypocrisy of the chickenhawks sets them apart. They approved of their peers getting drafted and going over, but refused to put their own bodies on the line.

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@Joe Nation,

In the Gay community a chicken hawk is an older gay man who is into younger guys, yeah I can see resemblance with Romney.

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@Joe Nation,

They've done a lot

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In my opinion, many a young man that effected a deferment did not do it based on cowardice. I say that since many young men who could not get a deferment just joined a "safer" branch of the service (than the Army), if they did not want to possibly walk through a rice paddy with an M-16 over their head (not to get the weapon wet). In my opinion, the reason that many young men who could effect a deferment, did so, was for the more mundane reason of not wanting to spend four years as an enlisted man in another branch of the military, or five years as an officer.

I cannot mind read Romney's mind, or anyone else's; however, it is just my opinion that some young men believed that the regimentation of the military was just not part of their preferred itinerary at that ever so impatient age of their early 20's.

If I am correct in my thoughts for any young man that took a deferment, I do not blame the young man. To me it is just a reflection of a country that has devolved into a society of self-centeredness, in that four years as an enlisted person was anathema. No cowardice involved.

Perhaps, some credit should be given to both Bush's for having spent time in a branch of the service where they were flying military aircraft. Not exactly the safest job in the world.

And, let's add apples to apples. What was our current President's feelings about the military, if he would have had to be drafted? Since we cannot say, then this thread is not very relevant, in my opinion, especially since it makes assumptions about Mr. Romney's personal thoughts. Not reading minds, as I've said, I give any assumptions or innuendo no credence.

Also, since any future female President would likely not have served in Vietnam, or Iraq, Afghanistan, etc., making military duty a criterion for "correct patriotism" could be offensive to many a women that would one day vote for a female presidential candidate.

Foofie (intellectual honesty is the wisest way to live)

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@Foofie,

you do realize there are women in the armed forces now, yes?

even in Iraq and Afghanistan...

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@Rockhead,

and Vietnam

http://www.deanza.edu/faculty/swensson/bestresearch_womensoldiers.html

Quote:

Between 1962 and 1973, according to Department of Defense statistics, approximately 7,500 women served on active military duty in Vietnam. The Veteran's Administration puts the numbers even higher, at around 11,000. Independent surveys estimate that the number of women, both civilian and non-civilian, working in Vietnam during the war is between 33,000 and 55,000

and WWII

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s_Army_Corps

Quote:

About 150,000[8] American women served in the WAAC and WAC during World War II. They were the first women other than nurses to serve with the Army.[9] While conservative opinion in the leadership of the Army and public opinion generally was initially opposed to women serving in uniform, the shortage of men necessitated a new policy. While most women served stateside, some went to various places around the World, including Europe, North Africa and New Guinea. For example, WACs landed on Normandy Beach just a few weeks after the initial invasion.[10]

...

General Douglas MacArthur called the WACs "my best soldiers", adding that they worked harder, complained less, and were better disciplined than men.[13] Many generals wanted more of them and proposed to draft women but it was realized that this "would provoke considerable public outcry and Congressional opposition" and the War Department declined to take such a drastic step.[14] Those 150,000 women that did serve released the equivalent of 7 divisions of men for combat. Gen. Dwight D. Eisenhower said that "their contributions in efficiency, skill, spirit, and determination are immeasurable".[15]

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@Rockhead,

Rockhead wrote:

you do realize there are women in the armed forces now, yes?

even in Iraq and Afghanistan...

My point is that making one's military service (man or woman) a criterion for "correct patriotism," to be a VIABLE candidate for the presidency is self-defeating, since many qualified candidates in the future (man or woman) will not have served in the military. [Chorus sing, "A self-defeating criterion.")

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Then Vote for me--I'm thankful for my deferment. I had one from late 1969 to early 73. I worked for the Army Corps of Engineers, Louisville. It seems like keeping the Ohio River open was important so the Army kept me out of the Army.

Lot of friends served--so did some family, many I barely knew, and loads of strangers---I salute them all and would buy them a beer if given the chance but I damn sure wouldn't send anyone to a war I hadn't don't my best to avoid.

War is a failure of politics. No one wins a protracted war.

Rap

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@Foofie,

Well, he is now officially a chickenshit thanks to you, foofie.

Did you read what he SAID?

Quote:

"I longed in many respects to actually be in Vietnam and be representing our country there, and in some ways it was frustrating not to feel like I was there as part of the troops that were fighting in Vietnam."

-- Mitt Romney, 2007

Quote:

"It was not my desire to go off and serve in Vietnam, but nor did I take any actions to remove myself from the pool of young men who were eligible for the draft."

-- Mitt Romney, who sought and received four draft deferments, 1994
(and a liar to boot)

He LONGED ....to actually be in Viet Nam. Well, there was a very easy solution to ending that longing.
Join up.
That's what I and about a million other men and women did during the Viet Nam War.

Ask most Viet Nam Veterans what their motive was in going, they will sound much like the quote above, except they actually had the cajones to go.

If we had a time machine, I'd take you back to 1967-68. The war is raging, there's 500,000 American troops on the ground in Viet Nam.
(Go look up the highest number of troops used in Iraq for comparison. ---Nevermind, I'll do it for you. 157,000. )
EVERY single male in America was thinking the same thing, will my number come up??

Romney asked for and got FOUR deferments , just enough to get him past the end of the draft. Chicken ****.

Now, if he had said to his friends, "**** no, I ain't going. This war is fucked up and they are not going to drag my ass to Southeast Asia." That I, and most Viet Nam Vets would accept and, to some extent, respect.
It's the weasels I hate.
George W. Bush used his daddy's influence to steal a slot in the Texas National Guard, he showed up when and if he wanted to and then traipsed off to Yale wearing a ******* flight jacket. Chicken **** Asshole.

Let's check on the proud Romney family values:
George Romney did not serve.
George Romey's five sons, that's Mitten and his brothers- did not serve.
Mitt Romney has five sons..
How many of them have served in the Military Service of the USA???
Not one.
Joe(not a single one.)Nation

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Everyone keeps calling the debacle in Vietnam a war. It most certainly was not. It was an illegal invasion by the US and whatever little suckups it could gather around it.

It was a blatant attempt, yes another, by the US to position itself to steal the wealth of Vietnam.

Quote:

US Must Pay Vietnam Reparation

Official negotiations between the US government and the Socialist Republic of Vietnam have opened up. After waging a terrorist war for ten years and trying to isolate Vietnam for the last two, Carter has finally stated that he will not veto their admission to the UN. At the same time the US government is trying to break a promise the Nixon administration was forced to make by the Vietnamese for reparations. Kissinger and Vance are now trying to say that there never really were any promises. Well you don't have to go back to the Indian land treaties to know the validity of US agreements. Broken promises and lies are part and parcel of this system. Broken promises and lies are part and parcel of this system. But their just isn't any way we are going to fall for them. As veterans of the Vietnam war, the ground pounders, tankers, artillerymen, RTOs, clerks, medics, etc, we can't forget, nor want to, what really happened in Vietnam.

Trying to rewrite history, the US government is now accusing the Vietnamese of atrocities committed by US forces. But we'll be glad to remind the rich of this country what we saw.

Operation Phoenix was a CIA assassination program that killed between 100,000 and 250,000 suspected enemy ranging from village chiefs to teachers. Chemical defoliants were used that were banned in the US. It is estimated that birth defects resulting from this use will be 6 times greater than suffered after Hiroshima. Forced relocation of farmers and peasants was the aim of the "new life hamlet" program. Carried out by the Saigon and American troops, Vietnamese were moved from ancestral homes to government controlled areas along the coast. This was all part of a ten year war waged by the rich here to subdue and exploit the peoples and resources of Vietnam. And the cannon fodder--55,000 dead American servicemen sacrificed on the altar of almighty profit for the likes of Bank of American, Texaco, Michelin Rubber and more.

Billions upon billions were spent to destroy Vietnam for the rich and now the rulers of this country had better damn well live up to their agreement and pay reparations out of their own pockets.

At the same time it is necessary for the government of Vietnam to be recognized by the UN and by the US as the legitimate representative of the Vietnamese people. There is no excuse for this not to happen. The rich rulers of the US can't even come up with a puppet on some offshore island pretending to be the real government of Vietnam. Unfortunately for the ruling class, ex-President Thieu skipped off to Europe with the gold from the Saigon treasury (unfortunately for the people, too, because they didn't get their hand of that traitor or the gold).

Carter likes to do a lot of talking about "binding up the wounds." But that is all it is--talk. Carter and the rest could care less about the lives of the Vietnamese, the GIs or the American people when compared to their profit margin. As for binding up the wounds and bringing us together, we won't ever forgive those bloodsuckers who sent us around the world.

http://www.vvaw.org/veteran/article/?id=1659

1 Reply

And he too is a Chicken Hawk.

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