46
   

Mosque to be Built Near Ground Zero

 
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 07:49 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Americans, gullible, no way!
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Aug, 2010 07:49 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Here we go again!
the WH today felt compelled to issue a statement that Obama is a Christian.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 12:11 am
Pictures of the neighborhood.

"Hallowed ground", indeed.
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 02:15 am
You know, I hate to be a wet blanket & all ...
But I can't help wondering what those unfortunate (& probably still) "shocked & awed" folk in downtown Baghdad would make of all this.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 04:32 am
@DrewDad,
Thanks for those pics, drewdad.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 06:20 am
@DrewDad,
The WSJ did a story about the strip clubs and betting parlors on the "hallowed ground" around the WTC site.
WSJ wrote:
But if Ground Zero has been made sacred by tragedy, it’s hard to say the same for the Pussycat Lounge one block south of the site. The front entrance of the strip club and bar, which has been there for more than four decades, offers a clear view of the ongoing construction at the World Trade Center site. There weren’t many customers on Wednesday afternoon, when a television reporter stood in the middle of the street filming a report on the Park51 controversy.

Inside, a bartender who said her name was Dasha offered brief remarks against the proposed Islamic center. She said she’s uneasy about organized religion in general.

But Chris, the stripper who volunteered in the Ground Zero recovery, sat on a barstool in a tiny, shiny red dress and defended Park51. “They’re not building a mosque in the World Trade Center,” she pointed out. “It’s all good. You have your synagogues and your churches. And you have a mosque.”
0 Replies
 
sumac
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 06:35 am
@DrewDad,
Thanks, DrewDad. The commentary after the pics was spot on as well.
0 Replies
 
revelette
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 06:56 am
@Foofie,
Quote:
I thought this Ground Zero mosque was for authentic Muslims only. No ecumenical usage of the mosque, I thought, or touristy visitors. Just a plain mosque.


I was speaking of the pentagon prayer service in response to a post from OmSigDAVID, not the mosque being planned in lower Manhattan.

Also the mosque being planned to be built in NY will be also be a community center with an auditorium, art exhibition space and bookstore.

Quote:
The center, which has been denigrated as the "ground zero mosque," would include an auditorium, art exhibition space and bookstore, all of which present opportunities for interfaith discussions and activities.


source

I ran across an article which may have been already referred to here, but I think it sums up why it is important to support mosque being built.

Quote:
With the Statue of Liberty as his backdrop, the mayor pleaded with New Yorkers to reject suspicions about the planned 13-story complex, to be located two blocks north of the World Trade Center site, saying that “we would betray our values if we were to treat Muslims differently than anyone else.”

“To cave to popular sentiment would be to hand a victory to the terrorists — and we should not stand for that,” the mayor said.

Grappling with one of the more delicate aspects of the debate, Mr. Bloomberg said that the families of Sept. 11 victims — some of whom have vocally opposed the project — should welcome it.

“The attack was an act of war — and our first responders defended not only our city but also our country and our Constitution,” he said, becoming slightly choked up at one point in his speech, which he delivered on Governors Island. “We do not honor their lives by denying the very constitutional rights they died protecting. We honor their lives by defending those rights — and the freedoms the terrorists attacked.”


source

We should not let the terrorist win by lowering our values of what is supposed to define this country as one of freedom and democracy rather than one of oppression.

Some here may say that is just being idealistically naive, but our country was built by people who had ideals of freedom of oppression and tyranny which was probably considered naïve by England and other places at the time.
sumac
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 07:23 am
@revelette,
Excellent post!
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 08:52 am
Quote:
NY mosque imam: Extremism is global threat


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100820/ap_on_re_mi_ea/nyc_mosque_imam;_ylt=Ag8Q.6KFdtqQneoRfwaXV.5h24cA;_ylu=X3oDMTM2c2xwZzVzBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMTAwODIwL255Y19tb3NxdWVfaW1hbQRjY29kZQNtb3N0cG9wdWxhcgRjcG9zAzEwBHBvcwMxMARzZWMDeW5fdG9wX3N0b3JpZXMEc2xrA255bW9zcXVlaW1hbQ--

The imam leading plans for an Islamic center near the Manhattan site of the Sept. 11 attacks said Friday he hopes to draw attention during his trip in the Middle East to the common challenges to battle radical religious beliefs.

Now I'm worried this guy is going to become a target.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 09:06 am
@revelette,
Quote:
With the Statue of Liberty as his backdrop, the mayor pleaded with New Yorkers to reject suspicions about the planned 13-story complex, to be located two blocks north of the World Trade Center site, saying that “we would betray our values if we were to treat Muslims differently than anyone else.”

“To cave to popular sentiment would be to hand a victory to the terrorists — and we should not stand for that,” the mayor said.

Grappling with one of the more delicate aspects of the debate, Mr. Bloomberg said that the families of Sept. 11 victims — some of whom have vocally opposed the project — should welcome it.

“The attack was an act of war — and our first responders defended not only our city but also our country and our Constitution,” he said, becoming slightly choked up at one point in his speech, which he delivered on Governors Island. “We do not honor their lives by denying the very constitutional rights they died protecting. We honor their lives by defending those rights — and the freedoms the terrorists attacked.”


Awwww, isn't that sweet, he got choked up.

Quote:
Some here may say that is just being idealistically naive, but our country was built by people who had ideals of freedom of oppression and tyranny which was probably considered naïve by England and other places at the time.


The reality, Revelette, is that the USA has come nowhere close to matching those ideals. The USA has spurned those ideals with a regularity that defies description. It's stunning that that hypocrite Bloomberg could stand there and mouth that bullshit.

When will the time arrive to honor the country and the Constitution by holding accountable the criminals who launched attacks upon two countries - not to mention their people - both of which had nothing to do with 9-11?

Why is there never any talk of the grave injustices that have been perpetrated upon Iraq and Afghanistan. There's constant whining and moaning about the 3000 that died in New York but there's nothing about the half a million kids who died because of the immoral embargo, two illegal invasions of Iraq, the numerous war crimes against both groups, the deaths of a HUNDRED THOUSAND or so?
sumac
 
  3  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 09:11 am
@JTT,
Your concerns are well covered in other specific discussions. Not relevant here.
failures art
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 09:12 am
@panzade,
If harm came to him (dear me, let us hope not), it is not hard to imagine the likes of Pat Robertson suggesting this is message from God showing disapproval of the mosque.

A
R
T
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 09:31 am
@sumac,
Quote:
Your concerns are well covered in other specific discussions. Not relevant here.


How is pointing out that the mayor of New York is spouting what is in essence a load of crap not relevant, Sumac? The nonsense that has been apparent in this thread regarding this mosque has everything to do with the two illegal invasions of two sovereign countries by your "government" and I use that term lightly to describe what was a cabal of some of the most despicable war criminals the world has known.

Now y'all want to stroke your egos like you're doing something noble. Why have we never heard, save for from MsOlga, who is being studiously ignored, about the enormous pain and suffering that all the Iraqi and Afghan families are going through.

Nope, it's always about "backdrops of the Statue of Liberty", the tears that flow remembering the brave heroes, the Constitution and blah blah blah.

Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 09:57 am
Imam Rauf says it goes back to WWII. That killing innocent civilians isn't the way Islamics normally wage war, but the Christians started it back then.
sumac
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 10:35 am
@JTT,
JTT,

I don't disagree with what you say, just where you are saying it.
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 10:53 am
@Irishk,
Can't argue with that Wink
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 11:20 am
@panzade,
I had nothin' to do wit WWII...that's my story and I'm sticking to it!
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 11:43 am
@revelette,
This sentiment has been repeated ad nauseum, and yet we still have people who fail to see their own bigoted ideals. They're Americans for crying out loud! What American has the right over other Americans to tell them "not to build here?"
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Aug, 2010 02:21 pm
@sumac,
Quote:
I don't disagree with what you say, just where you are saying it.


Let me explain why I think you're mistaken, Sumac.

What would have been the reaction to this mosque had 9-11 and all the attendant misery never happened? What is happening didn't start with 9-11? It has been been happening for well over a century and it happens because Americans are deluded by crap like that from Bloomberg.

Americans are so deluded that they don't sit up and say, "Hey, they just killed, in my name, with my money, over a hundred thousand innocent people because our president lied to us". [same scenario for Afghanistan]

Just the lies should be enough to get you incensed. This same thing happened with Reagan - tens of thousands of innocent Nicaraguans tortured, raped, murdered by Reagan's Contras, you know, those guys who are the equivalent of the Founding Fathers.

It's really odd that people think there has to be some special occasion to talk about the real injustices, the ones heaped upon the Iraqis. Don't spoil our nice little chat about us, this is our "us" time.
 

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