46
   

Mosque to be Built Near Ground Zero

 
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Jan, 2011 07:07 pm
@BillRM,
Are you making things up or did I miss it when ci compared concentration camps to the Nazis death camps.
Did he even mention Nazis death camps?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Jan, 2011 07:20 pm
@reasoning logic,
rl, That's a huge problem trying to discuss issues with people like BillRM who can't remember what I actually said from one post to the next, and that wasn't even that far back; it was today.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Jan, 2011 07:52 pm
@cicerone imposter,
I remember just fine and anyone can read this thread and see you daring to place Japanese American relocation camps in the same class as the Nazis death camps because they both have barb wire and machine gun towers and a few Japanese Americans was even kill.

You have a sick soul indeed.
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Jan, 2011 08:08 pm
@BillRM,
Bill Maybe you are correct in what you see! What do you think about this video?
It is about supporting our troups!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5Br9PG3XPk
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Jan, 2011 02:11 am
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:
rl, That's a huge problem trying to discuss issues with people like BillRM who can't remember what I actually said from one post to the next, and that wasn't even that far back; it was today.
U have never been good at that either.
U have trouble remembering that ??
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Sat 15 Jan, 2011 12:47 am
Quote:

New imam joins Park 51 leadership, center says
By Allan Chernoff, CNN
January 14, 2011

New York (CNN) -- The controversial Islamic community center planned in Lower Manhattan announced the appointment of a senior religious adviser, Imam Abdallah Adhami, reflecting a reduced role in the project for Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf who has generated tremendous controversy for the center that critics have labeled, "The Ground Zero Mosque."

"This is an extraordinary opportunity to be a key adviser on a project going forward that has enormous creative and healing potential for the collective good in New York City and in our nation," said Adhami, who has been serving the Lower Manhattan community for two decades and previously led a now defunct mosque in the neighborhood.

Rauf remains on the board of the Islamic community center, called "Park51." But the community center distanced itself from the Imam and his wife whose comments have sometimes conflicted with those of the project's other backers.

"Imam Feisal and Daisy Khan will not be speaking on behalf of Park51, nor will they be raising funds for the project," said the news release from the center. "The Cordoba Movement and the Cordoba Initiative are separate nonprofit entities from Park51 with different missions and leadership," added the statement, referring to Rauf's interfaith outreach.

But in an illustration of continuing tension between Park51 and Rauf his public relations representative, Leyla Turkkan, told CNN, "Nothing has changed. Everything remains the same in terms of the vision of Park51 and Imam Feisal's involvement in Park51 and Cordoba House at Park51."

A person involved in the project, who spoke off the record, not wanting to exacerbate the conflict, told CNN that in fact there will be no Cordoba House at Park51.

Park51 is planned as a 16-story community center with recreational, educational and cultural programming, modeled after the Jewish Community Center on the Upper West Side and the 92nd Street YMHA and open to all New Yorkers. The basement of the building would house an 8,000 square-foot Muslim prayer space, comprising just over 6% of the project.

Park51 plans to announce an executive director next week and other New York Imams plan to associate with the project in the near future.

"We are very excited about the next phase of Park51 and the challenging work ahead," said Sharif El-Gamal, a real estate developer and president of Park51.
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/US/01/14/new.york.mosque.imam/


Quote:

The New York Times
January 14, 2011
Amid Rift, Imam’s Role in Islam Center Is Sharply Cut
By PAUL VITELLO

Long-simmering tensions between co-founders of the proposed Islamic center and mosque near ground zero led to a parting of the ways on Friday that sharply reduced the role of one: the imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, long the project’s public face.

The break-up sent ripples of uncertainty through a community of religious and political leaders in New York who rallied last summer to the side of Mr. Abdul Rauf and his wife, Daisy Khan, when opponents assailed the plan to build near the site of the 9/11 attacks. Some worried aloud that the curtailed involvement of the couple could cost the project support. Others said the plan would continue to be endorsed by people committed to interfaith dialogue and freedom of religious expression.

The split was announced unilaterally by Mr. Abdul Rauf’s partner in the project, Sharif el-Gamal, the real estate investor who owns the former coat store at 51 Park Place where the 13-story center is planned.

In a statement that took Mr. Abdul Rauf by surprise, according to a spokesman for the imam, Mr. Gamal said the imam and his wife would no longer raise money for or speak on behalf of the project, known as Park51, though Mr. Abdul Rauf would remain on its board.

“While Imam Feisal’s vision has a global scope and his ideals for the Cordoba movement are truly exceptional, our community in Lower Manhattan is local,” said Mr. Gamal, referring to the imam’s longstanding work in promoting interfaith understanding. “Our focus is and must remain the residents of Lower Manhattan and the Muslim American community in the greater New York area.”

The imam’s efforts have taken him on State Department speaking tours in the Middle East. On Saturday, he was to begin a United States speaking tour.

The differences between the imam and Mr. Gamal have been evident on a wide range of issues for many months, said Muzaffar A. Chishti, director of the Migration Policy Institute at the New York University School of Law and a friend of Mrs. Khan and her husband. The two men have differed over the size of the project, its commercial or noncommercial character, and whether it would be primarily a place for Muslims or for people of many faiths, he said.

But the divide was most apparent in the different names each leader has used for the project. The imam has always referred to the proposed Islamic center and mosque as the Cordoba House. To Mr. Gamal, a businessman and real estate developer, it is Park51.

In his announcement, Mr. Gamal said Friday services at the temporary mosque now operating in the building, previously conducted by Mr. Abdul Rauf when he was in town, would now be run by an imam, Abdallah Adhami, who has served another Lower Manhattan mosque for many years.

Julie Menin, chairwoman of Community Board 1, which approved the Muslim center last spring, said Mr. Gamal, as owner of the property, had the right to “do as he wishes” on his project. Whether the reduced roles of Mr. Abdul Rauf and Ms. Khan would affect support, Ms. Menin said, “It’s too soon to know.”

Mr. Chishti, however, suggested that the prospects for raising the estimated $100 million it might cost to build the center would be diminished. “The groundswell of support we saw over the summer for this project was not a wave of support for a developer’s rights,” Mr. Chishti said. “It was support for a vision that was articulated by Imam Feisal.”

Neither Mr. Abdul Rauf nor Mr. Gamal would agree to an interview on Friday, but each had someone speak on his behalf.

Larry Kopp, a spokesman for Mr. Gamal, said the imam would stay on the Park51 board, which now has four members including Mr. Gamal. Mr. Kopp said the board would expand to about 15 members this year.

Leyla Turkkan, a spokesman for Mr. Abdul Rauf, said the imam and his wife would “continue their leadership work in creating the Cordoba House,” and their efforts “to help build broader connection and understanding among people of all faiths.”

By most accounts, both Mr. Abdul Rauf and Mr. Gamal were surprised over the summer when their project drew such emotionally charged opposition, despite receiving the approval of Community Board 1 and the Landmarks Preservation Commission.

Mr. Abdul Rauf has said the decision to present the plans to both panels while the two men were still hammering out their own differences was in part an effort to begin building public support. When the hearings instead touched off a nationwide controversy, the two found themselves ill-prepared: The board of directors still has no prominent leaders, and the project has raised little money.

“When events started outpacing them, they had not really ironed out the basic elements of their plan,” Mr. Chishti said. “In the glare of attention, they couldn’t back down from their positions. It’s not surprising they weren’t able to come to terms.”

Pamela Geller, a blogger who marshaled much of the opposition to what she termed “the ground zero victory mosque,” said the pushing aside of Mr. Abdul Rauf would not change much.

“It doesn’t matter whose face is out front,” she said. “We’re still against it.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/15/nyregion/15mosque.html?hpw


I can't say that I find this turn of events surprising. I suspect that future emphasis on the project will highlight the community center facilities and downplay the presence of the mosque, because it is likely that Mr. Gamal is more interested in the commercial profit making aspects of this endeavor.

The project is still far from moving forward--particularly due to a lack of fundraising. But, it will be interesting to see whether the absence of Mr Abdul Rauf as a spokesperson and figurehead harms or helps Mr. Gamal's project. While it might harm the fundraising efforts, it also might help to tone down some of the controversy generated by Mr Abdul Rauf due to his past remarks regarding 9/11.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jul, 2011 02:54 am
Jun 30, 2011
Quote:
At this point, the prospects for Park 51 don’t look good. The imam has made little progress in raising the nearly $100 million needed to build the community center—and potential donors have been scared off. What’s more, Rauf and the developers have yet even to sort out a legal and organizational framework for the project.

http://news.yahoo.com/ground-zero-imam-regrets-135600328.html

As predicted by me.
revelette
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jul, 2011 08:10 am
@hawkeye10,
Well, that is just sad and depressing.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jul, 2011 01:47 pm
@revelette,
revelette wrote:

Well, that is just sad and depressing.
These clowns are still blaming prejudice and injustice, but the truth is that they are amateurs, they never had it with-in them to organize such a large scale project. Now with the rents in the area up a great deal over the last two years I look for them the sell, as it is unlikely that they can come up with the taxes over the long haul.
revelette
 
  2  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 06:12 am
@hawkeye10,
I don't pretend to know if they were amateurs or not. I do know they were not imagining the prejudice and active opposition they had to deal with in trying to raise money for the new church.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 06:22 am

It is more obvious than necessary
that those Molsems chose that site to spit in our faces,
and gloat qua Moslem success on 9/11/1.

Now thay will not do it.





David
maxdancona
 
  4  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 06:59 am
@OmSigDAVID,
When you say Moslems, you mean Americans.

These are your fellow Americans you are talking about.
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 07:03 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
When you say Moslems, you mean Americans.

These are your fellow Americans you are talking about.

So were the communists; Gus Hall, SDS, etc. SO WHAT??????
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 08:23 am
@OmSigDAVID,
David, I just want to know why you are so against freedom.
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 08:25 am
@maxdancona,
Freedom to do WHAT ?
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 09:15 am
@OmSigDAVID,
" Reality is merely an illusion,
albeit a very persistent one." Albert Einstein

A supporter of the advance of science; Really?
fascinated by Vertebrate Paleontology, Astrophysics,
Cosmology and the reconciliation of Quantum Mechanics
with Einstein 's Relativity found in Membrane Theory
in 11 dimensions
LOVE the Space Program; the Earth was Man 's cradle.
It should not be his grave. That sounds cool!






0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  3  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 11:43 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
Freedom to do WHAT ?


To do anything you want as long as it isn't against the law. For example freedom to be a Muslim or a communist or a gun owner or a student for democratic society.
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2011 07:34 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
Freedom to do WHAT ?


To do anything you want as long as it isn't against the law. For example freedom to be a Muslim or a communist or a gun owner or a student for democratic society.

Given the rapidly expanding law book, and the ever more willingness of the state to use it to nail citizens on a whim, that is not quite as good as it sounds.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Jul, 2011 01:50 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
Given the rapidly expanding law book, and the ever more willingness of the state to use it to nail citizens on a whim, that is not quite as good as it sounds.


One of the reasons given by a law professor and a cop in a youtube video not to talk to the police if you are a target of an investigation is that no one can keep track of the thousands of laws and government regulations with the force of the law now on the books.

In other word you can never be hundred percent sure if you had or have not broken some law/regulation or other.

It is a great county we are now living in!
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Jul, 2011 04:34 am
@hawkeye10,
Quite the contrary Hawkeye. Our lawbook is shrinking and our government is "nailing" fewer citizens. Not that long ago you would get arrested for going to a gay bar or for having an interracial relationship. It was once illegal to buy a beer.
 

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