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John Kerry - what a dork

 
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 06:34 pm
gustavratzenhofer wrote:
RexRed wrote:
You people on the left should be called what you are terrorists and drug addicts.

Go to the local bars in any city in the US and see who is dirty dancing and drunk out of their minds doing lines of coke, NIGHT AFTER NIGHT, ...the same people voting for the democrats.

And these same people don't even know who George Soros is...


<Gus>


Laughing

drunk and doing lines of blow ?? didn't know ol' dubya voted democrat..

gus, we gotta wonder if the people shriekin' out the good news from fox even know who Richard Mellon Scaife is...
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JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 07:26 pm
The Saturday cartoons provide a good analysis of this issue.

http://bobgeiger.blogspot.com/2006/11/saturday-cartoons.html
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 07:32 pm
JTT, Good link; I made it one of my Favorites. Thanks.
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JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 07:41 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
JTT, Good link; I made it one of my Favorites. Thanks.


You're welcome, CI, but you actually don't need that link. You can just read Timber's analysis of every little ole thing and know that you're getting the straight goods.
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timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 07:55 pm
Business in general, throughout the Western world, along with political reluctance to recognize and address the gathering threat contributed to the conditions which culminated in Hitler's takeover of Germany ... much as a generation previously business and political interests saw to their own agendas as World War I developed out of the conditions created by the self-interest-motivated policies of business and politics of that time.

Kerry's anti-war activities in the '70s were a component of the US withdrawal from Southeast Asia - not the only component to be sure, but a component. The US withdrawal from Southeast Asia was a component of the conditions which led to Pol Pot's takeover of Cambodia - not the only component, but a component none the less. The U.N.'s failure to act decisively was another component, as were Soviet and Chinese back-scene proxy war machinations. No one thing "did it", likely no one thing would have prevented it, but history clearly shows the situation developed out of all those things.
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JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 08:40 pm
timberlandko wrote:
Business in general, throughout the Western world, along with political reluctance to recognize and address the gathering threat contributed to the conditions which culminated in Hitler's ...


This is exactly what I described, Timber. If you and georgeob1 weren't such sycophantic homies, we could possibly see something in what you write. But in the face of such stupendous incompetence, there should be at least a measure of criticism of the current group in power.

That there is none and that you avoid this with such aplomb and focus on such inane drivel as this Kerry fairy tale you weave tells us a great deal about how much you can be trusted to deliver anything remotely resembling the truth.

You're hardly alone in this, but that's not much of a defence.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 08:57 pm
JTT wrote:

This is exactly what I described, Timber. If you and georgeob1 weren't such sycophantic homies, we could possibly see something in what you write. But in the face of such stupendous incompetence, there should be at least a measure of criticism of the current group in power.

That there is none and that you avoid this with such aplomb and focus on such inane drivel as this Kerry fairy tale you weave tells us a great deal about how much you can be trusted to deliver anything remotely resembling the truth.

You're hardly alone in this, but that's not much of a defence.


What is a "sycophantic homie"??? To whom do you imagine we are directing this supposed sycophancy?

I think your point here is that Bush is so incompetent that no one should ever discuss anything else, particularly the character of Senator Kerry. I believe that is a rather odd comment for you to make in a thread dedicated to the character of the well-coiffed, well-married Senator himself (I do like that phrase!). There are after all numerous other threads dedicated to the failings of the Bush Administration.

I suspect that both Timber and I could produce a rather long list of errors we see and failings we note in the actions of the Bush Administration. However the name-calling and intemperate and unbounded condemnation you and a few others so consistently put forth tends to drive out reasoned, balanced conversation. Gresham's law of dialogue.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 08:59 pm
JTT, Diversion has been perfected by the neoconservatives. That they can ignore current events with such aplomb tells us enough. They can describe 35-year old events as if it happened in recent years, but they have difficulty in discussing real current events "as it is." Let's start with Bush Jr who is "directly" responsible for Iraq; No need to start naming people in the peripheries...like Kerry and Pol Pot. But if timber insists on being consistent, I willl welcome it.
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talk72000
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 09:10 pm
The Kerry botched joke is a red herring to divert attention from W's failings. Kerry was a minor figure and probably will remain minor as a result of his failed joke.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 09:16 pm
george, Please be good enough to make that list of Bush's errors and failings on this thread for all of us to see. I want to see how "complete" and honest you can be, because I've not seen anything like it anywhere else. This, I gotta see.
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 09:19 pm
I think there is no doubt that the Republicans exploited Kerry's gaffe for their own benefit. However, it is not true to say that Kerry is a minor political figure. He is a prominent Senator, was the Democrat nominee for the Presidency in the last election and was working hard to make himself a candidate in the next one. I agree he may be a dead letter now -- he set himself up for the character issue by his exaggerated claims of heroism in Vietnam, the self aggrandizement he demonstrated, both on active duty and in associating himself with a bunch of charlatains claiming widespread atrocities soon after he left the service, that so inflamed the officers who served with him, and the daffy self-absorbtion that has so consistently marked his many goofy statements in recent years.

It wasn't just a failed joke - and that is what has done him in.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Nov, 2006 09:23 pm
george, I agree that Kerry's gaff probably cost the democrats more votes than most realize. That's what politics is all about. For me, Kerry was never a good candidate for our country, and I never voted for him.

Now, let's hear about Bush's errors and failings; a long list, if you please.
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 03:30 am
timberlandko wrote:
Business in general, throughout the Western world, along with political reluctance to recognize and address the gathering threat contributed to the conditions which culminated in Hitler's takeover of Germany ... much as a generation previously business and political interests saw to their own agendas as World War I developed out of the conditions created by the self-interest-motivated policies of business and politics of that time.

Kerry's anti-war activities in the '70s were a component of the US withdrawal from Southeast Asia - not the only component to be sure, but a component. The US withdrawal from Southeast Asia was a component of the conditions which led to Pol Pot's takeover of Cambodia - not the only component, but a component none the less. The U.N.'s failure to act decisively was another component, as were Soviet and Chinese back-scene proxy war machinations. No one thing "did it", likely no one thing would have prevented it, but history clearly shows the situation developed out of all those things.


Sure, timber. That's a somewhat different statement from your original one, though. You basically drew a strait line from Kerry's activites to the Cambodian genocide - just like the wackos from the other side of the isle who ascribe the rise of old Adolf to grandpa Bush alone.

Proportion. That's it.
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mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 04:59 am
cicerone imposter wrote:
Some people just can't see through their own bias.


And if you are honest you will include yourself in that statement.
0 Replies
 
kelticwizard
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 06:42 am
Still waiting for georgeob to give us that list of Bush failings he claimed to be able to provide.
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gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 06:48 am
All demokkkrats are dorks. Joe Lieberman just got drummed out of the dem party for refusing to BECOME a dork.
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revel
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 06:53 am
georgeob1 wrote:
I think there is no doubt that the Republicans exploited Kerry's gaffe for their own benefit. However, it is not true to say that Kerry is a minor political figure. He is a prominent Senator, was the Democrat nominee for the Presidency in the last election and was working hard to make himself a candidate in the next one. I agree he may be a dead letter now -- he set himself up for the character issue by his exaggerated claims of heroism in Vietnam, the self aggrandizement he demonstrated, both on active duty and in associating himself with a bunch of charlatains claiming widespread atrocities soon after he left the service, that so inflamed the officers who served with him, and the daffy self-absorbtion that has so consistently marked his many goofy statements in recent years.

It wasn't just a failed joke - and that is what has done him in.


I think it is jut sick the way first the swift boat liars keep getting away with their dirty politician lies and two the way my own party just seems willing to throw kerry to the dogs for a couple of misstatements both concerning his vietnam period and this latest episode in which he was not referring to the troops at all but to the president as has been proven and I have no desire to get into it again because it has been proven. It was a failed joke, but I realize it is a loosing battle to keep saying it over and over again. I don't know if a link has been provided from a fellow that was actually at the swift boat incident, but to me it is a very compelling piece. I know ahead of time that you will provide counter lies from you own sources, so ahead of time, I will just say bull and leave it at that. In my opinion if the house and senate retain their majorities for whatever reason after everything that has been proven against this crooked administration yet again, we deserve what we get.

Quote:
When I surfaced, all the swift boats had left, and I was alone taking fire from both banks. To avoid the incoming fire, I repeatedly swam under water as long as I could hold my breath, attempting to make it to the north bank of the river. I thought I would die right there. The odds were against me avoiding the incoming fire and, even if I made it out of the river, I thought I'd be captured and executed. Kerry must have seen me in the water and directed his driver, Del Sandusky, to turn the boat around. Kerry's boat ran up to me in the water, bow on, and I was able to climb up a cargo net to the lip of the deck. But, because I was nearly upside down, I couldn't make it over the edge of the deck. This left me hanging out in the open, a perfect target. John, already wounded by the explosion that threw me off his boat, came out onto the bow, exposing himself to the fire directed at us from the jungle, and pulled me aboard.

For his actions that day, I recommended John for the Silver Star, our country's third highest award for bravery under fire. I learned only this past January that the Navy awarded John the Bronze Star with Combat V for his valor. The citation for this award, signed by the Commander of U.S. Naval Forces, Vietnam, Vice Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, read, "Lieutenant (junior grade) Kerry's calmness, professionalism and great personal courage under fire were in keeping with the highest traditions of the United States Naval Service." To this day I am grateful to John Kerry for saving my life. And to this day I still believe that he deserved the Silver Star for his courage.

It has been many years since I served in Vietnam. I returned home, got married, and spent many years as a deputy sheriff for Los Angeles County. I retired in 1989 as a lieutenant. It has been a long time since I left Vietnam, but I think often of the men who did not come home with us.

I am neither a politician nor an organizer. I am a retired police officer with a passion for orchids. Until January of this year, the only public presentations I made were about my orchid hobby. But in this presidential election, I had to speak out; I had to tell the American people about John Kerry, about his wisdom and courage, about his vision and leadership. I would trust John Kerry with my life, and I would entrust John Kerry with the well-being of our country.

Nobody asked me to join John's campaign. Why would they? I am a Republican, and for more than 30 years I have largely voted for Republicans. I volunteered for his campaign because I have seen John Kerry in the worst of conditions. I know his character. I've witnessed his bravery and leadership under fire. And I truly know he will be a great commander in chief.

Now, 35 years after the fact, some Republican-financed Swift Boat Veterans for Bush are suddenly lying about John Kerry's service in Vietnam; they are calling him a traitor because he spoke out against the Nixon administration's failed policies in Vietnam. Some of these Republican-sponsored veterans are the same ones who spoke out against John at the behest of the Nixon administration in 1971. But this time their attacks are more vicious, their lies cut deep and are directed not just at John Kerry, but at me and each of his crewmates as well. This hate-filled ad asserts that I was not under fire; it questions my words and Navy records. This smear campaign has been launched by people without decency, people who don't understand the bond of those who serve in combat.

...

Does this strategy of attacking combat Vietnam veterans sound familiar? In 2000, a similar Republican smear campaign was launched against Sen. McCain. In fact, the very same communications group, Spaeth Communications, that placed ads against John McCain in 2000 is involved in these vicious attacks against John Kerry. Texas Republican donors with close ties to George W. Bush and Karl Rove crafted this "dishonest and dishonorable" ad. Their new charges are false; their stories are fabricated, made up by people who did not serve with Kerry in Vietnam. They insult and defame all of us who served in Vietnam.
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gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 06:53 am
georgeob1 wrote:
I think there is no doubt that the Republicans exploited Kerry's gaffe for their own benefit. However, it is not true to say that Kerry is a minor political figure. He is a prominent Senator, was the Democrat nominee for the Presidency in the last election and was working hard to make himself a candidate in the next one.


The mind boggles at how ****ed up a political party has to be to run John the f'ing gigolo for president. How are they going to try to top the gigolo/shyster ticket of 04 in the next election? Some sort of an Arnold/Iscariat ticket? I mean, it sounds good on paper, but those two guys are long dead....
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 06:56 am
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revel
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Nov, 2006 06:57 am
I meant to leave a link for the quote here it is. Again I have no desire to get into a reneved debate about this old hashed out debate, I am just so disgusted with todays republicans it is depressing.
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