American United or AU inforcing seperation of church and state

@Pinochet73,

Pinochet73;21020 wrote:

Christianity made it possible for you to understand, appreciate and act on 'freedom'. We deserve your gratitude.

Don't think so bud. You can claim whatever you want for your life, but don't assume anything for me. I do not need or want your religious guidance. My gratitude? HA, that will be the ******* day.

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@Pinochet73,

Pinochet73;21021 wrote:

Jefferson owned slaves with whom he had children, children he did not legally recognize. He warned his sons not to have sex with their slaves, in light of all the problems his uncontrollable sex-drive caused him. Yes, he was a political genius, but not someone I will quote much, if ever, or follow steadfastly, if at all. Also.....Einstein????? He was a naturalized German. Why would I adhere to his maxims on anything other than nuclear physics (.....I, a history teacher????).

1 Reply

@STNGfan,

Also if Christians brought so much freedom why did our forfathers expression put in our constitution freedom of religion (meaning all religions) and why did they run away from the Catholic church of Europe and their theocracy? I mean our forfathers was very strong about the seperation of church and state for a reason. They got a taste of christianity domination and oppression of freedom in Europe and they wanted to make sure that this country was never controlled by the church. They would all be rolling in their grave to see how much the religious right controls politics these days.

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@92b16vx,

92b16vx;21023 wrote:

Don't think so bud. You can claim whatever you want for your life, but don't assume anything for me. I do not need or want your religious guidance. My gratitude? HA, that will be the ***ing day.

yes they treat us like babies. We are poor lost souls and need to directed to the "right" path. I mean how arrogent and presumptious. My immortal soul is non of their business.
I have free choice right? yet I am being forced to follow their rules because they make laws forcing me to be "saved" or follow the "right" path. They are taking God free will away from us because I guess they feel God isn't doing a good enough job himself.. LOL.

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@STNGfan,

STNGfan;21026 wrote:

Yes slaves were freed at one time in America and??? Where did these pepole get the concept that slavery was unacceptable??

THE BIBLE!!!

1 Reply

@92b16vx,

92b16vx;21023 wrote:

Don't think so bud. You can claim whatever you want for your life, but don't assume anything for me. I do not need or want your religious guidance. My gratitude? HA, that will be the ***ing day.

You 'don't think so' because you don't know Medieval history. You have no idea how great the Christian contribution to the survival of Europe was after the fall of Rome until the High Middle Ages. None. Nevertheless, I have good news: you're not alone. Most Americans share your ignorance on this subject. :devilheadbang:

1 Reply

@92b16vx,

"Also if Christians brought so much freedom why did our forfathers expression put in our constitution freedom of religion (meaning all religions)....."

They were Enlightenment thinkers. Despite its anti-religious tone, the Enlightenment had many origins in Christian humanism.

".....and why did they run away from the Catholic church of Europe and their theocracy?"

They didn't. No one came to what later became the U.S. in flight from the Catholic Church.

"I mean our forfathers was very strong about the seperation of church and state for a reason. They got a taste of christianity domination and oppression of freedom in Europe and they wanted to make sure that this country was never controlled by the church."

The Church of England? I'm sure glad for that. I wouldn't follow the Anglican Church, either. Good job, Forefathers.

"They would all be rolling in their grave to see how much the religious right controls politics these days."

Would they? Most were practicing, church-going Christians. Don't bother mentioning Jefferson and Franklin. The others were Christians, and das a fak. :devilheadbang: :mad:

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@STNGfan,

ROCK ON, BUBBA HOTEP!!!!!!!

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@Pinochet73,

Pinochet73;21091 wrote:

You 'don't think so' because you don't know Medieval history. You have no idea how great the Christian contribution to the survival of Europe was after the fall of Rome until the High Middle Ages. None. Nevertheless, I have good news: you're not alone. Most Americans share your ignorance on this subject. :devilheadbang:

Oh, I know all about it, I just don't give a ****. At one point in my life, I was vehemently anti-religion, now I just don't don't really care. Ignorance isn't a term someone like you should be throwing around, don't you have some muslims to kill? chop chop

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@92b16vx,

92b16vx;21105 wrote:

Oh, I know all about it, I just don't give a ***. At one point in my life, I was vehemently anti-religion, now I just don't don't really care. Ignorance isn't a term someone like you should be throwing around, don't you have some muslims to kill? chop chop

Nope, but can you please answer the following: Is wiping the Christian religion out of public institution a goal of Radical Islam or the left leaning apologist? Do you want to live in a country under Sharia Law, don't believe me that it can happen 92? Read the following because appeasers like you are allowing the distruction of Christian beliefs in education as you hand it over to Islam. Why in gods name do we allow people like you to set our countries back into the dark ages. Segregated class rooms in the year 2007. Prayer session for "Muslims only" what is happening is beyond stupid. US take back your culture and country pleaseeeeeeeee. We must stop this madness, Allah this Muslim that I don't care what they want. Leave your religion at the front door and stop shoving it down non-Muslims throats. Read the following:

San Diego Arab public school implements shari'a - forms taxpayer funded madrassah
June 12, 2007

Carver Elementary - San Diego Public School Bows To Sharia
June 12, 2007 - San Francisco, CA - PipeLineNews.org - Those having doubts that New York Department of Education's proposed Arabic school - Khalil Gibran International Academy - will inevitably turn into a madrassah should consider how a similar experiment in the San Diego Unified School District is turning out.

In September Carver Elementary school [kindergarten - eighth grade] accepted nearly 100 students from a failed charter school which served a Somali Muslim constituency.

The school population now numbers approximately 400.

Though these kids are now being educated within the wall of Carver, they have not been incorporated into the main student population and operate as a school-within-a-school, segregated elite with special privileges.

The controversy became a matter of public record when a substitute teacher Mary-Frances Stevens made a report to the local school board in which she claimed that Carver's Muslim children were being led in Islamic prayer by a teacher's aide. Steven's, who subbed at the school on March 8 stated that the lesson plan she was given included the allotting of one hour for prayer.

The teacher's allegation of religious indoctrination led to an investigation.

In true multicultural fashion, the school has gone to extreme lengths to accommodate its new students; the curriculum features the teaching of Arabic - the language of the Quran - single gender classes for girls as well as organized prayer...for Muslims only.

A new dhimi class schedule - expressly designed to kow tow to Carver's new students - was instituted. It created an extra 15 minute recess period as part of an hour set aside so that Carver's Muslims can pray en-masse while in class. Additionally, the school cafeteria menu no longer serves pork or other foods which conflict with fundamentalist Muslim diet restrictions [halal].

Even Carver's "winter holiday" celebration has not escaped the wrath of this brand of extreme multiculturalism, ripping the heart out of what was formerly the Christmas holiday by injecting extraneous cultural artifacts; as the San Diego Union Tribune notes:

"The school's winter holiday celebration featuring multicultural performances was a big hit. African-American, American, Muslim and other traditions were celebrated.
"Carver has always been sensitive to the different cultures and always looked at the variety of cultures we have as an enrichment, not a problem," teacher Pamela de Meules said." [source "District wants to provide options," by Helen Gao http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/education/20070412-9999-1m12carver.html]PipelineNews.org - The RIGHT News...RIGHT Now

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@92b16vx,

92b16vx;21105 wrote:

Oh, I know all about it, I just don't give a ***. At one point in my life, I was vehemently anti-religion, now I just don't don't really care. Ignorance isn't a term someone like you should be throwing around, don't you have some muslims to kill? chop chop

Christianity is much more than the fundamentalism you've probably grown up rebelling against. It really did keep Europe alive in the face of wave upon wave of barbarian invasions after the fall of Rome (AD 476). In addition to domesticating and converting the barbarians (except Islam, which was simply defeated, militarily, and eventually vanquished), it preserved and passed on to Western Man his Roman and Classical Greek heritage. If not for the Catholic Church of the early Middle Ages, the West wouldn't exist in its present form, or that which it has taken for the last 1,600 years. And without that Europe, the U.S. wouldn't exist either. You simply must study the history of Western Christian cuture to better understand your own society. It's really more of a case of history than religion, per se. :headbang:

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@STNGfan,

Red, I oppose any religion running government, just like the framers did. You can try to paint your picture of "oh we are the protectors", I could care less, I don't buy it, and never will.

Pinoc, like I said, I know about it, I just don't care about it. Sorry, no amount of your blathering is going to make me want the church running the state.

1 Reply

@92b16vx,

92b16vx;21143 wrote:

Red, I oppose any religion running government, just like the framers did. You can try to paint your picture of "oh we are the protectors", I could care less, I don't buy it, and never will.

Pinoc, like I said, I know about it, I just don't care about it. Sorry, no amount of your blathering is going to make me want the church running the state.

But, wouldn't you admit you're a bit confused? You fought for America, but now seem to side with the enemy. You should do something to resolve that inner-conflict. Study is one avenue to recovery. :headbang:

1 Reply

@Pinochet73,

Pinochet73;21146 wrote:

But, wouldn't you admit you're a bit confused? You fought for America, but now seem to side with the enemy. You should do something to resolve that inner-conflict. Study is one avenue to recovery. :headbang:

Nope, not confused at all. Contrary to your ignorant opinion, I do not side with islamofascist, but if you think it makes you sound cool to keep saying it...feel free.

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@Drnaline,

Drnaline;20594 wrote:

By the same token, should the religous right have the right to stop there taxes from being used on any secular schools?

Yep.

No one should have to pay for someone else's kid's education, they're not responsible for them. Only the parent is.

Even if the parent's too poor, that's still not the American taxpayer's problem. Leave them alone.

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@92b16vx,

92b16vx;20627 wrote:

Churchs should be taxed to the hilt if they want to play in politics.

I could not agree more...Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson, via the "moral majority", worked to blur the lines between separation of church and state, for their own political ends. When you start imposing your views and positions on others you violate their unalienable rights. Where is tolerance? Where is freedom? There are more than Christians in these United States (and I'm a Christian, myself!)...Christ, Himself, spoke of tolerance and acceptance and love...I have never, in all my days, seen more "un-Christ-like" people than these religious right zealots, who feel free to beat everyone up with their interpretation of what the Bible says. They, obviously did not get Jesus' parable about the Good Samaritan, or what he had to say about Gentiles.

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@STNGfan,

Quote:

Originally stated by 92b16vx
Churchs should be taxed to the hilt if they want to play in politics.

No they shouldn't.

Priests and Imams should be allowed to hold office and churches should be free to give money to politicians.

What we need to do is make sure the law is limited to making something that directly harms another person or their property illegal, nothing else.

Because personally, I don't want the state looking down my shirt, be it the red-shirt Democrats or brown-shirt Republicans.

1 Reply

@One Man Clan,

One Man Clan;21163 wrote:

No they shouldn't.

Priests and Imams should be allowed to hold office and churches should be free to give money to politicians.

What we need to do is make sure the law is limited to making something that directly harms another person or their property illegal, nothing else.

Because personally, I don't want the state looking down my shirt, be it the red-shirt Democrats or brown-shirt Republicans.

Yes, they should. If they want to play the politics game, and deal in legislature that runs on the taxpayers money, then you're damn straight they need to pay up too. I do not care if a priest becomes a politician, as long as he doesn't interject his dogma in laws, it's fine.

1 Reply

@92b16vx,

92b16vx;21166 wrote:

Yes, they should. If they want to play the politics game, and deal in legislature that runs on the taxpayers money, then you're damn straight they need to pay up too. I do not care if a priest becomes a politician, as long as he doesn't interject his dogma in laws, it's fine.

Again, not they don't.

There's not reason to tax them for voicing their opinion, or running for office, or trying to pass legislature.

No reason at all.

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@Reagaknight,

Reagaknight;20632 wrote:

If churches endorse candidates outright, maybe, if they just enforce morals and use them to tell you which candidates are advisable to vote for, then no, because religions have every right to have a code of morality.

Aside from your slight against Nancy Pelosi (I can already tell, you're "agenda-laden"). Clue. Morals cannot be enforced. People either have them or they don't. One man's ceiling is another man's floor. What may be right for you, may not be right for me. Who is to say?
That's like saying, churches can prevent "sinning". Everyone sins, even unintentionally...funny that people like to think that "their sins" are so much more palatable than "others' sins.(There goes that "self-righteous" judging)
Last time I checked, God was in control and in the judgement seat....not you, or anyone else. Why don't you and others leave it up to God to disperse "judgement"?...because one day, we will know, who lived up to His standard, and who didn't. It's written..." the first shall be last, and the last first"...I wouldn't be so smug, were I you. Respectfully.

1 Reply

American United or AU inforcing seperation of church and state

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