46
   

Mosque to be Built Near Ground Zero

 
 
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 02:07 pm
Quite by accident I came across this article written 2 weeks after the 9/11 attack.

It addressed an issue similar to the current community center/mosque debate--whether a U.K. based Islamic mutual fund should open offices in NYC in the immediate aftermath of the tragedy at the WTC, given that tensions were high and anti-Muslim feelings had surfaced. Not unlike Imam Rauf, in the current debate, the managing director of the Islamic investment company said he would not back away from expanding because people should try to "to forge a bond between communities instead of dividing them.." He also mentions the fact that there had been a mosque located in the WTC.

Quote:

Sophisticated Investor
Sept. 25, 2001

Islamic investing in troubled times
By Thomas Kostigen,
CBS.MarketWatch.com
LOS ANGELES (CBS.MW) - A U.K.-based Islamic mutual fund intends to stick with its plan and set up offices in New York despite the bad timing of its expansion move.

Heightened media coverage of the Islamic religion and detailed facts about the size and growth of the Muslim population has increased interest in investment products that abide by Islamic law, says Zafar Sareshwala, managing director of Parsoli, which launched the Global Islamic Equity Fund in May.

"The market has become more defined," says Sareshwala, whose fund will open offices in New York in early 2002.

Islamic investment principles disallow speculative trading, investing in companies that earn interest income, or have ties to pork or alcohol. The investment guidelines have to follow religious principles set forth in the Koran and interpreted under Shari'ah, or Islamic law.

Towry Law International in Bahrain said it's launching a Shari'ah compliant fund, looking to raise up to $20 million by October 26.

Meanwhile, IslamiQ, which has an office in New York and operates one of the foremost investment vehicles based on Islamic law, said investment interest is strong. The day it opened for business after the attacks on the World Trade Center, IslamiQ received telephone calls of reassurance about investment commitments by bankers and investors. About 70 percent of its investors are non-Muslim, IslamiQ says.

"The first phase of any marketing campaign is awareness. We don't have to bother with that any more."

Naveed Siddiqui, vice president of marketing for IslamiQ, says the firm is in the middle of putting out a new subscription offer for investors. The attacks raised awareness and solidified IslamiQ's business plans for moving ahead.

"The first phase of any marketing campaign is awareness," says Siddiqui. "We don't have to bother with that any more."

It should be noted that none of the Islamic investment firms contacted increased marketing efforts, rather stayed with existing plans. Many executives said they were saddened by the terror attacks.

"There was a mosque at The World Trade Center that we use to pray at," Sareshwala says. "We had many friends there."

To be sure, these are sensitive times. Sareshwala says it's important to move ahead with his plans and show resolve.

Only one incident of dismay has been waged at Parsoli, Sareshwala says.

"After the tragedy, a bank that refers us customers called and said they didn't want to be officially linked to us," Sareshwala says. "But they still unofficially refer us business."

Tensions are high. President Bush called for Americans to be respectful of Muslims in the wake of the terror attacks allegedly waged by Osama bin Laden in the name of Islam. But already one Muslim has been killed on account of his religion, and many more report being harassed.

The Amana Funds, a mutual fund group that invests according to Islamic law and largely targets Muslims here in the U.S., hasn't experienced any negative sentiments.

"People didn't jump in or out," says Phelps McIlvaine, Amana Funds vice president

Redemptions rose slightly, but McIlvaine attributes those to a drop in the stock market.

The market is at its lowest point in three years, with the Dow Jones Industrial Average hovering above 8,000. It's dropped 2,000 points since the beginning of the year.

Even with all the negatives, Sareshwala says he will not back away from expanding because people should try to "to forge a bond between communities instead of dividing them.."

The market, however, may chisel its own wedge.

Parsoli and IslamiQ's portfolios are all dipping into the red. The Amana Growth Fund (NASDAQ:AMAGX) and Income Fund (NASDAQ:AMANX) are off about 30 percent and 15 percent, respectively, for the year.

Market conditions may have turned against Islamic investment funds; people haven't.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/investing-by-islamic-principles-in-turbulent-times

I found it interesting to learn that there were Islamic investment funds and that they followed religious principles set forth in the Koran. I had not known that before.

Then I began thinking about those huge office buildings which will eventually go up at Ground Zero. Like the WTC, they will likely house many investment companies. Will these Islamic groups be allowed to rent office space in those new towers, or will all Muslim-affilated busnesses and enterprises be banned from this "hallowed ground"? Will mosques be allowed in those new towers?

Is the current controversy simply limited to building a new mosque in lower Manhattan, or will this same issue re-erupt if any Muslim businesses want to occupy space in the rebuilt towers at the WTC site? Is this going to be a series of one controversy after another, set off by any issue that has to do with the land at Ground Zero being occupied by Muslims?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 02:16 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
Quote:
I found it interesting to learn that there were Islamic investment funds and that they followed religious principles set forth in the Koran. I had not known that before.


Your statement sounds threatening or negative if you like; what religious principles set forth in the Koran are negative?
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 02:19 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
Then I began thinking about those huge office buildings which will eventually go up at Ground Zero. Like the WTC, they will likely house many investment companies. Will these Islamic groups be allowed to rent office space in those new towers, or will all Muslim-affilated busnesses and enterprises be banned from this "hallowed ground"? Will mosques be allowed in those new towers?


First we take Manhattan, then we take Berlin.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 02:32 pm
@firefly,
Then I began thinking about those huge office buildings which will
Quote:
eventually go up at Ground Zero. Like the WTC, they will likely house many investment companies. Will these Islamic groups be allowed to rent office space in those new towers, or will all Muslim-affilated busnesses and enterprises be banned from this "hallowed ground"? Will mosques be allowed in those new towers?


LOL, I would think most people would be delighted to have a Mosque on the very tops of all those buildings assuming they are Sunni Mosques as the Muslims terrorists seem to have no problem at all with killings Shias and attacking their mosques or other religions sites.

See below you why you need to pick the terrorist approve branch of the faith to be on the top floor of your tower.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Terrorist attack at Ahmadi mosques in Lahore, 200 dead or injured
May 28th, 2010 9:26 pm ET
Pictured: Badshahi mosque Lahore Pakistan [Bait ul Noor & Dar ul Zakir were the 2 mosques attacked]
Photo: Wikimedia Commons
Gunmen, suicide bombers, and all around terrorist thugs have attacked two mosques in Lahore, Pakistan earlier today. The mosques were located in the Ahmadiyya Muslim community; they are a group who are deemed misguided apostates by the Pakistani government.

At least 80 people have been murdered (120 injured) while attending salatul-jumah or Friday Prayer at their local mosques this afternoon. The attack is being documented as the most organized and vicious assault of Ahmadiyya followers ever in the country.

The United States state department spokesman Philip Crowley has stated, 'Washington condemns the "brutal violence against innocent people", which is good to know. He said nothing of the Taliban who is allegedly behind these deadly and unjust raids.

There is absolutely no place in Islam for such acts. Inarguably, this is haraam.

External Chair, Maha Salah-Ud-Din, of UM-Ann Arbor's Pakistani Students' Association has provided Examiner.com with the following statement: Our personal opinions about religion do not justify killing fellow human beings who do not have the same beliefs as we do. At a time when Pakistan is already in the spotlight and Muslims are already hated by the majority of the world, we have Muslims killing human beings in Mosques. Such actions are putting ourselves on a pedestal for the world to look at. This is very sad to hear and especially at a place where we are offering prayer. A few bad seeds do not speak for the whole bunch.

And to be 100 percent certain that such acts are forbidden, here is a clear and beautiful passage of the Holy Quran condemning killing/murder: “…if any one killed a person, it would be as if he killed the whole of mankind; and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole of mankind…” - The Holy Quran (Chapter Five, Verse 32).

Today's incident is a tragedy and a heinous crime against the teachings of Islam.

0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 03:16 pm
@DrewDad,
Quote:
But black people never wanted to build the Community Center of Death (TM).


I think Jon Stewart has made a plea to upgrade it to the ' the Galactic Community Center of Death (TM).' as in 'why do you have to build it on this planet?'
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 04:24 pm
@cicerone imposter,
What about my statement sounded negative or threatening to you?

I honestly had never known that there were investment funds set up in accord with the principles of the Koran before I read that 2001 article today.
Quote:
Islamic investment principles disallow speculative trading, investing in companies that earn interest income, or have ties to pork or alcohol. The investment guidelines have to follow religious principles set forth in the Koran and interpreted under Shari'ah, or Islamic law.

That was all news to me. And I did find it interesting. I know that Muslims do not use alcohol or eat pork, but it would never occur to me that they might not want to invest in companies that have ties to those things, or that speculative trading is disallowed as is investing in companies that earn interest income. And it surprised me even more that 70% of the investors in one of those funds are non Muslims.

Anyway, apart from learning something new and interesting, what struck me most from the article was the resolve on the part of that fund manager not to back away from opening a NY office, despite heightened sensitivities and anti-Muslim feelings, but rather to go ahead with his plans and try to forge bonds between communities. That was certainly a somewhat difficult stance to take only two weeks after the 9/11 attacks, but it is the same sort of admirable resolve currently expressed by Imam Rauf for similar reasons. Building bridges and forging bonds is the way to counteract any negativity toward Muslims that was engendered by the attacks. That can't happen if we want or expect or demand Muslim businesses or mosques to disappear from sight.

And I do wonder what will happen when those new towers go up at the WTC site. Are the organized Muslim haters going to come out of the woodwork again and protest that no offices be rented to Muslim businesses, like investment companies? Will Muslim prayer be forbidden in the new buildings? Unlike the Park Place location, which is two blocks away, the new buildings really will be at Ground Zero.

I have a dread that groups like Stop Islamization Of America will never let up with their Islamophobia, and anti-Muslim campaigns, and that the reconstructed WTC site will have them carrying on about any Muslim business that wants to rent space on "hallowed ground". Even if the current mosque controversy dies down, I think they'll just latch onto something else, some new Muslim target, and try to manufacture more divisiveness. If Imam Rauf re-locates his project, he will be handing SIOA a big victory that will energize their forces, and increase their attacks on Muslim American interests. Caving into pressure like that is not the best way to deal with bullying bigots.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 04:53 pm
@firefly,
Now that you clarified what you said before, it makes more sense. Without the explanation, there seems to be a negative hidden message.

Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 04:57 pm
@firefly,
AIG, Sharia, and Uncle Sam
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 05:14 pm
Those crazy muslims going nutso against the usurers. What a wacky crazy idea.

<irony flag>
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 05:33 pm
And the ad at the end;

Invest in Green Energy
67% Return*


* Return not guaranteed - remember Bernie Madoff



Smile

0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 06:29 pm
Stephen Colbert's take on the Koran burning/mosque situation is hilarious. And the Dr. Strangelove bit at the end is perfect. Check out the video on this page.
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/stephen-colbert-explains-mosquekoran-burning-situation-with-hilarious-dr-strangelove-impression/
failures art
 
  3  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 06:46 pm
@firefly,
I am not encouraging him to spew more hateful crap. Besides, he requires no encouragement to do so. Certainly, you don't need to be reminded of this.

I think it's the most simple way to apply fire here. Ask the direct and most simple questions. No metaphors (and I am quite fond of those) are required.

Asking why the project should be moved away from the community is the most damning question of all. In Bill's answer, he must flounder around trying to justify his view while stumbling against the very real facts of this.

There isn't anyone here that's going to step up and make a real case, and I'm mostly just enjoying, as hawkeye put it, "rubbing their noses in it." It does not harm to anything offer the Billhawks of the world the opportunity to make logically contradictory statements and then make sport of identifying them.

Bill thinks that it's a matter of just jumping on the subway and going a few stops further, and voila, no controversy. So then it's amusing to point out that his arguments allow for no such thing to satisfy him. Similarly, it was an almost perfect moment in cosmic humor when it was mockingly suggested that if Rauf wanted real interfaith relations, he should make it into an interfaith chapel, and then no more more than a week later, Rauf announced interfaith services to be held at Park51.

This issue is over. Even if, as hawkeye notes, there are plenty of permits to go, once election season is over, nobody will give a damn.

Perhaps this thread will be a fun thing to post in next year just to point this out over and over to people like hawkeye who refuse to accept that this nontroversy is 100% contrived.

A
R
T
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 06:48 pm
Quote:

While the Imam behind plans for a mosque near Ground Zero was jetting around the globe and advocating for his Downtown project, a pair of dilapidated apartment buildings he owns in New Jersey fell into such disrepair that cops have to stand watch in the event of a fire.

The fire watch, at taxpayer expense, was revealed during a court hearing today when Union City lawyers asked to have two buildings owned by Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf placed into receivership so that rent s could be used to fix dozens of violations, including inoperable alarms and sprinklers.

Rauf skipped today’s hearing as did his wife Daisy Khan. Their lawyer, Tomas Espinosa, said he didn’t know why the Imam didn’t come to court.

“There have been a lot of stress on these people,” Espinosa said when asked after the hearing to explain why Rauf was a no-show “The legal process will show that my client is an honorable man that has taken care of his property.”

Asked why he was confident that Rauf would prevail, Espinosa said of the Imam, “There is integrity and character,” adding, “He is a man of peace.”

But Union City officials insist Rauf is a slumlord



Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/ground_zero_mosque_imam_faisal_rauf_o173R8S3JZnekEC4V08H9L?CMP=OTC-rss&FEEDNAME=#ixzz0zeIaHBBe


So little respect for America that he can not even be bothered to show up at court....Shocking! *sarcasm*
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 07:02 pm
Quote:
ST PETERSBURG, Fla., Sept. 15 /Christian Newswire/ -- Bill Keller, leader of the world's largest interactive Christian website for 11 years, Liveprayer.com, with a daily following of over 2.4 million people worldwide, has thrown down the gauntlet regarding the "ground zero victory mosque" Imam, Feisal Rauf.

Keller was recently quoted as saying, "Imam Feisal Rauf is nothing but a con-man who has ZERO intention or ability to build his 'super mosque/swimming pool/smoothie bar/community center/ interfaith building' or whatever he is calling it today!" Keller continued, "Rauf never had any intentions of building this 'victory mosque,' but has simply used this to advance his own agenda, pocket millions in donations, help his Muslim brothers who own the property make a huge real estate score, and further the advance of Islam in the United States."

Keller said Donald Trump was correct in his assessment that the owners of the property would sell in a second if someone was foolish enough to give them some ridiculous amount of money for the property. However, what Trump doesn't realize is that Imam Rauf will personally end up pocketing millions in donations for his supposed mosque by the time the property is sold.

Keller lamented, "If I was Imam Rauf and I wanted to be a bridge builder, the greatest way to accomplish that would be to build a mosque at the site of Islam's greatest military victory in their 1400 year history. Are you kidding me? If he really was about building bridges, the last place he would want an mosque is anywhere close to ground zero! He is either a very stupid man, or a man who knows exactly what he is doing!"

Keller continued, "If anyone doubts the true intentions of Imam Rauf, just listen to his clear threats he issued when he clearly said that if he doesn't build his mosque by ground zero, the 'radicals' will resort to violence. Give me a break! Islam has been radical since the day Mohammed was visited by the angels of satan and dreamed up this false religion from hell 1400 years ago! All they have ever needed is an excuse, like a cartoon, to riot and kill people!"

Keller, who himself spent 30 months in Federal Prison in the late 80's for insider trading before devoting the last 20 years of his life to serving the Lord, said that Rauf is a documented slumlord who has used US taxpayer dollars to purchase the buildings he refused to take care of, and has no track record or ability to raise the $100 million he needs to build his mosque by ground zero. Keller surmised that he will probably raise a few million in donations before he backs out, blaming everyone else for the failure to complete his project, and walk away with millions of dollars.

http://www.earnedmedia.org/livp0915.htm

I am thinking that an ex-con should be able to recognize a con man when he sees one.
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 07:08 pm
@firefly,
Thanks for restoring the truthiness Stephen...
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 07:39 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Now that you clarified what you said before, it makes more sense. Without the explanation, there seems to be a negative hidden message.




Perhaps to you. I, for one, did not see any negative connotation and found the information informative and interesting.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 08:11 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Now that you clarified what you said before, it makes more sense. Without the explanation, there seems to be a negative hidden message.


Oh my lord a neg not-pc hidden message.

The universe might ends as a result before 2012.



0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 08:17 pm
@failures art,
Quote:
This issue is over. Even if, as hawkeye notes, there are plenty of permits to go, once election season is over, nobody will give a damn.


Plus the little tiny question of where the gentleman is going to be pulling out of his rear end over a 100 millions or so.
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 08:35 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Plus the little tiny question of where the gentleman is going to be pulling out of his rear end over a 100 millions or so.
I dont think that the Arabs are going to want to get into this jackpot, and while the Persians would love to make trouble I doubt that they can hold their nose long enough to give money to this fool, so that leaves Americans. I hope that the list of contributors is published, as there will be retribution.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  4  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2010 08:39 pm
@hawkeye10,
That amounts to nothing more than an ad hominem logical fallacy.

Rauf's other endeavors, even if he is a slumlord, do not affect the legitimacy of the Galactic Community Center of Death (TM).
 

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