Rioting spreading through London & to other English cities.

I feel like I read all this a long time ago now. Well, I did, but didn't post on it.

I'm not interested in making people martyrs, for the ramp up that would happen, and the ramp up of the ramp up, but I grieve for the three men. And I do see them that way.

As I understand it, these were very sane achieving young men standing up to a threat to their place. Further looking shows how much they were very connected within their community.

I think this was the crucible.

1 Reply

@ossobuco,

Yes, the deaths occurred on Thursay. Perhaps this could be considered old news.
But I was particularly interested in the community the 3 men came from, the particular circumstances they live with daily.
It is clear from what the residents said in the article that they doubt anything will change any time soon, despite this tragedy.
Just more of the same poverty & neglect & strife that they've been living with for years.
Has nothing been learned from what happened?
As I said, noone's life should be like that.
What would it take for this community's real needs to be addressed?

1 Reply

@msolga,

I am not slamming it as old news, you misread me if you think that.

1 Reply

@ossobuco,

OK.
And me, I don't see this situation as "making matyrs".
The thing is, this community fully expected something to give soon. Had believed so for quite some time.
Because of the neglect they've lived with, the perception that politicians & others in authority didn't care about their community.
And now the worst has happened & still they believe noone is paying any attention to them.
The PM, who was 20 minutes away, didn't even bother to visit the grief-stricken families & their community.
I really don't want to make some big deal about this.
It just seems that these people really don't seem to matter to the powers that be.

2 Replies

@msolga,

But, via press, these three men can be conscripts to assertions, and used.

I do happen to think of them as martyrs. But I don't think that is useful as a troph, in that it trivializes them and I don't want to see that.

0 Replies

@msolga,

The main 'manufacturer of martyrs,' is the Daily Mail. This is a vile right wing rag. The men who died were Moslems. One of the Daily Mail's top columnists is Melanie Phillips, the woman who wrote the virulently anti -Moslem tract Londonistan. What will they do? Answers on a postcard to the usual address.

3 Replies

@izzythepush,

Geez, so I agreed with those folks?

Really, civic behavior is pan religion or ethnicity.

0 Replies

@izzythepush,

Not exactly sure of what you're saying, Izzy.
Yeah, I know about the Daily Mail & that the men who died were Muslims.
But I was more concerned about about the feeling of helplessnesses that the residents of that community seemed to be feeling (from reading the Guardian article) that anything will actually change in their community. Because of the lack of concern or interest on the part of politicians & the police ...
I must be expressing myself badly. Can't seem to make myself clear. Wink

0 Replies

The conflict between Cameron and the top cops is getting interesting...just days ago they were pissed that he was trying to take credit for calming the cities when they say that he had almost nothing to do with it (and they have a point that he was not even in country) and now this

Quote:

The front-runner for Britain's top police job has ridiculed David Cameron's decision to take on an American "Supercop" as an adviser on policing and gangs in the wake of the riots.

Sir Hugh Orde, president of the Association of Chief Police Officers, openly questioned the Prime Minister's appointment of Bill Bratton, former police chief in New York and Los Angeles, to examine the policing issues raised by the mass disturbances. In a dramatic escalation of the tensions between senior police officers and Downing Street, Sir Hugh also hit back at the "totally unjustified ... negative attacks" on policing.

Senior police officers are furious at the political criticism of their handling of the disturbances, which broke out in Tottenham last Saturday and spread to several English towns and cities by Tuesda

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/exclusive-pms-plan-to-import-us-adviser-angers-police-chiefs-2337445.html

0 Replies

@izzythepush,

What the hell is rong
with being anti-Moslem???????

The Moslems r aggressively authoritarian
like the nazis and the commies.

David

4 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

What the hell is rong
with being anti-Moslem???????

The liberals think that you should love everyone, and that if you dont you have failed to live up to their expectations. How the unloved act does not factor in for them.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

What is wrong is that you conflate the views of millions of people out of your own fear.

2 Replies

@ossobuco,

ossobuco wrote:

What is wrong is that you conflate the views of millions of people out of your own fear.

How do you know it is fear? Maybe it is possessing standards...You should investigate further before deciding that you know the mind and heart of another, you owe your peers that much.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

I've read David's posts for ten years. I get to have an opinion.

0 Replies

I know comparing Britain with Egypt is nuts because I have been told so by A2K members, but still it is nice to know that I am not the only one. Here is more

Quote:

On Friday, China's state-run Xinhua news agency published a commentary contrasting Cameron's latest statements with his Arab Spring-inspired speech earlier this year, in which he loftily proclaimed that freedom of expression should be respected in Tahrir Square as much as in London's Trafalgar Square.
"We may wonder why Western leaders, on the one hand, tend to indiscriminately accuse other nations of monitoring, but on the other take for granted their steps to monitor and control the Internet," Xinhua said. "For the benefit of the general public, proper Web-monitoring is legitimate and necessary."

http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/08/12/mackinnon.internet.britain/index.html?hpt=hp_bn9

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

The Moslems r aggressively authoritarian
like the nazis and the commies.

And Gov Walker

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

What the hell is rong
with being anti-Moslem???????

hawkeye10 wrote:

The liberals think that you should love everyone,
and that if you dont you have failed to live up to their expectations.
How the unloved act does not factor in for them.

I am confident that your assessment is factually accurate.

David

0 Replies

@farmerman,

Quote:

The Moslems r aggressively authoritarian
like the nazis and the commies.

farmerman wrote:

And Gov Walker

Really?
I don' t know much about him.

David

0 Replies

@ossobuco,

ossobuco wrote:

What is wrong is that you conflate the views
of millions of people out of your own fear.

Your post implies that the facts
do not support my vu
of prospective hazzard
from the Moslems -- as if thay did not pull off 9/11/1.

Correct me if I am rong, Osso,
but the official Moslem position
is that the entire world shoud be
theocratically subjected to their religion. Yes?????

The reason that on 9/11/1, the Moslems did not nuke us,
is that thay were not (yet) ABLE to do so.

Thay WILL, on the first day that thay CAN.
I am intellectually aware of this danger,
tho I do not entertain an emotion of fear.

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

No.

1 Reply

Rioting spreading through London & to other English cities.

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