@Zardoz,
Zardoz wrote:A semi-automatic and assault weapon are two completely different animals.
That is incorrect. Adding a pistol grip to a gun does not transform it into a different weapon.
Zardoz wrote:No semi-automatic can fire at the rate of 900 rounds a minute
Yes. That is why I correct you when you talk about semi-autos firing 900 rounds a minute.
Zardoz wrote:and none needs to. There is no reason to shoot a deer 900 times.
No one is trying to shoot a deer 900 times.
Zardoz wrote:The number of deer you can kill is limited so there is no need to kill the whole herd.
No one is trying to kill the whole herd.
Zardoz wrote:The Constitution is silent on assault weapons as they were not invented until over a century after the constitution was written.
That is incorrect. The Constitution forbids all gun laws that cannot be justified with a good reason. There is no justification for banning pistol grips on a gun.
Zardoz wrote:The bump stock is just a mechanism to make the AR-15 fire faster
Yes.
Zardoz wrote:and serves the same purpose as the mechanism in the gun.
That is incorrect. A semi-auto mechanism does not make a gun fire as fast as a machine gun. A bump stock does.
Zardoz wrote:If you can ban one you can ban the other.
That is incorrect. There is no justification for banning semi-auto actions.
Zardoz wrote:Semi-automatic might not fire 900 rounds a minute but assault weapons were designed to fire at that rate.
That is incorrect. Adding a pistol grip to a gun does not increase its rate of fire.
Zardoz wrote:Assault weapons are designed to kill large number of people on the battlefield
That is incorrect. Adding a pistol grip to a rifle does not make it designed to kill people.
Zardoz wrote:they have only one other purpose, mass murder.
That is incorrect. They are useful for hunting and self defense.
Zardoz wrote:There were two shootings over already this week, one in California and one at a Wal Mart. At the Garlic Fest 3 were killed and 11 were wounded and wouldn’t you know it an assault weapon made it possible.
That is incorrect. The pistol grip played no part in the massacre.
Zardoz wrote:The best approach to solve a problem is to go to the root of the problem and the root of the problem is the mechanism that makes assault weapons capable of firing at a 900 round a minute rate.
That is incorrect. You admitted above that semi-auto weapons cannot fire anywhere near that fast.
Zardoz wrote:Semi-automatics don’t fire 900 rounds a minute
Which is why you are wrong to keep using terms like "900 rounds a minute" to refer to semi-auto weapons.
Zardoz wrote:but assault weapons do
That is incorrect. Adding a pistol grip to a gun does not change it's rate of fire.
Zardoz wrote:and that is the specification listed by the manufacturer.
No manufacturer says that a semi-auto can fire 900 rounds per minute.
Zardoz wrote:Just trying pulling your trigger finger as many times as possible and a 450-minute rate is indeed possible.
It isn't even remotely possible.
Zardoz wrote:When firing into a large crowd people occupy most of the space. If you don’t hit the person in the front than you may hit someone in the fifth row back.
And you will most likely just give them a minor wound for not having aimed the gun.
And then the crowd will disperse, and after that, most unaimed shots will hit no one at all.
Zardoz wrote:Shooting into a large crowd it is impossible to miss.
Shooting randomly without aiming also means that few shots will hit a vital part of the body.
And then when crowd disperses, most unaimed shots will hit no one.
Zardoz wrote:Someone shooting in the general direction of a crowd will kill far more than someone taking careful aim.
That is incorrect. Even if people are so densely packed that an unaimed shot will hit someone, most unaimed shots will not strike a vital area.
And a crowd will quickly disperse when fired upon.
Zardoz wrote:You need that assault weapon firing at 900 round a minute rate. That will make a mess of any crowd.
Adding a pistol grip to a rifle does not make it fire 900 rounds per minute.
Zardoz wrote:The firing mechanism in assault weapons is far different than the one in a typical semi-automatic.
That is incorrect. Adding a pistol grip to a rifle does not change the firing mechanism in any way.
Zardoz wrote:That is why the AR-15 was patented. If you don’t make a major improvement you can’t get a patent.
That is incorrect. All you need is to have a new design.
Zardoz wrote:Assault weapons were designed to kill large number of people,
That is incorrect. Having a pistol grip on a gun does not mean it was designed to kill people.
Zardoz wrote:they were not designed to go squirrel hunting with.
That is incorrect. An assault rifle chambered in .22lr would make an excellent squirrel gun.
Zardoz wrote:If the pistol grip design version of assault weapons was banned mass murders might not stop but the body count would go down.
That is incorrect. Pistol grips have no impact on mass murders.
Zardoz wrote:Can you imagine how awkward it would be to fire a traditional rifle at waists level?
Successful mass murderers do not try to hold their guns at waist level.
Zardoz wrote:I don’t know about you but if I was facing a large crowd of violent gang members, I would not want a rifle but an assault weapon held at waist height
Not me. I'd want a defense that would actually function.
Zardoz wrote:an assault weapon held at waist height would bring down many gang members
That is incorrect. All it would do is miss the target continuously.
Zardoz wrote:but a rifle at my shoulder would not stop them.
That is incorrect. Actually aiming a gun will present an effective defense.
Zardoz wrote:The pistol grip is designed to be held by hands
All grips are designed to be held by the hands.
Zardoz wrote:and offers a much more secure control of the gun.
Do you have any evidence that pistol grips increase the level of control?
Zardoz wrote:That may be what it is coming to is locked doors at public building with metal detectors. Our Courthouse has used metal detectors since 9/11. The metal detectors need to in front of a secure metal door.
OK.
Zardoz wrote:Machine gun Kelly did not have any trouble robbing banks and few would take him on.
So I take it that there is no evidence that he fired his weapon from the waist?
Zardoz wrote:That shooting took place in the Pulse Night Club. The mass murderer could not miss the people were packed in like sardines wherever he shot he hit someone. He did not waste many bullets. There is no doubt it took place that is history.
The death toll indicates that he aimed his gun when he fired it.
Zardoz wrote:While a mass murderer was taking aim, someone would take his gun away. Someone taking aim would lose his peripheral vision making him vulnerable to attack. You have to trust the mass murders and with the exception of one shooting from the top of a clock tower none bothered to take careful aim.
They would not have been able to kill many people if they had not aimed their weapons.
Zardoz wrote:While a mass murderer was taking aim, someone would take his gun away. Someone taking aim would lose his peripheral vision making him vulnerable to attack. You have to trust the mass murders and with the exception of one shooting from the top of a clock tower none bothered to take careful aim.
Their death tolls indicate that they did aim their guns.
Zardoz wrote:As soon as the deer heard that first shot the rest of the heard would be history.
Most likely.
Zardoz wrote:The guns used by the Las Vegas shooter had pistol grips and for what he was doing were more than likely held with the pistol grips.
The pistol grips played no factor in the severity of the massacre.
Zardoz wrote:The weapons with bump stocks may have been shoulder fired. One was mounted on bipods. Strafe from the shoulder would be much more difficult.
The ability to aim the weapon effectively makes strafing easier.
Zardoz wrote:That is the exact reason mass murderers chose assault weapons with pistol grips.
Most mass murders do not choose assault weapons.
Zardoz wrote:That one shooting in Las Vegas was enough to get bump stocks banned.
That's because people could actually come up with a good reason for banning bump stocks.
Zardoz wrote:Most mass murders where large numbers of people are killed are done with assault weapons.
168 people murdered with a bomb:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_bombing
108 people murdered with bombs:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shijiazhuang_bombings
100 people murdered with a bomb:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolgrad_palace_bombing
86 people murdered with a truck:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_truck_attack
8 people murdered with a bomb and 69 people murdered with a rifle (no pistol grip):
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks
57 people murdered with an axe and a bolt action rifle:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Unek
44 people murdered with a bomb:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster
38 people murdered with a bomb:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wall_Street_bombing
32 people murdered with a shotgun and a rifle:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhaodong#Zhaodong_massacre
32 people murdered with handguns:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech_shooting
30 people murdered with a shotgun and a sword:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsuyama_massacre
29 people murdered with a knife and a small revolver:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campo_El%C3%ADas_Delgado
24 people murdered with a bomb:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morral_affair
23 people murdered with handguns:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luby%27s_shooting
22 people murdered with a machete:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nainital_wedding_massacre
21 people murdered with a bomb:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles_Times_bombing
20 people murdered with bombs and a shotgun:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerch_Polytechnic_College_massacre
20 people murdered with a sickle and machete:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banjarsari_massacre
19 people murdered (and 13 severely injured) with knives:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sagamihara_stabbings
19 people murdered with knives
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yema_stabbings
Zardoz wrote:If your target is a large crowd shooting in the general direction will be more efficient.
That is unlikely. Few bullets would hit something vital and be lethal.
Zardoz wrote:The number of kills are proportional to the number of rounds fired.
A very very very low proportion, if the shooter is not bothering to aim their gun.
Zardoz wrote:Strafing from the waist position is much easier.
That is incorrect. Firing from the shoulder poses no difficulty. And it also allows aiming, which allows the shooter to hit their target.
Zardoz wrote:Pistol grips are like steering wheels on cars they make the car easier to drive.
That is incorrect. Guns have a provision for grasping and firing the gun even if there is no pistol grip.
Zardoz wrote:Weapons of mass destruction are those that kill masses of people.
Only in the case of weapons that kill millions of people with a single shot. Other weapons are classed as WMDs for entirely different reasons. A radiological weapon, for example, might not kill a single person.
Zardoz wrote:If there was an accurate body count on assault weapons people would be surprised.
The pistol grips result in zero additional deaths.
Zardoz wrote:Dead is dead whether you get a bullet in the head in a night club or killed by an atomic bomb.
Humanity disagrees. They have found that chemical weapons are so horrible that they have outlawed them despite their not killing any more people than conventional weapons.
Zardoz wrote:Weapons of mass destruction kill masses of people and death is death.
That is incorrect. A radiological weapon might not kill a single person.
Zardoz wrote:A rifle held at shoulder height is not as efficient as one at waist height when it comes to strafing
That is incorrect. Holding it at shoulder height allows the weapon to be aimed, which increases efficiently immeasurably.
Zardoz wrote:Missiles were designed to carry a payload whether conventional or atomic.
And these missiles carry a payload with no explosives at all.
Zardoz wrote:When our drones fire hells fire missiles there is quite an explosion and many dead people.
Not when the missiles don't carry any explosives.
Zardoz wrote:We have never had a mass murder using a heavy truck in America.
It has certainly happened outside America.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Nice_truck_attack
Zardoz wrote:Knife attacks seldom kill more than one or two
29 people murdered with a knife and a small revolver:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campo_El%C3%ADas_Delgado
22 people murdered with a machete:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nainital_wedding_massacre
20 people murdered with a sickle and machete:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banjarsari_massacre
19 people murdered (and 13 severely injured) with knives:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sagamihara_stabbings
19 people murdered with knives
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yema_stabbings
Zardoz wrote:but we are now approaching a mass murder every day in America most using assault weapons.
That is incorrect. Most mass murderers use handguns.