Son's girlfriend pregnant... obligations?

absolutely? why not?

it's a better reason to get married than "falling in luuuuhve". besides, it's stepping up to one's single most important responsibility - rearing a child, and insuring it's health and happiness.

I agree that rearing a child is a very important responsibility. That's part of why I think the child's parents should love and respect each other, rather than enter into a marriage that is doomed. Hatred and acrimony is not a good environment for a child, either.

If it's not doomed, wonderful. If for some reason they come to an actual mature understanding this weekend and agree to stay together and see what happens... or something... best of luck to them. But there have been plenty of shotgun marriages that ended up as ugly ugly things for everyone involved -- including the child.

Agree totally with Soz. A child will be much happier growing up in a peaceful, non-stressed home with one parent than growing up in a home with tension. Marriage is not the only answer for an unexpected pregnancy!

if a child is brought into this world, and those that begat him/her are not dead, they are absolutely *obliged* to commit to love, nurture, protect and guide this child.

we are all so familiar with the transactions between men and women -- where a selfish urge to 'have a child' (like it's a birthright) or 'hook' a prospect has led to pregnancy. and we are so familiar with men who have demanded paternity suits and walked away from their responsibilities. and we don't bat an eye, when a father merely pays child support, and that is his only contribution. it's a sad situation when irresponsible, consensual sex leads to the birth of children, and we can't help but talk about it in terms of gender politics, and a transaction between men and women. IMO if the parents are not interested in getting married to each other, they should seriously consider adoption or abortion.

i agree.
but, i would hazard to say that abortion is the only answer to an unwanted pregnancy. unless there is atleast one parent that wants the child unconditionally. seems to me, that if this indeed were a ploy to get the boy to marry/commit, then the girl is going to be more than a little disappointed when he says, sure have the baby, but i am not marrying you. and how often will her disappointment and bitterness spill out in seemingly subtle ways, when she's up all night with a crying baby? or cleaning a snotty nose? or feeding a cranky toddler?
fact is, kid's brains are exquisitely receptive to emotional signals, and during the period of initial growth and development, nothing short of unconditional love, security and protection can insure health.

that is merely the point i am struggling to make.

Heart of the Sun, our understanding of living life is very different. You seem to me to be reading to me from a book you read, and I don't mean that to be insulting, as I had some similar set ideas years ago. But I hear mechanistic rule spouting. Who taught you all these imperatives?



Is that thread between you and Jazzy a concoction? A lesson plan? It does read like it.

Clary, I hope you make this clear to your son...

IF the girl is pregnant, and IF he is the father, and IF she decides to have the baby...(three BIG "ifs")...he will be morally and legally obligated to love and support his child.

Not the child's mother.

Marrying someone you've known for only three weeks is not a very good idea under any circumstances. Particularly not under duress, which is what this sounds like.

This girl really needs to decide if she's ready to be a single parent.

Oh no...a child knows when love is not present and all it takes is knowing mom and dad don't love each other for a child to think it's his/her fault. Why would you burden your child with knowing that you threw away the rest of your life for him/her?

Loving parents in seperate homes beats two miserable ones any day.

Re: Son's girlfriend pregnant... obligations?


Depends on the countries involved and their agreements.

It's definitely a yes between Canada and the U.S., and Canada and a couple of European countries. The provincial regulators take care of enforcement if they are notified.

I'm not clear from an earlier link if he would be legally obligated. Looks like maybe not, for now. But ethically/morally, he was part of the failure to contracept - if that turns out to be true, if only from dumbness re contraception. It may turn out that the child could be his best joy in life. He should get a chance to grow into father without vituperation flinging back and forth... should fatherhood happen.

I get ebrown's point; a guy should also have a say re against going ahead, should that be the question. Or for not going ahead, if not the ultimate chooser.
I see the point. Still, the woman is the decider.

The young woman in this case sounds immature, but a lot of us have been there. Who knows, she may grow into a great woman.

I hope she and him do not get alone time this weekend. Maybe overcautious, but with all that emotional energy coursing through, it would be easy to see how that could lead to her engaging him in a little bedroom activity. Especially if her intentions are selfish or devious, but even if not: for the comfort and such.

That would be a bad thing, obviously.

So, yeah, I'd maybe be thinking of ways to surround him with brothers or buddies or others to 'check in' and just sort of watch his back through this week-end which will most likely feel rather hellish ...and wear down his defences.

Just thoughts.

I get your defensive vibes, flush'd, especially as the committment need seems to have been expressed after the first week some time ago.

Not that that is all so horrible, happens the world over, and often through misaprehension.



Still, maybe she stopped pills for the second visit. (Oh, wait, I am not guessing she is/was that clever I'll shut up on that, as I don't think clever machinations are what this is about, per se.)

Actually, I think this may be an ordinary futzup which has effectuated an agenda.

osso -- all i gotsta say to you, is this:
too many bleeding orphans have been birthed as a result of poor planning, irresponsible behaviour and a lack of accountability.
as for imperatives -- the only one in this case is this: have a child, only if you will insure it's successful growth and development, by caring and providing for it unconditionally. if you are uncertain, abort.

you seem to imply that there are shades of grey when it comes to the decision of becoming a parent, introducing a child into this world. i say, no there isn't. if you had sex and now have a kid in your or your partner's belly, there is no - i think i may take care of it on mondays and thursday, but tuesdays i am doing my nails...

sorry, but i have encountered too many unconscionable, immature, self-absorbed or irresponsible parents (who are damaging to their kids and a problem for society at large) to be able to squeeze out that last drop of misguided kindness towards adults who got pregnant by mistake and are now negotiating terms as a result of it.

am i chastising those that err? ofcourse not. am i "rule spouting"? no, i am expressing my opinion on a matter that i am passionate about: healthy kids.



huh? wth did that come from?

That comes from it-sounds-like-the-same-person-writing-it.

I dunno, and I don't care, caring less and less as I read. Whatever.




On the bleeding orphans thing, eh?????



I'll get back to you.

His brother shares a flat with him, so will be there. He is studying law - has a good rational and legal mind as well as 100% support of the wayward one!

Brother and I spoke on the phone yesterday and agreed that the worst case scenario (for the father) would be having to pay for the next 18 years or so.

I agree of course that if they are having consensual sex, there is a shared responsibility. It's the extent of the responsibility that I'm wondering about. It's not so much the idea of a child that terrifies him as being tied to this manipulative and emotional girl. A marriage or live-in relationship would be a disaster, I think, whereas a single happy parent with family support would probably be relatively OK - not perfect, not what I'd wish for my grandchild but... if you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans! I think the mother might well settle down to being a good parent, and she has the support of her mother. She'll be in Arizona and he's studying for a Master's in London.

Whatever happens, I trust he won't be so careless in future. However, this is jumping the gun. It may turn out to be a false alarm, in which case this thread will be a mere interesting backwater. Many thanks for all your views and input!

Dear osso,

I realise this is off topic but I wanted to address the above point.

No it's not a concoction. I'm a real person. I began posting here b/c I got the vibe it was a friendly place to hang out & seek advice for when life turns to sh*t. hofts has provided some very insightful info - for which I'm grateful...I hope maybe I've given her some useful info too. I thought that's what this community was about.

Live & let live.

-- jazz

ps: Clay - I'd recommend that when your son & his ladyfriend have their chat about who's going to be responsible for what, that maybe he has a friend in the room as well. Not someone who'll defend him or take his side, but someone who can just listen. A witness.

If she is being devious, then she'll think twice about what she says to him, or demands from him. If she's basically an honest person who's found herself in an unpleasant situation, then my guess is that she wouldn't care if there was someone else in the room or not & she'll be reasonable. Just a thought

Just my thought, jazz, see above!

((((((Clary))))))
Tough one. It's always a pity to hear a miracle discussed like a bad omen, though I can certainly understand it. There's pro's and con's on both sides of every decision here, so I wish the kids the best of luck in sorting through them.

I noticed no one mentioned the very real possibility that the pill simply failed. An old friend of mine now has not one but two (and could have been three had the third fetus survived) beautiful adult daughters who were conceived while their mother was on the pill. They increased the strength of the dosage after each failure, but to no effect. I couldn't possibly comment as to the consistency with which his wife took the pills, but do know there was nothing devious as far as anyone ever knew or admitted.

Other comments:

First and foremost; if you're old enough to play (and 24 certainly is), you are old enough to pay. In the event that she does have your grandchild, it is most certainly his responsibility to be supportive financially.

Shotgun marriage is a ridiculous solution for reasons already mentioned. Marriage could (theoretically) be a wonderful solution but only if mutually agreed by both parties to be about more than the pregnancy. A long shot even then… but at least then there would be hope.

Ebrown's theory of male rights will have merit just as soon as men start carrying babies. Until then; the ultimate decision has to be hers. Period.

1. Is she indeed pregnant?
2. Is she going to try to have the baby? There's no guarantees of success here either… especially after such a short time after the early pregnancy test. Hardly a given. Additional note: An 18 year financial burden is worthy of consideration... as is a lifetime long burden of guilt if one chooses to end a pregnancy. There are no easy answers here. I would imagine willful abandonment of ones obligations would have the same effect on a person as willful destruction, so I wouldn't rush to suggest either (whether it be legal or not).
3. Get a paternity test immediately upon birth. Here in the States; the State will pick up the tab for medical expenses until birth if she lacks the insurance or the means so there is no reason to take her word for it. If it's his; it's time to be a man. Upon adjudication, he may be asked to reimburse the State.

Best wishes to you and yours!

Per Clary's wishes; I will not debate the merits or lack thereof of abortion, marriage, or father's right's on this thread. I offer my opinions for her benefit alone.

It really sounds like your 'boy' is covered and has all the back-up anyone could ever wish for, Clary!

Nothing more I can offer, except wanted to tell you I admire your realism and respect for his choices as an adult. Not so many parents out there like you.

Listening in for update and thinking of ya.

Thanks for both of those, and I'm flushed from flush'd's kind remarks. I have now had the following information from the Girl -somewhat too gynaecological for some readers perhaps!

I'm six weeks. Due date: July 23, 2007.
She [doctor] explained to me how it could have possibly happened,
It wasn't my period that I had last time I was there, it was implantation
bleeding. That's why it was so light. I must ovulate late in my cycle, even
though I shouldn't have been ovulating at all. This whole thing was very
unlikely, but not impossible.

So, it was really an unpredictable mistake; I don't really understand why implanting should have happened, or why the pill failed. Strangely enough, I was on the so-called minipill after this son was born, and breast-feeding, yet managed to conceive his brother, so I understand mistakes can happen.