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THE US, THE UN AND IRAQ, TENTH THREAD.

 
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 04:09 pm
McTag wrote:

...
Apparently "we" only attack governments that allow sanctuary to those who wish us harm, if they happen to be sitting on a large oilfield.

I didn't know that Afghanistan sits on a large oilfield! Shocked

Please provide us a link which will verify that.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 04:12 pm
Don't tell us, you never heard of the Agnot oil field Shocked
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 04:25 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Don't tell us, you never heard of the Agnot oil field Shocked

Embarrassed Where is it? What was its annual production rate prior to the USA invasion of Afghanistan?
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 04:28 pm
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2004-41,GGLD:en&q=agnot+oil+field
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 04:41 pm

Your link delivered the following to me:
Quote:
Google Is Your Friend
All Smart People Use Google
It Appears That You Are Not One Of Them


Someone thinks you are an idiot because you were too stupid to check Google before asking a question. They gave you a link to this site as a joke. The fact that you followed it pretty much proves the point.

Hope that helps.

Have a nice day.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Please direct abuse reports or server problems to [email protected].

The Logical Language Group, which is the primary website hosted by this machine, does not endorse this site in any way.

I've added an information page.
0 Replies
 
Anon-Voter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 06:05 pm
That is so good! I had to bookmark it!

Anon
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Jan, 2006 07:26 pm
The Coalition invaded Afghanistan 1 month after 9/11. The Coalition invaded Iraq 18 months after 9/11. If oil were the primary issue, one would think Saudi Arabia then Iraq would have been invaded initially and Afghanistan invaded last.

Google and Yahoo searches were relatively unproductive regarding Afghanistan's oil production. So I tried Britannica Online www.britannica.com in order to learn more about oil production in Afghanistan.

emphasis added by me
Quote:
Afghanistan
Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Page 19 of 69

The economy > Resources and power

Extensive surveys have revealed the existence of a number of minerals of economic importance. The most significant discovery has been natural gas deposits, with large reserves near Sheberghan near the Turkmenistan border, about 75 miles (120 km) west of Mazar-e Sharif. The Khvajeh Gugerdak and Yatim Taq fields were major producers, with storage and refining facilities. Until the 1990s, pipelines delivered natural gas to Uzbekistan and Tajikistan and to a thermal power plant and chemical fertilizer plant in Mazar-e Sharif.

Petroleum resources have proved to be insignificant. Many coal deposits have been found in the northern slopes of the Hindu Kush. Major coal fields are at Ma'dan-e Karkar and Eshposhteh, between Kabul and Mazar-e Sharif, and Qal'eh-ye Sarkari, southwest of Mazar-e Sharif. In general, however, Afghanistan's energy resources, including its large reserves of natural gas, remain untapped, and fuel shortages are chronic.

High-grade iron ore has been discovered at Hajji Gak, northwest of Kabul. Copper has been mined at 'Aynak, near Kabul, and uranium in the mountains near Khvajah Rawash, east of Kabul. There are deposits of copper, lead, and zinc near Kondoz; beryllium in Khas Konar; chrome ore in the Lowgar River valley near Herat; and the semiprecious stone lapis lazuli in Badakhshan. Afghanistan also has deposits of rock salt, beryl, barite, fluorspar, bauxite, lithium, tantalum, gold, silver, asbestos, mica, and sulfur. Taxation of mined and traded lapis lazuli and emeralds helped finance anti-Taliban forces during the civil war.

The development of Central Asian natural gas and oil resources has sparked international interest in Afghanistan as a route for pipelines to markets in South Asia and beyond. If built, a pipeline could carry gas and, later, oil from Turkmenistan over some 1,100 miles (1,750 km), mostly through Afghanistan, to Multan in Pakistan for transshipment. Such a pipeline could become a major source of income for Afghanistan and also offer a source of training and employment to Afghans.

Afghanistan is potentially rich in hydroelectric resources. However, the seasonal flow of the country's many streams and waterfalls—torrential in spring, when the snow melts in the mountains, but negligible in summer—necessitates the costly construction of dams and reservoirs in remote areas. The country's negligible demand for electricity renders such projects unprofitable except near large cities or industrial centres. The potential of hydroelectricity has been tapped substantially only in the Kabul-Jalalabad region.

Quote:
Syria
Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Page 28 of 76

The economy > Resources > Mineral resources

Petroleum in commercial quantities was first discovered in the northeast in 1956. The most important oil fields are those of Suwaydiyah, Qaratshui, Rumayian, and Tayyem, near Dayr az–Zawr. The fields are a natural extension of the Iraqi fields of Mosul and Kirkuk. Petroleum became Syria's leading natural resource and chief export after 1974. Natural gas was discovered at the field of Jbessa in 1940.

Quote:
Iran
Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Page 25 of 102

The economy > Resources and power > Mining

Miners worked primarily by hand until the early 1960s, and mine owners moved the ore to refining centres by truck, rail, donkey, or camel. As public and private concerns opened new mines and quarries, they introduced mechanized methods of production. The mineral industries encompass both refining and manufacturing.

The extraction and processing of petroleum is unquestionably Iran's single most important economic activity and the most valuable in terms of revenue, although natural gas production is increasingly important. The government-operated National Iranian Oil Company (NIOC) produces petroleum for export and domestic consumption. Petroleum is moved by pipeline to the terminal of Khark (Kharq) Island in the Persian Gulf and from there is shipped by tanker throughout the world. Iran's main refining facility at Abadan was destroyed during the war with Iraq, but the government has since rebuilt the facility, and production has returned to near prewar levels. The NIOC also operates refineries at Esfahan, Shiraz, Lavan Island, Tehran, and Tabriz; several were damaged by Iraqi forces but have since returned to production. These sites produce a variety of refined products, including aircraft fuel at the Abadan facility and fuels for domestic heating and the transportation industry.

Iran's vast natural gas reserves constitute more than one-tenth of the world's total. In addition to the country's working gas fields in the Elburz Mountains and in Khorasan, fields have been discovered and exploitation begun in the Persian Gulf near 'Asaluyeh, offshore in the Caspian region, and, most notably, offshore and onshore in areas of southern Iran—the South Pars field in the latter region is one of the richest in the world. The country's gathering and distribution spur lines run to Tehran, Kashan, Esfahan, Shiraz, Mashhad, Ahvaz, and the industrial city of Alborz, near Qazvin. The two state-owned Iranian Gas Trunklines are the largest gas pipelines in the Middle East, and Iran is under contract to supply natural gas to Russia, eastern Europe, Pakistan, Turkey, and India through pipelines, under construction in neighbouring countries, that are intended to connect Iran's trunk lines with those of its customers.


Quote:
Pakistan
Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Page 20 of 47

The economy > Mineral resources

...

Pakistan also has small quantities of oil and some very large natural gas fields. The first oil discovery was made in 1915. Pakistan intensified the search for oil and natural gas in the 1980s and was rewarded with the discovery of a number of new oil fields in the Potwar Plateau region and in Sindh. The oil fields near Badin, in Sindh, are particularly promising. Oil fulfills a substantial portion of Pakistan's energy requirements, and the search for new and richer fields has continued. The largest natural gas deposits are at Sui (on the border between Balochistan and the Punjab), discovered in 1953. A smaller field, at Mari, in the northeast of Sindh province, was found in 1957. A number of smaller natural gas fields were discovered in the 1980s. A network of gas pipelines links the fields with the main consumption areas: Karachi, Lahore, Multan, Faisalabad (Lyallpur), and Islamabad.

Quote:
Saudi Arabia
Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Page 12 of 37

The economy > Resources

The economy of Saudi Arabia is dominated by petroleum and its associated industries. In terms of oil reserves, Saudi Arabia ranks first, with almost one-fourth of the world's known reserves.
...

Quote:
Iraq
Encyclopædia Britannica Article

Page 32 of 98

Economy > Resources and power > Petroleum and natural gas

Petroleum is Iraq's most valuable mineral—the country has the world's second largest known reserves and, before the Iran-Iraq War, was the second largest oil-exporting state. Oil production contributes the largest single portion to GDP and constitutes almost all of Iraq's foreign exchange. Iraq is a founding member of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC), but disagreements over production quotas and world oil prices have often led Iraq into conflict with other members.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 03:11 am
ican711nm wrote:
McTag wrote:

...
Apparently "we" only attack governments that allow sanctuary to those who wish us harm, if they happen to be sitting on a large oilfield.

I didn't know that Afghanistan sits on a large oilfield! Shocked

Please provide us a link which will verify that.


Pipeline required.
Strategic importance.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 07:27 am
ican711nm wrote:
Google and Yahoo searches were relatively unproductive regarding Afghanistan's oil production.


When I used them, they offered a couple of articles and reports, either still in the original version online - like in "World Oil Magazine" - or via findarticles.

Besides that, any good library has more to offer than those britannica mentionings.
0 Replies
 
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 08:42 am
Excerpt from President Bush's speech last night:

Quote:
We remain on the offensive in Afghanistan, where a fine President and a National Assembly are fighting terror while building the institutions of a new democracy. We're on the offensive in Iraq, with a clear plan for victory. First, we're helping Iraqis build an inclusive government, so that old resentments will be eased and the insurgency will be marginalized.
Second, we're continuing reconstruction efforts, and helping the Iraqi government to fight corruption and build a modern economy, so all Iraqis can experience the benefits of freedom. And, third, we're striking terrorist targets while we train Iraqi forces that are increasingly capable of defeating the enemy. Iraqis are showing their courage every day, and we are proud to be their allies in the cause of freedom. (Applause.)
Our work in Iraq is difficult because our enemy is brutal. But that brutality has not stopped the dramatic progress of a new democracy. In less than three years, the nation has gone from dictatorship to liberation, to sovereignty, to a constitution, to national elections. At the same time, our coalition has been relentless in shutting off terrorist infiltration, clearing out insurgent strongholds, and turning over territory to Iraqi security forces. I am confident in our plan for victory; I am confident in the will of the Iraqi people; I am confident in the skill and spirit of our military. Fellow citizens, we are in this fight to win, and we are winning.
(Applause.)
The road of victory is the road that will take our troops home. As we make progress on the ground, and Iraqi forces increasingly take the lead, we should be able to further decrease our troop levels -- but those decisions will be made by our military commanders, not by politicians in Washington, D.C. (Applause.)
Our coalition has learned from our experience in Iraq. We've adjusted our military tactics and changed our approach to reconstruction. Along the way, we have benefitted from responsible criticism and counsel offered by members of Congress of both parties. In the coming year, I will continue to reach out and seek your good advice. Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. (Applause.) Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy. (Applause.)
With so much in the balance, those of us in public office have a duty to speak with candor. A sudden withdrawal of our forces from Iraq would abandon our Iraqi allies to death and prison, would put men like bin Laden and Zarqawi in charge of a strategic country, and show that a pledge from America means little. Members of Congress, however we feel about the decisions and debates of the past, our nation has only one option: We must keep our word, defeat our enemies, and stand behind the American military in this vital mission. (Applause.)
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 12:43 pm
McTag wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
McTag wrote:

...
Apparently "we" only attack governments that allow sanctuary to those who wish us harm, if they happen to be sitting on a large oilfield.

I didn't know that Afghanistan sits on a large oilfield! Shocked

Please provide us a link which will verify that.


Pipeline required.
Strategic importance.


Right! Pipelines are required.
Britannica Online wrote:
A pipeline could carry gas and, later, oil from Turkmenistan over some 1,100 miles (1,750 km), mostly through Afghanistan, to Multan in Pakistan for transshipment.


Right! Afghanistan possesses strategic importance (e.g., its government allowed sanctuary to al-Qaeda and al-Qaeda continues to try to regain that sanctuary).

But according to Britannica Online, Afghanistan does not sit on a large oilfield as you asserted, but rather in Afghanistan
Britannica Online wrote:
Petroleum resources have proved to be insignificant.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 12:50 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
Google and Yahoo searches were relatively unproductive regarding Afghanistan's oil production.


When I used them, they offered a couple of articles and reports, either still in the original version online - like in "World Oil Magazine" - or via findarticles.

Besides that, any good library has more to offer than those britannica mentionings.

If that is true, then you should be able to easily answer my two previous questions posted in response to your post.
ican711nm wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Don't tell us, you never heard of the Agnot oil field Shocked

Embarrassed Where is it? What was its annual production rate prior to the USA invasion of Afghanistan?
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 01:31 pm
I think we would have gone to Afghanistan regardless of any pipelines. Once the American public knew that Bin Laden was behind the attacks and he was in Afghanistan and the Taliban refused to give him up, the public would have had an outrage if we did not invade Afghanistan and rightfully so. I doubt there were any previous plans to invade Afghanistan unlike the invasion of Iraq.

Also, I don't think the oil was the only reason we invaded Iraq but I imagine it played a huge part. In order to have control of that region of the world, it helps to be in control of some of the oil and it is easier to have middle man out of the picture. It's all there in Project of the New American Century website for anyone who wants to take their blinders off to read and understand.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 01:51 pm
ican711nm wrote:

Your link delivered the following to me:
Quote:
Google Is Your Friend
All Smart People Use Google
It Appears That You Are Not One Of Them


Someone thinks you are an idiot because you were too stupid to check Google before asking a question. They gave you a link to this site as a joke. The fact that you followed it pretty much proves the point.

Hope that helps.

Have a nice day.
<snip>

I'm afraid I don't have a bigger fish with which to slap you upside the head.
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 04:01 pm
Why waste a perfectly good fish?
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 06:42 pm
revel wrote:

...
It's all there in Project of the New American Century website for anyone who wants to take their blinders off to read and understand.

Do you think the New American Century website is a source of more reliable information about Bush's true motives for invading Iraq than is Bush himself?

If you do, why do you think that?
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 06:54 pm
DrewDad wrote:

...
I'm afraid I don't have a bigger fish with which to slap you upside the head.

A valid answer to my two questions would have sufficed!
0 Replies
 
Anon-Voter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 07:27 pm
Something definitely smells like fish here ... dead fish!

Anon
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 08:23 pm
Anon-Voter wrote:
Something definitely smells like fish here ... dead fish! Anon

Get off your beach, and allow several days for the smell there to dissipate.
0 Replies
 
Anon-Voter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Feb, 2006 08:42 pm
ican711nm wrote:
Anon-Voter wrote:
Something definitely smells like fish here ... dead fish! Anon

Get off your beach, and allow several days for the smell there to dissipate.


I only notice it as I scroll by your posts!!

Anon
0 Replies
 
 

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