@aidan,
Quote:How many poor, black kidnapper/murderer/abductors of children do you read about?
Give me a break.
You're just offensive sometimes.
The correlation between crime stats and poverty is offensive, and is true. Crime can happen anywhere, but it it more likely to happen in high crime areas, which should be obvious. You can stick your head in the sand if you want, but I choose not to...
@aidan,
HAwkeye is another one of the "Master of the Bleedin Obvious" crew.
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
HAwkeye is another one of the "Master of the Bleedin Obvious" crew.
I call spades spades, which sometimes makes me a novelty.
@hawkeye10,
Oh - I work in a prison and you're gonna try to tell me about the correlation between crime and poverty like my head was in the sand and I'm not aware - okay.
But I think you'll find that poor blacks are no more prone to abduct, murder and dismember children than those of other socioeconomic and racial groups. In fact, I'd probably posit that they were LESS likely and engaged in such behavior less frequently than do some members of other socioeconomic and/or racial groups.
And isn't that what we're talking about here? Or do you want to start talking about poor blacks and criminality instead?
Might I make a suggestion?
Could we look at the the people involed in this crime?
Not sure how we got from an orthodox jew murdering a hasidic child, in ny, to black people in new orleans before, during and after katrina. Gee, when I put it that way, it sounds ridiculous, doesn't it.
Perhaps we should all stop feeding the person who makes it his business to come up with the most obscure protestation against the general tone of a thread, and be adults and ignore said comments.
This is hardly respectful to the child, family, or sad, horrible event.
I say this to avoid this thread careening out of control and becoming a pissing contest.
This little boy and his family have been on my mind all day.
When I was a kid I was almost abducted twice. I was pretty street smart but it terrified me to know bad people were out there.
The first time, I was walking home from school, grade two. A guy drove by me, slowed down, open the side door of his van and masturbated while driving slowly beside me, three days in a row. I didn't know what he was doing at the time. The fourth day, he tried to grab me, a bunch of bikers lived on the route home, saw it chased after him and I believe they beat the every livin' **** out of him. Never saw him again, but everyday after that a big biker waited on the corner and walked me home.
The second time, I was about 10 and was waiting for a bus to go to piano lessons. A guy stopped and asked directions to a nearby mall. I told him where it was and how to get to it. He asked me to show him, I refused. He got out of the car and tried to drag me in. I screamed bloody hell and a woman came out of nowhere and scared him a way. Several days later, he did get a little girl and raped her.
I have another friend who at 10, was playing in a neighbourhood park in a small town. A man approached by she and a friend, but took her, because she "had bigger tits" his words, and raped her. He was never caught.
There is evil in this world and parents are wise to protect their kids. However, it is also important to teach kids to be street smart.
My heart breaks for these parents, this community. This is just so unbelievably sad.
Thay said that there was no evidence of any sexual abuse,
which leaves his motive unidentified, except that he said
that he "paniced."
Perhaps, in time, he will be more forthcoming qua his reason.
It was with that sort of thing in mind that I always carried
a .38 revolver, when I was his age.
David
@Arella Mae,
Arella Mae wrote:
You are right. I apologize. I will not feed the troll.
I have no doubt but that you would call anyone who questioned the law and order program of heavy penalties for even mid to low range wrong doing "trollish", because you are closed minded and need to protect your bias and prejudice. You will get similarly closed minded people to agree with you and support you, but the free thinkers will not be so gullible. It is past time to reconsider the American practice of always reaching for the biggest hammer for every job. There are other sized hammers, and in fact a whole bunch of other tools which are sometimes more useful than is the hammer.
@aidan,
Thank God your daughter was picked up by a kind person. I could only imagine how frightened you were.
@hawkeye10,
Another thing that must be figured out is if this 8 year old was happy to stay away from home, given that he was alone in the apartment as the alleged killer worked a shift, and might have gone on an outing as the alleged killer claims happened. This story has all the markings of a complicated tale of the evil that we are all capable of, and the claim that the harsh law and order stance of the collective set this guy off has the ring of truth.
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:The law and order folks seem to not understand that heavy penalties for relatively minor bad acts are a motivator for going all the way into evil, as there is little or nothing to lose....in for a penny in for a pound.
Kidnapping is a "minor bad act?"
@joefromchicago,
Quote:Kidnapping is a "minor bad act?"
Of course not, but we dont know what happened here other than we are pretty clear that the alleged perp did not set out to kidnap anyone that day. This turned out very badly, but it might have started out pretty innocently, and it might be that the response to a missing boy had a part to play in this ending badly. What did the posters say, did they claim that the boy had been kidnapped? Pushing people into a corner, and making sure that they know that this event is going to end very badly for them no matter what they do next has a way of making for a worse outcome. I doubt that any successful hostage negotiator would approve of this method of resolving the event.
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
Thay said that there was no evidence of any sexual abuse,
which leaves his motive unidentified, except that he said
that he "paniced."
Perhaps, in time, he will be more forthcoming qua his reason.
It was with that sort of thing in mind that I always carried
a .38 revolver, when I was his age.
David
I don't think they've come to any real conclusion in this matter. They're busy trying to put the entire body together. Must be quite a job for the ME.
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
Quote:Kidnapping is a "minor bad act?"
Of course not, but we dont know what happened here other than we are pretty clear that the alleged perp did not set out to kidnap anyone that day.
Well, we don't even know that, unless you have some evidence that you're not sharing with the police. In any event, even if the guy didn't set out to kidnap anyone that day, how does that mitigate the kidnapping that he actually committed?
@aidan,
aidan wrote:
You know what Hawkeye - this sort of thing could happen anywhere. I learned to never be complacent about my kids' safety before they were even born when I was teaching in the Chapel Hill public schools.
Chapel Hill is a very upscale town full of doctors and lawyers, etc...and this little girl was walking to school through her very upscale neighborhood and she lagged a little bit behind her big brother and when he turned around she was gone - just vanished. They found her body hanging later in the apple orchard behind the school. And there wasn't a poor, black person in sight. When they found the killer - he wasn't poor and black- neither is this one.
How many poor, black kidnapper/murderer/abductors of children do you read about?
Give me a break.
You're just offensive sometimes.
This type of crime was too common in Chicago. Recall the crime of Lepold and Loeb who killed little Bobby Frank in the Hyde Park area years ago just because they wanted to see if they could. It's a miracle they only got life and not the chair. The trial was by Judge and not jury and after the trial the judge commit suicide.
Loeb was murded in jail, and Leopold served 2-3 decades before he got out. But, the interesting thing is Leopold did get out of jail.
Both guys came from very wealthy Chicago families and they were defended by the very famous lawyer, Clarence Darrow.
@joefromchicago,
Quote:Well, we don't even know that, unless you have some evidence that you're not sharing with the police. In any event, even if the guy didn't set out to kidnap anyone that day, how does that mitigate the kidnapping that he actually committed?
When you say "kidnap" most people are going to think you mean to take off of the street by force, just as most people think that rape means to stick a dick into a female hole by force, but of course that is not how the law defines the terms, and we dont know that this boy was taken by force. It might be that he decided to go home with this guy, that he would deal with his parents later. Was he locked into the apartment while this guy was at work, or restrained? We dont know yet do we.....
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
Quote:How many poor, black kidnapper/murderer/abductors of children do you read about?
Give me a break.
You're just offensive sometimes.
The correlation between crime stats and poverty is offensive, and is true.
The correlation is between poverty and ethnicity of people found guility in Court and then jailed. I don't think the correlation was ever made between crime and poverty.
@Miller,
Quote:The correlation is between poverty and ethnicity of people found guility in Court and then jailed. I don't think the correlation was ever made between crime and poverty.
It has been made, but is disputed....in my opinion by people who are allergic to the truth when it runs counter to their bias. We could do a hundred page debate on the subject, but I am not particularly wanting to get into it right now.
