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8 months of marriage, and we are scheduled for counselling

 
 
heartofthesun
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Dec, 2006 04:16 pm
goodafdernoon, jazzometer.

if forced, he would show interest. for a second or two. very proud of me/my work. but in the manner in which someone would support a spouse's hobby. my career aspirations are not as serious or urgent as are his. it's too much work to force the conversation every time..

jazzieB123 wrote:
I'm gonna speculate that yr career is probably a bit like mine - that is, creatively based & one which others cannot really help you find new jobs or develop new horizons. Whatever gigs you get are most likely self-generated & based on who you know more than what you know. That means the more time you spend working on his business, the longer you're out of your own world. Could this be problematic for you in the long run, in terms of missing out on valuable opportunities?


yeppity pooh. absolutely. and i have lost a lot of time..


jazzieB123 wrote:
Perhaps he feels his business/career takes priority right now, b/c HE is earning the money, putting food on the table ..?


i wonder if it is just as simple as, his biz/career takes priority b/c it is his..whereas mine just does not matter.

sadly, i am pathetically challenged when it comes to 'keeping house' and baking cookies, so i cannot figure out why he would even want to keep me around without a job Smile)



jazzieB123 wrote:
Hmmm, would grant money go toward your career/ambitions or his??


grant money -- for my work. he keeps offering to foot the bill for my research expenses..but it doesn't work like that in my field. i need to identify a sponsoring body, and then apply for a grant to do my work.


jazzieB123 wrote:
As for getting out & getting some money - is there any kind of part time Christmas overflow work you could do just to get some ready cash? Finding a well paying jobbie this side of the new year is virtually impossible but there's often heaps of Christmas McJobs around this time of year. They're about for 4-5 wks, then gone. The trick would be to pick a company you quite like (Borders for eg) & not to take it seriously or it'll eat you alive. Waddyareckon?


for right now, he has deposited money into my bank a/c (in lieu of a direct deposit or a joint a/c) - but the whole situation is YUCK! i feel like i am with my parents, asking for pocket money. ew!

i am proud of the contribution that i am making to his company, which in itself keeps me in a happy mental space. reminds me that i am not a complete basketcase. forces him to acknowledge the value-ad.
0 Replies
 
heartofthesun
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Dec, 2006 04:29 pm
jazzieB123 wrote:

Shame, really as that's what I thought intimate partnerships were about. I'm confused by his behaviour and it has made me more determined than ever to get a job anywhere away from here. I shouldnt be afraid to tell my husband anything, but now I am. He doesnt get it and he doesnt get me. Whatsmore his reaction shows me that he doesnt even want to learn.


jazz.

why is he sleep deprived? worried abt the relationship?

any possibility that you can carve out a coffee shop (neutral) visit with each other (formal) to discuss your relationship? snatches of dialogue are not going to cut it. it has to be a level, even keeled intervention -- with/without the mcounsellor. screw the mc, if he is not going to go. it's a losing battle, atleast for now. if he is unable to commit even to a weekend discussion with his wife -- send me your resume and i will pass it around to everyone i know!

but wait for the weekend, so there are no sleep-related outbursts!

what do you think..?
0 Replies
 
jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Dec, 2006 04:51 pm
heartofthesun wrote:
... very proud of me/my work. but in the manner in which someone would support a spouse's hobby. my career aspirations are not as serious or urgent as are his.
...i wonder if it is just as simple as, his biz/career takes priority b/c it is his..whereas mine just does not matter.
...he has deposited money into my bank a/c (in lieu of a direct deposit or a joint a/c) - but the whole situation is YUCK! i feel like i am with my parents, asking for pocket money.


Hey presh,

Being proud of your work is great but being actively supportive & interested in it is more important IMHO. My husb doesnt understand my work but claims to be proud of it. Yet asks me nothing about it or my job search. I take this as a lack of interest.

Anyway - please don't let your husb make you feel that your aspirations are not every bit as important as his - your ambitions, aspirations & achievements are vital to your inner health. They are ten times more important to you than his should be. What would it take for him to realise that your career *matters*? How does he recognise "what matters" and what doesnt? Perhaps he equates a high financial return with whether a career is important or not? I bet if you earned twice as much money as him, suddenly your career would matter. I'm not having a go, just throwing around some wild thoughts.

Also, perhaps he is climbing his mental mountain currently while you're tending base camp. When he comes down, then you can go up your mountain - and he can tend base camp & support you while you do it. It's impossible for 2 people in a partnership to climb up their own mountains simultaneously b/c then there is no one tending to base camp - and the supplies dry up. No one is nourished, no one is supported.

Make sure that he doesn't stay up on his mountain for so long that it jeopardises your work & leaves you feeling taken for granted. Ask him to come down occassionally so that you can go up your own mountain.

Ugh. The money thing. It's horrid. I feel guilty spending money from our joint acc but that's my own thing to get over. Try not to cast your husb in the role of parent (re asking parents for pocket money) otherwise you might grow to resent him. Can you put in place a regular deposit (say, every 2nd Friday) so that you dont have to ask him for money? Nothing worse than feeling like Oliver Twist, eh?

Money widens the power gap - which is why it's SO important for you to stay your ground in terms of invoicing him and sticking to your guns in retaining some financial independence. I'm sure you know all that tho, lol.

-- jazzomundo
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jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Dec, 2006 05:05 pm
heartofthesun wrote:
...why is he sleep deprived? worried abt the relationship?
...any possibility that you can carve out a coffee shop (neutral) visit with each other (formal) to discuss your relationship?
...send me your resume and i will pass it around to everyone i know!
...wait for the weekend, so there are no sleep-related outbursts!


Hey,

He works long days. Snores his box off, think it wakes him up. Certainly keeps me awake all freakin night - every night. blah. Is he worried about us? Who knows. He doesnt talk to me about "us", per se. I'm always the one who has to bring it up ... boring.

I'd consider the cafe thing if I was confident of not crying - but I weep everytime I talk about stuff close to my heart. We're going away this w/end but talking about "us" has the potential to ruin a nice break & I suspect he's sick of hearing what I have to say about us, sick of me crying & being sad, angry & depressed.

LOL on the CV thing. You're a total gem Smile

Back to the job hunt ...
0 Replies
 
heartofthesun
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Dec, 2006 05:40 pm
jazzieB123 wrote:

My husb doesnt understand my work but claims to be proud of it. Yet asks me nothing about it or my job search. I take this as a lack of interest.


couldn't agree more!

jazzieB123 wrote:

b/c then there is no one tending to base camp - and the supplies dry up. No one is nourished, no one is supported.

Make sure that he doesn't stay up on his mountain for so long that it jeopardises your work & leaves you feeling taken for granted. Ask him to come down occassionally so that you can go up your own mountain.


there you go being wise and reasonable again! Smile)

in the best case scenario, the mountain analogy applies to our situation. alternatively, he is in a hurry to climb his mountain and will forget abt coming down to tend base camp once he is up there...


your upcoming weekend plans sound good. will be helpful to get away for a bit. as for weeping in public -- well, those that cry heartily are healthier than those that sniffle! cry away..and find resolution.

we haven't had weekend plans since we got hitched...so LUCKY you! Smile
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heartofthesun
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 Dec, 2006 12:20 pm
new exercise --
decide on a day, time and place / week, when and where we will agree to argue for 1 hour (only). all week, we are to write down the things that we want to air and find a way to get it all out in 1 hour. no more arguing for the rest of the week.

if annoyance strikes, it is ok to acknowledge the anger and express that one is angry. but no discussion/dialogue can ensue.

our day is wednesdays, at 7:30pm, at home....

will just have to wait and see how this works..
0 Replies
 
jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 Dec, 2006 04:20 pm
heartofthesun wrote:
...decide on a day, time and place / week, when and where we will agree to argue for 1 hour (only). all week, we are to write down the things that we want to air and find a way to get it all out in 1 hour. no more arguing for the rest of the week.
...if annoyance strikes, it is ok to acknowledge the anger and express that one is angry. but no discussion/dialogue can ensue.
...our day is wednesdays, at 7:30pm, at home.
Quote:


Hey I'm loving this! ... but what happens if there is unfinished biz left to discuss? Does it get pushed into the following week or can you go over the hour limit?

If you HAVE to cut it off at the one hour mark, does this mean that the time-keeper is the one ultimately in charge of ending the dialogue and can close it down?

That represents a control/power thing. When it comes time to end the discussion I reckon you should both agree to end it - kind of like closing a contract. Not have just one person ending it while the other person still has stuff to say. Also, if it takes your husb a while to get his answers out (or vice versa) then you have to patiently wait for his answers, yes? And when the clock is ticking down, who has that kind of patience? lol Wink

On ending the conversation thing, my husb used to "end" then by just walking away. I'd be half way thru saying something, or there'd be a pause in the convo, and he'd just leave the room. It drove me crazy. I refused to get up and follow him around the house like a freakin shrew. That's not my style. So. I told him how abrupt he was being & asked him to please stay in the room until we BOTH agreed that the conversation had ended. Then we could both move on from it knowing we'd gotten everything off our chests.

Are you familiar with the talking stick thing? Its a hoot and even tho it feels a bit silly, it really does work Smile

-- jazzster
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jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Dec, 2006 06:14 pm
oi hofts,

Dropping in to wish you luck for tonight Wink I hope the scheduled chat goes well!

-- jazz
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leather07
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Dec, 2006 11:08 am
You can save your marriage together.
My wife and I have been married 33 years. It has been tough at times. The 3 most important things to do:
1. communication
2. communication
3. communication

I know that looks stupid, but if you need therapy after a short marriage then you must not be communicating.

We have a website with free information on families and avoiding divorce. I think it may help answer some of your questions.

Go to Edit [Moderator]: Link removed and look through it.

If you work at life it will reward you.
0 Replies
 
jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Dec, 2006 11:32 am
Hi leather07,

Thanks for your response and no, it doesn't look silly at all! My husb and I are not communicating properly - we barely communicate at all and when we do, one of us says upsets the other inadvertently etc blah blah blah. I desperately want him to come to counselling so that we can address how to communicate, but after agreeing to come to counselling initially, he backed out citing a lame excuse. I want to fix things but he seems disinterested in doing so. We both have a raft of issues with the other, but neither of us knows what to say or how to say it so we end up living in a polite vaccuum. It's horrible. I'll go to your website later today (I have to head out for a few hours now) and have a look and a big read. Thanks for the link Smile I appreciate it.

-- jazz
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jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Dec, 2006 11:37 am
Oh, leather07 - the other reason I think hofts and I are in a similar boat is that we both married American men (neither hofts or I are from the US) and moved to a new country with different culture & communication styles. Sure, most of the probs may be personality based - but the cultural differences are also enormous. Smile


-- jazz
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heartofthesun
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Dec, 2006 03:48 pm
hey jazziekins!

thanks leather. just popped in, to see what was going on and update. haven't been getting my email notifiers, hence had no idea that there was activity in this quarter...will check out the thread you have pointed us to.

communication. KEY. how to, is the question.

jazz- counselling's been awesome wrt really enhancing our communication skills with one another. at our last session, with all the improvement we have gone through, the counz was super excited and happy -- repeating how good it is that people like us, so early in our marriage are meeting these problems head on. the longer you wait to address these problems, the harder it gets to break patterns of behaviour. turns out, we are in the pliable stage...ie, you guys and us, both within a year of marriage. and simple exercises have a huge effect.

now, having said that, we had a biggish argument this past week, and through the course of it we came to the understanding that we were just going to go ahead and divy up all our marital responsibilities, fair and square. any left over time will be devoted to either scheduled joint events (once a week, but i would prefer it if it were less than that) or for our won personal time.

this weekend he was up in vegas with some silly boys, at a bachelor party. i enjoyed my time alone, and felt rejuvenated. basically, i have decided that there is one thing that i knew worked well for me, my life before marriage. and the hardest thing was to make that mental switch. i think i may have, and am happy for it. atleast for the time being.

as for things that may apply to you guys -- one thing that we have started incorporating into our interaction with each other is negotiation. so, if i do this with you, will you promise to do that with me...etc. mercenary, but seems to work well. that way i don't get hurt, because the guessing is removed from the equation.

as you can tell, i am not happy today. but am better able to cope this time, i think...

hope you are well.
how was the weekend trip?
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jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Dec, 2006 01:51 am
hey chook,

great to hear from you, was wondering how things were coming together & am stoked to hear the comms skills are functioning well! the negotiating thing is so important and it's something my counsellor suggested i try too ... but it's hard for me to implement things i've learned in counselling at home. my husb gets very 'thingy' about being told what to do by a 3rd party by proxy no less, LOL. yeh, i can imagine how mercenary it would feel - but hey, if it works and you both get what you need, then is it a bad thing??

oh hey - here's something to try if your husb doesnt appear to be interested in things you're doing, or doesn't ask you any questions or seems to be indifferent ... just ask him to ask you a question. bingo. so simple and yet it works. i started doing this b/c my husb didn't ask me anything about anything - which contributed to me feeling isolated, like i was living in a void. so out of the blue, i asked him to ask me a question, about anything on earth. i make the effort to answer him as fully as possible. and it works. he is now asking me more questions about what im doing, how i feel about certain things, etc. that single simple thing has made a big diff to our relationship & opened it up a lot. i think he realised that i was feeling forgotten about b/c he wasn't asking me anything. i assumed he was therefore disinterested.

the w'end away was fab. i always relax when im near the ocean (which is where we went) & we just clicked for the first time in ages. interstingly, we argued on the drive back home, i got a tummy ache & all twisted inside at the thought of coming back to our polite small suburban life. in a big surprise, my husb has agreed to leave this town if .. IF i score a job that pays absurdly well enough to support us both in a new city until he can get a job there too. can't tell you what a relief that is. LOL

trust me, i am so looking for that job. how is your job search going? or is it still temporarily on hold whilst you help your husb in his biz endeavours?? what's the scoop?

-- jazz
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heartofthesun
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Dec, 2006 09:05 pm
awesome! sounds like things are on an upswing at your end. that's fantastic!!
as for the ocean, i was bred by it, and i feel dead when i am away from it..so i hear ya!

just sent out my cv to an institute in NY. let's see what happens.
since husband and i decided to lead independent lives and only schedule in joint ventures, it has been easier for me to be less neurotic. i do not have to wait up for him anymore, aside from the one day in the week when i plan something for the 2 of us, and one day of the week, when it is his date night. this weekend, he gave up a hank williams play/musical for a gay holiday special for me! the gay holiday special, btw, was amazing! Smile) now, it's my turn to do something for him on my date night...which is..i don't know, i think friday.

excited abt your potential job prospects. you have got to get out of middle america! it will take care of most of your angst! job satisfaction, the ocean, an exciting city, better understanding between spouse and you will take care of the rest.

good luck! let's hope we both land the jobs we would like in the new year!
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jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Dec, 2006 02:31 am
hey hoftsie

thanx for your speedy response - im fascinated by the joint night thing. im thrilled it gives you back your own time and space and it also gives your husb room to move - but is it only one night a week each?

brownie points to him for giving up hank williams in favour of the gay holiday musical - man, that's love!

you know. there's something else i forgot to mention - a realisation that dawned on me during our weekend away. that is ... i need to stop expecting my husband to be like one of my girlfriends. in the absence of my girlfriends, i've absentmindedly been wanting him to fill that void. and he can't. i realise in hindsight it's a bit unfair of me to hope that he talks more than he does, shares more than he does and is more open. i desperately wish i could have the same relationship with him that i have with my closest girlfriends, but i just dont think that's possible. i mean, he's a man. men are wired differently.

it was a wierd thing to realise.

hey great news that you sent your CV to NY - ive also applied there for work - and Chicago. oh, alaska too. LOL. and LA - you name it, i'm applying ...
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jazzieB123
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jan, 2007 05:41 pm
hey hofts,

how goes your job search? and life? and stuff? Smile happy new year to you hon.

jazzola
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