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THE US, THE UN AND IRAQ, TENTH THREAD.

 
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 12:11 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
I very much doubt that righties are capable of understanding the Enlgish language, ...


Understand it? I've never even heard of it.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 12:22 pm
Typical Tico retort. Nuf said.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 12:26 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Typical Tico retort. Nuf said.


Just giving an appropriate response to a typical c.i. post.


'Nuff said.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 01:00 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
ican, For every pro-Iraq war article you can post, there are con-Iraq war articles to be found in search land. You have proved nothing. Those are biased opinions by people that have sacrificed nothing but their mouths. Have them send their loves ones to Iraq and Afghanistan; then they might have some credibility.


cice, For every con-Iraq war article you can post, there are pro-Iraq war articles to be found in search land. You have proved nothing. Those con-Iraq war articles are biased opinions by people that know nothing of the true opinions of a great majority of those in our military in Afghanistan and Iraq who are pro-Iraq war. Send those con-Iraq article writers to Iraq and Afghanistan where they can learn from that great majority of our pro-Iraq military there, what is actually being accomplished there, despite all our flaws and mistakes, and most especially despite all those biased opinion con-Iraq articles published in America.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 01:03 pm
Quote:
hose con-Iraq war articles are biased opinions by people that know nothing of the true opinions of a great majority of those in our military in Afghanistan and Iraq who are pro-Iraq war.


No, your sources are biased and probably heavily edited by the Military.

See how this game works?

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 01:23 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:

...
No, your sources are biased and probably heavily edited by the Military.
... Cycloptichorn

Yes, my sources are biased too. My sources are individual military volunteers both currently in Iraq and formally in Iraq. I have come to know them personally via face to face conversations, telephone conversations, e-mail exchanges, and written correspondence. If the military is editing their remarks, the military has become technologically prescient or omnipresent. But if that is true, the capabilities of our military have become far greater than I ever dared hope. And if that is true, America has already won the war in Iraq, and the LIEbral media has been hiding that news from the public.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 02:35 pm
Okay, ican, so for the 150,000 military in Iraq and Afghanistan, what percentage do you "really" know?

Aren't you the one that questions the validity of polls?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 02:37 pm
Apparently he values the opinions of pawns more than any other piece, or anyone observing the board.

We should play chess sometime, Ican!

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 06:09 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Okay, ican, so for the 150,000 military in Iraq and Afghanistan, what percentage do you "really" know?

Aren't you the one that questions the validity of polls?

I know a few more than 15 pro-Iraq war military (and zero anti-Iraq war military), who when based at home live at a joint commercial and army use base, to and from which I often fly with flight students. But to keep the arithmetic simple let's say 15. Yes, that is 1, ten-thousandth of the 150,000 military you allege are in Iraq, or 0.01%. But that is also about the same number of non-military sources I have encountered that are anti-Iraq war.

It is alleged -- not by me -- that 1,000 selected at random out of say 100,000,000 American adults is a valid sample. That is 1, one-hundred-thousandth of the American domestic adult population, or 0.001%. Well I'll be damned! Except for the fact that my sample is not selected at random, I do have a ten times bigger percentage sample!

So who shall I believe?

You recommended I withhold my judgent until I have served in Iraq for I guess a year, before I judge whether the war in Iraq is necessary or not. Well, I can recommend the same to you. Or if you rather, do your own sample of the military, before you judge whether the war in Iraq is necessary or not.

Actually, I depend on the 18 sources I've list here again, and not on any poll sample to decide whether the war in Iraq is necessary or not. I actually recommend you rely on the same.

MY PRINCIPAL SOURCES:

1. Osama Bin Laden "Declaration of War Against the Americans Occupying the Land of the Two Holy Places"-1996.
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1996.html

2. Osama Bin Laden: Text of Fatwah Urging Jihad Against Americans-1998
http://www.ict.org.il/articles/fatwah.htm

3. Al-Qaida Statement Warning Muslims Against Associating With The Crusaders And Idols; Translation By JUS; Jun 09, 2004 from the Al-Qaida Organization of the Arab Gulf; 19 Rabbi Al-Akhir 1425
http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg00035.html

4. 9-11 Commission, 9/20/2004. Includes reports of administration and congressional declarations and resolutions regarding reaction to 9/11 plus al-Qaeda history in Afghanistan and Iraq.
www.9-11commission.gov/report/index.htm

5. Charles Duelfer's Report, 30 September 2004
Regime Strategic Intent – Key Findings [re: allegations of Iraq WMD]
www.cia.gov/cia/reports/iraq_wmd_2004/Comp_Report_Key_Findings.pdf

6. Public Law 107-243, 107th Congress, Joint Resolution, Oct. 16, 2002, H.J. Res. 114,
To authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq
www.c-span.org/resources/pdf/hjres114.pdf

7. Secretary of State, Colin Powell’s speech to UN, 2/5/2003,
The section on "sinister nexus" (this allegation was never refuted by Saddam's regime, while the Iraq WMD and Iraq abetting 9/11 allegations were refuted by Saddam's regime)
http://www.state.gov/secretary/former/powell/remarks/2003/17300.htm

8. "American Soldier," by General Tommy Franks, 7/1/2004
"10" Regan Books, An Imprint of HarperCollins Publishers;
Described the Coalition attacks on al-Qaeda training camps in northeastern Iraq, and on another terrorist training camp south of Baghdad. See pages 483, and 519.

9. The Encyclopedia Britannica
IRAQ (discussing al-Qaeda support of terrorist sanctuaries in northeastern Iraq
www.britannica.com

10. The Encyclopedia Britannica
History of Arabia
Roman History
The Rise of Islam including the Arab 7th century conquering of Palestine and the 11thcentury conquering of Arab Palestine.
Mesopotamia from c. 320 BC to c. AD 620 > The Sasanian period
www.britannica.com

11. Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
ISLAMIC MOVEMENT IN KURDISTAN
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Movement_in_Kurdistan ;

12. Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
ANSAR AL-ISLAM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ansar_al-Islam

13. Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
TERRORIST INCIDENTS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1996

14. STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT, October 31, 1998
H.R. 4655, the "Iraq Liberation Act of 1998
www.library.cornell.edu/colldev/mideast/libera.htm

15. Joint Resolution of Congress: Passed September 14, 2001. To authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against those responsible for the recent attacks launched against the United States.
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/military/terroristattack/joint-resolution_9-14.html

16. Public Law 107-243 107th Congress Joint Resolution Oct. 16, 2002 (H.J. Res. 114)
To authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq:

Congress wrote:
[10]Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

[11]Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations, including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of United States citizens;

www.c-span.org/resources/pdf/hjres114.pdf

17. Estimates of the number of civilians mass murdered by Saddam Hussein’s regime.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Utilities/printer_preview.asp?idArticle=3889&R=C495A28
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1039115/posts

18. IBC’s Count of Civilians Killed in Iraq since 1/1/2003
http://www.iraqbodycount.org/database/
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 06:17 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Apparently he values the opinions of pawns more than any other piece, or anyone observing the board.

We should play chess sometime, Ican!

Cycloptichorn

As you know, pawns can evolve to queens in chess. One effective strategy with regular chess players (not chess masters) is to trade pieces down to where only pawns are left in positions threatening to become queens. If you are good at that, you'll win far more times than you'll lose.

Think about it! Think about it beyond its implications in chess!
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 06:36 pm
ican, You keep bringing up moot points for why Bush got us engaged in Iraq. All witnesses who knows anything about WMDs and Saddam's connection to Al Qaeda have been refuted by the experts. There are no WMDs and no evidence that Saddam had direct connections to Al Qaeda or Osama.

That the soldiers you know are gung-ho for this war are considered patriots for fighting a war their commander in chief commanded them to fight - even when the justification for the war have been proven to be wrong. Soldiers are trained to follow orders.

However, we must look beyond the sacrifices made by our military men and women and their families when a war is being fought on false pretenses, erroneous intelligence, and misguided goals to bring democracy to the middle east. That's why Americans have the freedom of speech - to speak out against wrong decisions made by our government.

Bush and his cohorts do not have any goals except "stay the course." That is not a goal. That they continue to repeat "we are making progress," while there's more evidence every day that Iraq is now in a civil war. The US military was never established to interfere in civil wars that have gone on for centuries.

The US population is only five (5) percent of the world's population; there is no way for us to dictate how all otther countries live on this planet no matter how grandiose our president thinks we are.

All the links you provided doesn't amount to a hill of beans. They're all irrelevant.

Once you decide to join the real world, you might learn something important; wars do not solve problems; it only kills people.

Our war with Japan was for self-defense; the only time war is justified.

We must never again preemptively strike another sovereign country when they do not have the wherewithal to strike against us, and there is no proof they have the means or intent. Saddam and Iraq was the least of our problems; he was contained in his own country, and the UN Inspectors were on the ground looking for WMDs. Nothing more was needed.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 08:39 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
ican, You keep bringing up moot points for why Bush got us engaged in Iraq. All witnesses who knows anything about WMDs and Saddam's connection to Al Qaeda have been refuted by the experts. There are no WMDs and no evidence that Saddam had direct connections to Al Qaeda or Osama.
Saddam did not have any WMDs after 1991. Saddam had no significant connections with al-Qaeda up to and including 9/11. It wasn't until December 2001, that al-Qaeda established its sanctuary in Iraq. I have repeatedly agreed with all three of these allegations. Why do you bring them up again?

That the soldiers you know are gung-ho for this war are considered patriots for fighting a war their commander in chief commanded them to fight - even when the justification for the war have been proven to be wrong. Soldiers are trained to follow orders.
If you think that, then why did you recommend I become a soldier and fight in Iraq before deciding whether the war in Iraq was/is necessary???

The WMD justification for the war has been proven wrong.

The al-Qaeda connection justification --prior to 9/11 -- for the war has been proven wrong.

However, these two justifications have been proven right:
(1) Members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

(2) Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations, including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of United States citizens.


However, we must look beyond the sacrifices made by our military men and women and their families when a war is being fought on false pretenses, erroneous intelligence, and misguided goals to bring democracy to the middle east.
...
Two of the pretenses were false; two were true!

Bush and his cohorts do not have any goals except "stay the course." That is not a goal. That they continue to repeat "we are making progress," there's more evidence every day that Iraq is now in a civil war.
Iraq is not in a civil war! Iraq is in a war against malignancy! America's and Iraq's goals in fighting malignancy -- the first five of which have been achieved -- are:
(1) Select an initial Iraq government to hold a first election;
(2) Establish and begin training an Iraq self-defense military;
(3) Hold a democratic election of an interim government whose primary function is to write a proposed constitution for a new Iraq democratic government;
(4) Submit that proposed constitution to Iraq voters for approval or disapproval;
(5) After approval by Iraq voters of an Iraq democratic government constitution, hold under that constitution a first election of the members of that government;
(6) After that election, organize the newly elected Iraq government;
(7) Train, as specified by the new Iraq government, an Iraq military to secure that Iraq government;
(8) After the Iraq government has been secured, remove the USA military from Iraq in a phased withdrawal.


...
All the links you provided doesn't amount to a hill of beans. They're all irrelevant.
I think all the links I provided are relevant. I have repeatedly posted excerpts to demonstrate why I think so.[/color]

Once you decide to the real world, you migh tlearn something important; wars do not solve problems; it only kills people.
Wars solve self-defense problems.

Our war with Japan was for self-defense; the only time war is justified.
Our war with Germany was for self-defense too. Germany as well as Japan declared war on America after Japan attacked us. Our war with malignancy (e.g., al-Qaeda) is for self-defense too. Malignancy obtained sanctuary in Afghanistan and also declared war on America. Malignancy obtained sanctuary in Iraq and also declared war on America. A malignancy of 20 murdered 3,000 Americans. A malignancy of 300 could murder 45,000. A malignancy of 3,000 could murder 450,000. A malignancy of 10,000 could murder 1,500,000.

A minimum of 10,000 malignancy were trained in Afghanistan and subsequently spread to other countries. More were being trained in Iraq after they established their sanctuary there in December 2001.


We must never again preemptively strike another sovereign country when they do not have the wherewithal to strike against us, and there is no proof they have the means or intent. Saddam and Iraq was the least of our problems; he was contained in his own country, and the UN Inspectors were on the ground looking for WMDs. Nothing more was needed.
Al-Qaeda, having been allowed santuary in Afghanistan and in Iraq, were a big problem and promised to become the most of our problems unless we first solve the big problem they presented us.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 09:08 pm
I wrote:
That the soldiers you know are gung-ho for this war are considered patriots for fighting a war their commander in chief commanded them to fight - even when the justification for the war have been proven to be wrong. Soldiers are trained to follow orders.


ican wrote:
If you think that, then why did you recommend I become a soldier and fight in Iraq before deciding whether the war in Iraq was/is necessary???


The reason is very simple; you agree with the politics of this war. Put your life where your mouth is.

I also wouldn't want my sons to be in Iraq or Afghanistan fighting these wars for a purpose long lost. And I am damn sure I don't want them sacrificing their life for an unknown goal. And don't give us that BS they're doing it for our "security."
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 10:02 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:

...
And don't give us that BS they're doing it for our "security."

They are doing it for our security ... and that's no BS.

We are fighting a war.

These are the reasons why:

(1) We Americans probably face a sizeable risk of being murdered by Terrorist Malignancy, if we decide to limit the defense of ourselves against Terrorist Malignancy to only here in America;

(2) The state of Afghanistan harbored (i.e., allowed sanctuary to) al-Qaeda Terrorist Malignancy from May 1996 to October 2001, when the USA invaded Afghanistan seeking to end their sanctuary in Afghanistan;

(3) The state of Iraq harbored (i.e., allowed sanctuary to) al-Qaeda Terrorist Malignancy from December 2001 to March 2003, when the USA invaded Iraq to end their sanctuary in Iraq;

(4) Tuesday night, September 11, 2001, the President broadcast to the nation:
www.9-11commission.gov/report/index.htm
Quote:
We will make no distinction between the terrorists who committed these acts and those who harbor them.


(5) Friday, September 14, 2001 Congress passed:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/military/terroristattack/joint-resolution_9-14.html
Quote:
The President is authorized to use all necessary and appropriate force against those nations, organizations, or persons he determines planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored such organizations or persons, in order to prevent any future acts of international terrorism against the United States by such nations, organizations or persons.


(6) Thursday, September 20, 2001, President Bush addressed the nation before a joint session of Congress:
www.9-11commission.gov/report/index.htm
Quote:
Tonight we are a country awakened to danger. Our enemy is a radical network of terrorists, and every government that supports them.


(7) Wednesday, October 16, 2002, Congress passed a joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq and gave two subsequently verified, primary and sufficient reasons for doing so:
www.c-span.org/resources/pdf/hjres114.pdf
Quote:
Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations, including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of United States citizens;


But, you protest Bush and Congress also said Iraq possessed WMD when it did not. But, I protest that 20 terrorists (less one intended terrorist, Moussaoui), first trained in Afghanistan, armed with box cutters and no WMD, hijacked four airliners, and flew them into American buildings or into the ground killing almost 3,000 American civilians.


How should we prevent 9/11s happening again in future: Domestically surveilling suspected terrorists, removing terrorist training sanctuaries, removing governments that allow terrorists sanctuaries, exterminating terrorists, and/or ignoring terrorists?


Here is some evidence (i.e., rational thinking and logic) that the terrorists true intentions are to get Americans to leave Iraq, and follow up our departure with more than the equivalent of fifteen 9/11s?

1. Osama Bin Laden "Declaration of War Against the Americans Occupying the Land of the Two Holy Places"-1996.
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/terrorism/international/fatwa_1996.html
Quote:
Those youths know that their rewards in fighting you, the USA, is double than their rewards in fighting some one else not from the people of the book. They have no intention except to enter paradise by killing you. An infidel, and enemy of God like you, cannot be in the same hell with his righteous executioner.

Quote:
I say to you ... These youths [love] death as you love life.
...
Those youths know that their rewards in fighting you, the USA, is double than their rewards in fighting some one else not from the people of the book. They have no intention except to enter paradise by killing you. An infidel, and enemy of God like you, cannot be in the same hell with his righteous executioner.

Quote:
Few days ago the news agencies had reported that the Defence Secretary of the Crusading Americans had said that "the explosion at Riyadh and Al-Khobar had taught him one lesson: that is not to withdraw when attacked by coward terrorists".

We say to the Defence Secretary that his talk can induce a grieving mother to laughter! and shows the fears that had enshrined you all. Where was this false courage of yours when the explosion in Beirut took place on 1983 AD (1403 A.H). You were turned into scattered pits and pieces at that time; 241 mainly marines solders were killed. And where was this courage of yours when two explosions made you to leave Aden in lees than twenty four hours!

But your most disgraceful case was in Somalia; where- after vigorous propaganda about the power of the USA and its post cold war leadership of the new world order- you moved tens of thousands of international force, including twenty eight thousands American solders into Somalia. However, when tens of your solders were killed in minor battles and one American Pilot was dragged in the streets of Mogadishu you left the area carrying disappointment, humiliation, defeat and your dead with you. Clinton appeared in front of the whole world threatening and promising revenge , but these threats were merely a preparation for withdrawal. You have been disgraced by Allah and you withdrew; the extent of your impotence and weaknesses became very clear. It was a pleasure for the "heart" of every Muslim and a remedy to the "chests" of believing nations to see you defeated in the three Islamic cities of Beirut , Aden and Mogadishu.



2. Osama Bin Laden: Text of Fatwah Urging Jihad Against Americans-1998
http://www.ict.org.il/articles/fatwah.htm
Quote:
On that basis, and in compliance with Allah's order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims:
The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies -- civilians and military -- is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, "and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together," and "fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah."



3. Al-Qaida Statement Warning Muslims Against Associating With The Crusaders And Idols; Translation By JUS; Jun 09, 2004 from the Al-Qaida Organization of the Arab Gulf; 19 Rabbi Al-Akhir 1425
http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg00035.html
Quote:
No Muslim should risk his life as he may inadvertently be killed if he associates with the Crusaders, whom we have no choice but to kill.

Everything related to them such as complexes, bases, means of transportation, especially Western and American Airlines, will be our main and direct targets in our forthcoming operations on our path of Jihad that we, with Allah's Power, will not turn away from.


Book: Al-Zarqawi: al Qaeda's Second Generation by Jordanian journalist, Fouad Hussein.
Quote:
Al Qaeda's seven phase plan for world conquest.

Phase 1, the "wakeup call." Spectacular terrorist attacks on the West
(like September 11, 2001) get the infidels (non-Moslems) to make war on
Islamic nations. This arouses Moslems, and causes them to flock to al
Qaedas banner. This phase is considered complete.

Phase 2, the "eye opening." This is the phase we are in, where al Qaeda
does battle with the infidels, and shows over a billion Moslems how
it's done. This phase is supposed to be completed by next year.

Phase 3, "the rising." Millions of aroused (in a terrorist sense)
Moslems go to war against Islam's enemies for the rest of the decade.
Especially heavy attacks are made against Israel. It is believed that
major damage in Israel will force the world to acknowledge al Qaeda as a major power, and negotiate with it.

Phase 4, "the downfall." By 2013, al Qaeda will control the Persian
Gulf, and all its oil, as well as most of the Middle East. This will
enable al Qaeda to cripple the American economy, and American military
power.

Phase 5, "the Caliphate." By 2016, the Caliphate (one government for
all Moslem nations) will be established. At this point, nearly all
Western cultural influences will be eliminated from Islamic nations. The
Caliphate will organize a mighty army for the next phase.

Phase 6, "world conquest." By 2022, the rest of the world will be
conquered by the righteous and unstoppable armies of Islam. This is the
phase that Osama bin Laden has been talking about for years.

Phase 7, "final victory." All the world's inhabitants will be forced to
either convert to Islam, or submit (as second class citizens) to
Islamic rule. This will be completed by 2025 or thereabouts.

Letter from al-Zawahiri to al-Zarqawi
www.dni.gov/release_letter_101105.html
Quote:
A summary of Letter from al-Zawahiri to al-Zarqawi July 9, 2005.

*The war in Iraq is central to al Qa'ida's global jihad.
*The war will not end with an American departure.
*Their strategic vision is one of inevitable conflict with a call by al-Zawahiri for political action equal to military action.
*Popular support must be maintained at least until jihadist rule has been established.
*More than half the struggle is taking place "in the battlefield of the media."

Letter in English at:
www.dni.gov/letter_in_english.pdf


Booklet by the Pakistani jihadist group Lashkar-e-Taiba (Army of the Pure)
Quote:
... the U.S., Israel and India as existential enemies of Islam and lists eight reasons for global jihad. These include the restoration of Islamic sovereignty to all lands where Muslims were once ascendant, including Spain, "Bulgaria, Hungary, Cyprus, Sicily, Ethiopia, Russian Turkistan and Chinese Turkistan. . . Even parts of France reaching 90 kilometers outside Paris."


cicerone imposter wrote:
: Any fruitcake like Osama can make threats, ... the threat is mostly bluster without any way to carry it out.
...

4. 9-11 Commission Report, 9/20/2004
www.9-11commission.gov/report/index.htm
Quote:
May 19, 1996: Bin Laden leaves Sudan –after escaping at least one assassination attempt -- significantly weakened despite his ambitious organization skills, and returns to Afghanistan where he establishes al Qaeda training bases.61
...
U.S. intelligence estimates put the total number of fighters who underwent instruction in Bin Ladin-supported camps in Afghanistan from 1996 through 9/11 at 10,000 to 20,000.78


13. Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
TERRORIST INCIDENTS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1996

Note: All the following listed terrorist incidents exclude all terrorist incidents in Afghanistan, Iraq, Palestine, and Israel.
Quote:
1996
June 25: Khobar Towers bombing, killing 19 and wounding 372 Americans.

1997
----

1998
August 7: U.S. embassy bombings in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania and Nairobi, Kenya, killing 225 people and injuring more than 4,000.

1999
----

2000
October 12: USS Cole bombing kills 17 US sailors.

2001
September 11: The attacks on September 11 kill almost 3,000 in a series of hijacked airliner crashes into two U.S. landmarks: the World Trade Center in New York City, New York, and The Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia. A fourth plane crashes in Somerset County, Pennsylvania.

October 12: Bali car bombing of holidaymakers kills 202 people, mostly Western tourists and local Balinese hospitality staff.

October 17: Zamboanga bombings in the Philippines kill six and wounds about 150.

October 18: A bus bomb in Manila kills three people and wounds 22.

October 19: A car bomb explodes outside a McDonald's Corp. restaurant in Moscow, killing one person and wounding five.


Note: October 20, 2001: USA invades Afghanistan

Quote:
October 23: Moscow theater hostage crisis begins; 120 hostages and 40 terrorists killed in rescue three days later.


Note: December 20, 2001: Osama helps establish al Qaeda training bases in Iraq.

Quote:
2003
March 4: Bomb attack in an airport in Davao kills 21.


Note: March 20, 2003: US invades Iraq at the time al Qaeda controls about a dozen villages and a range of peaks in northeastern Iraq on the Iranian border.

Quote:
2003
May 12: Bombings of United States expatriate housing compounds in Saudi Arabia kill 26 and injure 160 in the Riyadh Compound Bombings. Al-Qaeda blamed.

May 12: A truck bomb attack on a government building in the Chechen town of Znamenskoye kills 59.

May 14: As many as 16 die in a suicide bombing at a religious festival in southeastern Chechnya.

May 16: Casablanca Attacks by 12 bombers on five "Western and Jewish" targets in Casablanca, Morocco leaves 41 dead and over 100 injured. Attack attributed to a Moroccan al-Qaeda-linked group.

July 5: 15 people die and 40 are injured in bomb attacks at a rock festival in Moscow.

August 1: An explosion at the Russian hospital in Mozdok in North Ossetia kills at least 50 people and injures 76.

August 25: At least 48 people were killed and 150 injured in two blasts in south Mumbai - one near the Gateway of India at the other at the Zaveri Bazaar.

September 3: A bomb blast on a passenger train near Kislovodsk in southern Russia kills seven people and injures 90.

November 15 and November 20: Truck bombs go off at two synagogues, the British Consulate, and the HSBC Bank in Istanbul, Turkey, killing 57 and wounding 700.

December 5: Suicide bombers kill at least 46 people in an attack on a train in southern Russia

December 9: A blast in the center of Moscow kills six people and wounds at least 11.

2004
February 6: Bomb on Moscow Metro kills 41.

February 27: Superferry 14 is bombed in the Philippines by Abu Sayyaf, killing 116.

March 2: Attack on procession of Shia Muslims in Pakistan kills 43 and wounds 160.

March 11: Coordinated bombing of commuter trains in Madrid, Spain, kills 191 people and injures more than 1,500.

April 21: Basra bombs in Iraq kill 74 and injure hundreds.

April 21: Bombing of a security building in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia kills 5.

May 29: Al-Khobar massacres, in which Islamic militants kill 22 people at an oil compound in Saudi Arabia.

August 24: Bombing of Russian airplane kills 90.

August 31: A blast near a subway station entrance in northern Moscow, caused by a suicide bomber, kills 10 people and injures 33.

September 1 – 3: Beslan school hostage crisis in North Ossetia, Russia, results in 344 dead.

September 9: Jakarta embassy bombing, in which the Australian embassy in Jakarta, Indonesia was bombed, kills eight people.

October 7: Sinai bombings: Three car bombs explode in the Sinai Peninsula, killing at least 34 and wounding 171, many of them Israeli and other foreign tourists.

December 6: Suspected al Qaeda-linked group attacks U.S. consulate in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, killing 5 local employees.

December 12: A bombing at the Christmas market in General Santos, Philippines, kills 15.

2005
February 14: A car bomb kills former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafiq Hariri and 20 others in Beirut.

March 9: An attack of an Istanbul restaurant killed one, and injured five.

March 19: Car bomb attack on theatre in Doha, Qatar, kills one Briton and wounds 12 others.

April 7: A suicide bomber blows himself up in Cairo's Khan al Khalili market, killing three foreign tourists and wounding 17 others.

May 7: Multiple bomb explosions across Myanmar's capital Rangoon kill 19 and injure 160.

June 12: Bombs explode in the Iranian cities of Ahvaz and Tehran, leaving 10 dead and 80 wounded days before the Iranian presidential election.

July 7: London bombings - Attacks on one double-decker bus and three London Underground trains, killing 56 people and injuring over 700, occur on the first day of the 31st G8 Conference. The attacks are believed by many to be the first suicide bombings in Western Europe.

July 23: Sharm el-Sheikh bombings: Car bombs explode at tourist sites in Sharm el-Sheikh, Egypt, killing at least 88 and wounding more than 100.
August 17: Around 100 home-made bombs exploded in 58 different locations in Bangladesh, Killing two and wounding 100.

October 1: A series of explosions occurs in resort areas of Jimabaran Beach and Kuta in Bali, Indonesia.

October 13: A large group of Chechen rebels launched coordinated attacks on Russian federal buildings, local police stations, and the airport in Nalchik, Kabardino-Balkaria. At least 137 people, including 92 rebels, were killed.

October 15: Two bombs exploded at a shopping mall in Ahvaz, Khuzestan in Iran. Six people died and over 100 were injured.

October 29: Multiple bomb blasts hit markets in New Delhi, India, leaving at least 61 dead and more than 200 injured.

November 9: Three explosions at hotels in Amman, Jordan, leave at least 57 dead and 120 wounded.

December --

2006
January --

February --

March 2: Bombing in Karachi, Pakistan kills four, including a U.S. diplomat.

March 7: Bombings in the Hindu holy city of Varanasi, India, leave at least 15 people dead.


ican711nm wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
: Any fruitcake like Osama can make threats, ... the threat is mostly bluster without any way to carry it out.
...

"the threat is mostly bluster" Question Rolling Eyes

Let's examine that a little more carefully. A total of 20 suicidal terrorists, less one named Moussaoui, murdered almost 3,000 American civilians. Would it take 15 times as many terrorists -- 300 -- to murder 45,000 American civilians? Al-Qaeda trained more than enough in Afghanistan before 9/11: a minimum of 10,000 trained terrorists - 300 suicidal terrorists = 9,700 left over for more murdering still.

THE WAR ON MALIGNANCY
ican711nm wrote:
The war in Iraq is a war on a malignancy.

The malignancy forces in Iraq are mass murdering civilians in Iraq. That is Evil!

The anti-malignancy forces in Iraq are mass murdering malignancy forces in Iraq. That is Good!
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2006 06:57 am
ican711nm wrote:
cicerone imposter wrote:
ican, For every pro-Iraq war article you can post, there are con-Iraq war articles to be found in search land. You have proved nothing. Those are biased opinions by people that have sacrificed nothing but their mouths. Have them send their loves ones to Iraq and Afghanistan; then they might have some credibility.


cice, For every con-Iraq war article you can post, there are pro-Iraq war articles to be found in search land. You have proved nothing. Those con-Iraq war articles are biased opinions by people that know nothing of the true opinions of a great majority of those in our military in Afghanistan and Iraq who are pro-Iraq war. Send those con-Iraq article writers to Iraq and Afghanistan where they can learn from that great majority of our pro-Iraq military there, what is actually being accomplished there, despite all our flaws and mistakes, and most especially despite all those biased opinion con-Iraq articles published in America.


This is just sick, Ican. How do you think journalist have been able to write the news if some of them are not actually in Iraq and Afghanistan themselves? Journalist have been putting it on the line and some have been killed or kidnapped in the attempt to do it.

Quote:
Casualties of war
Author: Rudy Sabga
Date: February, 2006

Journalists used to be seen as neutral, but now they're ransom bait, bargaining chips or the outright enemy. Last year was the worst on record for correspondents getting killed on the job -- and in 2006, the trend continues

On February 23, the bodies of correspondent Atwar Bahjat, cameraman Khaled Mahmoud al-Falahi and engineer Adnan Khairallah were found near Samarra, Iraq. Bahjat was a correspondent for Al-Arabiya, while al-Falahi and Khairallah were employees of Wasan Productions on assignment for Al-Arabiya. The Wasan crew was covering the bombing of a Shiite shrine near Samarra, Iraq, when armed men attacked them and demanded to know the whereabouts of Bahjat. Their last broadcast was at 6 P.M. the day before their bodies were found.

On February 2, Wu Xianghu, deputy editor of Taizhou Wanbao, died of liver and kidney failure after months of hospitalization. He was attacked by traffic police in the eastern coastal city of Taizhou, Zhejiang province, China, in October 2005, after writing an embarrassing exposé of high fee collections for electric bicycle licenses.


Credit: William Kunz

On January 25, Baghdad TV correspondent Mahmoud Za'al was shot and killed in a U.S. air strike while covering an insurgent attack by Sunni rebels on two U.S.-held buildings in Ramadi, Iraq. He had worked for the station for one year.

On January 24, the day before, Subramaniyam Sugitharajah, a part-time reporter for the Sudar Oli, was killed by an unidentified gunman on his way to work. Photographs taken by Sugitharajah had shown that five students in Tamil, Sri Lanka, had been killed by gunshot wounds January 2, despite claims by the military that the men were blown up by their own grenade in an attempted attack on the army.


More at the link

Got the link from Crooks and Liars in the Olbermann slams Ingraham section at the bottom where Olbermann says this:

Quote:
Keith said: "A note about Laura Ingram's comments. I've known her a long time. I'll in fact give you the caveat that I've know her socially. But that hotel balcony crack was unforgivable. In was unforgivable to the memory of David Bloom, it was unforgivable in considerable of Bob Woodruff and Doug Vought, unforgivable in light of what happened to Michael Kelly and what happened to Michael Weiskopft. It was unforgivable with Jill Carroll still a hostage in Iraq. And it was not only unforgivable of her; it was desperate and it was stupid."


http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/03/22.html#a7625
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2006 07:37 am
revel wrote:
Got the link from Crooks and Liars in the Olbermann slams Ingraham section at the bottom where Olbermann says this:

Quote:
Keith said: "A note about Laura Ingram's comments. I've known her a long time. I'll in fact give you the caveat that I've know her socially. But that hotel balcony crack was unforgivable. In was unforgivable to the memory of David Bloom, it was unforgivable in considerable of Bob Woodruff and Doug Vought, unforgivable in light of what happened to Michael Kelly and what happened to Michael Weiskopft. It was unforgivable with Jill Carroll still a hostage in Iraq. And it was not only unforgivable of her; it was desperate and it was stupid."


http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/03/22.html#a7625


Desperate and Stupid is a fair characterization of Olbermann, a wacko leftist, obsessed with Fox News and Bill O'Reilly -- which one presumes this is mainly because of his comparatively poor ratings. But the above rant highlights more media hypocrisy where they believe Bush and the war ought to be questioned and challenged, but find it unforgivable when someone questions them and the way they present the story.
0 Replies
 
Magginkat
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2006 09:33 am
Poor Tico..... now he's even defending the sexual predator Bill O'Reilly. These are indeed desperate times for Repugs! I think you have charged Olbermann with the actual actions of O'Reilly. If anyone is obsessed it's that creep and he has to be right up there with george when it comes to lying.

Cicerone, do you acutally read all the crap that ican posts or did you figure out that once you read a couple, you have read all he has to say?

A number of Repugs on A2K are suffering from a severe form of SIS..... self imposed stupidity. I'm not sure there is a cure. The title SIS does seem to fit though.... sissy, whiny babies from the Oval office down through the rank and file party membership.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2006 11:41 am
Maggs, I scroll past most of his stuff. That's what makes it so funny! The guy really thinks all his mumblings mean something. LOL
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2006 11:44 am
Russians Helped Iraq, Study Says
Papers Show Hussein Was Tipped Off About U.S. Strategy During Invasion

By Ann Scott Tyson and Josh White
Washington Post Staff Writers
Saturday, March 25, 2006; Page A01

Russian officials collected intelligence on U.S. troop movements and attack plans from inside the American military command leading the 2003 invasion of Iraq and passed that information to Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, according to a U.S. military study released yesterday.

The intelligence reports, which the study said were provided to Hussein through the Russian ambassador in Baghdad at the height of the U.S. assault, warned accurately that American formations intended to bypass Iraqi cities on their thrust toward Baghdad. The reports provided some specific numbers on U.S. troops, units and locations, according to Iraqi documents dated March and April 2003 and later captured by the United States.




News From Iraq
Russians Helped Iraq, Study Says
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Near Paul Revere Country, Anti-Bush Cries Get Louder
Navy Won't File Charges in Iraq Contractor Fracas



"The information that the Russians have collected from their sources inside the American Central Command in Doha is that the United States is convinced that occupying Iraqi cities are impossible, and that they have changed their tactic," said one captured Iraqi document titled "Letter from Russian Official to Presidential Secretary Concerning American Intentions in Iraq" and dated March 25, 2003.

A Russian official at the United Nations strongly rejected the allegations that Russian officials gave information to Baghdad. "This is absolutely nonsense," said Maria Zakharova, a spokeswoman for the Russian mission to the United Nations. She said the allegations were never presented to the Russian government before being issued to the news media.

Russia was among the nations opposed to the U.S. war with Iraq. Russian President Vladimir Putin warned on the eve of the U.S.-led invasion in March 2003 that an American attack would have grave consequences. He urged Washington to resolve its conflicts with Baghdad peacefully.

The study gives no indication who the alleged sources inside the U.S. Central Command might have been, or whether American officials believe the Kremlin authorized the transfer of information to Hussein's government.

The Central Command, which oversees military operations in the Middle East and is headquartered in Tampa, did not respond to requests for comment. A State Department spokeswoman declined to comment.

The U.S. military and defense officials who released the study said the revelations about Russia in the captured documents came as a surprise. They said they believe the captured Iraqi documents are authentic.

"Certainly, sure, I was surprised," said Army Brig. Gen. Anthony A. Cucolo III, director of the Joint Center for Operational Analysis and Lessons Learned under the Joint Forces Command in Norfolk. He said he thinks the alleged Russian intelligence-sharing was linked to Moscow's commercial interests in Iraq. "Essentially, it's driven by economic interests," he told reporters at the Pentagon. "I don't see it as an aberration. I see it as a follow-on to economic engagement." Retired Lt. Col. Kevin M. Woods, the project director, said he has "no reason to doubt the Iraqi documents."

The 210-page study, called the Iraqi Perspectives Project, draws on declassified information from an internal U.S. military report that was based on the examination of more than half a million files of Iraqi documents and dozens of interviews with former senior Iraqi military and political leaders. Some of that information remains classified.

The study offers little analysis of the consequences for the U.S. military of the alleged Russian-supplied intelligence, which was received by what the study depicts as a hopelessly confused Iraqi chain of command.

One document, for example, was sent to Hussein as rumors swirled in Baghdad that the main American military push would come not from the south -- as it in fact did -- but through Jordan into western Iraq, a misperception that U.S. Special Forces units operating throughout the western desert were seeking to create.


Bush still hasn't figured out who our enemies are. Bush looked Putin in the eyes and said "this guy can be trusted."
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2006 01:28 pm
Our administration doesn't call it a civil war.a show of unity will prevent a full-scale civil war.
0 Replies
 
 

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