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World stunned as US struggles with Katrina

 
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 10:01 am
Tico
Let me rephrase my question so the slippery lawyer can't evade the question.

If the governor of New Orleans was a republican, would you support her as a member of your party?

BBB
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 10:10 am
Of course he wouldn't.

If there's one thing supporters of President Bush have shown in the past five years, it's that they'll drop a Republican as easily as a Democrat if exculpating Bush or warding off criticism of him or his administration requires it.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 10:11 am
Re: Tico
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:
Let me rephrase my question so the slippery lawyer can't evade the question.

If the governor of New Orleans was a republican, would you support her as a member of your party?

BBB


If you were trying to phrase that question so a slippery lawyer couldn't evade it, you did a poor job.

If the governor of New Orleans was a republican, what would the Mayor of Louisiana be?

Very Happy

I'll answer anyway, it doesn't matter to me what the governor's political affiliation is.
0 Replies
 
Acquiunk
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 10:20 am
Ticomaya wrote:
Again, nimh, primary responsibility for disaster relief is on the state and local governments of this country. The federal government supports this effort in times of national emergencies .


OK agreed, and this is how FEMA (the Feds) provided support.

Ms. Bottcher ( press secretary for Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco) was one of several officials yesterday who said she believed FEMA had interfered with the delivery of aid, including offers from the mayor of Chicago, Richard M. Daley, and the governor of New Mexico Bill Richardson……

Far from deferring to state or local officials, FEMA asserted its authority and made things worse, Mr. Broussard (president of Jefferson Parish, south of New Orleans.)complained on "Meet the Press."

When Wal-Mart sent three trailer trucks loaded with water, FEMA officials turned them away, he said.

Agency workers prevented the Coast Guard from delivering 1,000 gallons of diesel fuel, and

on Saturday they cut the parish's emergency communications line, leading the sheriff to restore it and post armed guards to protect it from FEMA, Mr. Broussard said……


New York Times Link
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 10:28 am
Re: Tico
Ticomaya wrote:
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:
Let me rephrase my question so the slippery lawyer can't evade the question. If the governor of New Orleans was a republican, would you support her as a member of your party?
BBB


If you were trying to phrase that question so a slippery lawyer couldn't evade it, you did a poor job. If the governor of New Orleans was a republican, what would the Mayor of Louisiana be? Very Happy

I'll answer anyway, it doesn't matter to me what the governor's political affiliation is.


Tico, I'm busted big time. Laughing Embarrassed Laughing

I made a typo mistake for the first time in my life. Drat!

BBB
0 Replies
 
squinney
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 12:44 pm
No big deal, BBB. Chertoff called Louisiana a city the other day.
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squinney
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 12:51 pm
Here's an article from Monday, August 29th, the day Katrina made landfall along the Gulf Coast:

Quote:
WASHINGTON - Baby formula from the Agriculture Department, communications equipment and medical teams from the Defense Department and generators, water and ice from the Federal Emergency Management Agency are among the assistance ready for the victims of Hurricane Katrina.

As the Category 4 the storm surged ashore just east of New Orleans on Monday, FEMA had medical teams, rescue squads and groups prepared to supply food and water poised in a semicircle around the city, said agency Director Michael Brown.

Brown, in a telephone interview with The Associated Press, said the evacuation of the city and the general emergency response were working as planned in an exercise a year ago. "I was impressed with the evacuation, once it was ordered it was very smooth," he said.


Yahoo News / AP

Two things.

1. If all this aid was situated in a semicircle around New Orleans, why the days of delay in getting it to people in the Superdome? They knew they were ther.

2. What happened to the praise by Brown of the handling of the New Orleans evacuation and preparedness?
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 04:41 pm
Many of you have said that the federal govt should have spent more money to fix the levees before the hurricane.
I found this article,and it is rather interesting.
Its a long article,so I will post a link and a few relevant paragraphs...

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?Page=\Nation\archive\200509\NAT20050907a.html

"(CNSNews.com) - The Bush administration is being widely criticized for the emergency response to Hurricane Katrina and the allegedly inadequate protection for "the big one" that residents had long feared would hit New Orleans. But research into more than ten years of reporting on hurricane and flood damage mitigation efforts in and around New Orleans indicates that local and state officials did not use federal money that was available for levee improvements or coastal reinforcement and often did not secure local matching funds that would have generated even more federal funding."


"By 1998, Louisiana's state government had a $2 billion construction budget, but less than one tenth of one percent of that -- $1.98 million -- was dedicated to levee improvements in the New Orleans area. State appropriators were able to find $22 million that year to renovate a new home for the Louisiana Supreme Court and $35 million for one phase of an expansion to the New Orleans convention center."

"The following year, the state legislature did appropriate $49.5 million for levee improvements, but the proposed spending had to be allocated by the State Bond Commission before the projects could receive financing. The commission placed the levee improvements in the "Priority 5" category, among the projects least likely to receive full or immediate funding.

The Orleans Levee Board was also forced to defer $3.7 million in capital improvement projects in its 2001 budget after residents of the area rejected a proposed tax increase to fund its expanding operations. Long term deferments to nearly 60 projects, based on the revenue shortfall, totaled $47 million worth of work, including projects to shore up the floodwalls.

No new state money had been allocated to the area's hurricane protection projects as of October of 2002, leaving the available 65 percent federal matching funds for such construction untouched."
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 04:53 pm
CNS news is a notorious conservative rag . . . and if you go to their website, they don't even have an "about us" link. Given their track record, and a close look at the plethora of stories blaming everyone but the Feds, and exculpating the Shrub all over their main page, i don't think i'll lend them much credence.

If you find that story at a reliable news site, i might be inclined to believe it.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 05:05 pm
Further investigation has turned up that CNSnews is an arm of the Conservative Communications Center. Now i just wonder what message they would be trying to get across?
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 05:11 pm
So in other words,since you dont like the source that means the information is wrong?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 05:30 pm
No, it means that as the source has an obvious agenda, the information is suspect. Up above here, Squinney posted some information which came from Yahoo News/AP. That means they are relying upon the Associated Press for their information. The Associated Press has a deservedly good reputation, and no known political agenda. Neither of those statements can be made about your source.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 05:35 pm
So tell me this...
What do you consider to be reliable,"good",sources?
Is truthout.org a good source?
Is the NY Times?
Is Fox news or CNN?
What about Reuters,or UPI,or the major networks?
Are they all "good",reliable sources?]
What about "US News and World Report"?
Is it a good source?

Why dont you tell us all what the "good" sources are,that way we will know exactly what we can use for information.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 05:39 pm
I'm not rising to your bait, MM. You understand the distinction i made, and trying to bait me won't alter the fact that you presented "information" from a source with a drastic slant to the right.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 05:54 pm
In this article from Factcheck.org, the dollar figures given look suspiciously similar to the amounts given in the CNSnews story. It appears very much as though the dollar amounts to have been allocated by the State of Louisiana were matching funds, and one is left to wonder if they were not reduced because they learned that funds for the Corps of Engineers would not be forthcoming.

Furthermore, the article is vague about what projects are funded by the state's "construction budget." The terminology is sufficiently vauge to cover a host of sins. What proportion of those funds would ordinarily have gone to port facilities, to state-supported airports, to the highways? The interstate highway system is only maintained on the basis of state matching funds for Federal dollars from the Highway Transportation fund. But the article does not mention any specific state agency, and its contention about " . . . local matching funds that would have generated even more federal funding."--is not supported by the information available in many places about cuts to the Corps of Engineers. Finally, the article does not give the sources of its information, and quotes a single state senator, who is not from Jefferson Parish; it does not name a single official of the State of Louisiana, other than the Commissioner of Administration, and they do not quote him, or give any attribution, nor yet again a date for the remarks which they characterize, and allege are attributable to him.

Pretty damned sloppy journalism, all around.
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 07:49 pm
Quote:
A Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) report from before September 11, 2001 detailed the three most likely catastrophic disasters that could happen in the United States: a terrorist attack in New York, a strong earthquake in San Francisco, and a hurricane strike in New Orleans. In 2002, New Orleans officials held the simulation of what would happen in a category 5 storm. Walter Maestri, the emergency coordinator of Jefferson Parish in New Orleans , recounted the outcome to PBS' NOW With Bill Moyers:

Maestri, September 2002: Well, when the exercise was completed it was evidence that we were going to lose a lot of people. We changed the name of the [simulated] storm from Delaney to K-Y-A-G-B... kiss your ass goodbye... because anybody who was here as that category five storm came across... was gone.

--by Matthew Barge
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 07:56 pm
PBS Interview City in a bowl

Quote:
DANIEL ZWERDLING: The American Red Cross lists the worst natural disasters that might strike America. They worry about earthquakes in California, and tropical storms in Florida. But they say the biggest catastrophe could be a hurricane hitting New Orleans.

People have known for centuries that they picked a risky spot to build this city. In fact, some of the first French settlers wanted to abandon it.

The biggest river on the continent snakes around it. Most of the land here is below sea level. And every time people tried to expand the city, the Mississippi promptly flooded it.

DANIEL ZWERDLING: Why did people stay here? I'm, it became obvious very, very quickly after the French came that this was a really lousy place to live.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 07:58 pm
Reality doesn't play well here, husker.
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 08:09 pm
Code:
0 Replies
 
husker
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Sep, 2005 08:16 pm
Quote:
DANIEL ZWERDLING: Maestri says, imagine what happens if a hurricane like Andrew comes raging up from the Gulf:

WALTER MAESTRI: The hurricane is spinning counter-clockwise. It's been pushing in front of it water from the Gulf of Mexico for days. It's now got a wall of water in front of it some 30, 40 feet high. As it approaches the levies of the-- the-- that surround the city, it tops those levees. As the storm continues to pass over. Now Lake Ponchetrain, that water from Lake Ponchartrain is now pushed on to that - those population which has been fleeing from the western side and everybody's caught in the middle. The bowl now completely fills. And we've now got the entire community underwater some 20, 30 feet underwater. Everything is lost.

DANIEL ZWERDLING: Remember the levees which the Army built, to hold smaller floods out of the bowl? Maestri says now those levees would doom the city. Because they'd trap the water in.

WALTER MAESTRI: It's going to look like a massive shipwreck. There's going to be-- there's going to be, you know-- everything that that the water has carried in is going to be there. Alligators, moccasins, you know every kind of rodent that you could think of.

All of your sewage treatment plants are under water. And of course the material is flowing free in the community. Disease becomes a distinct possibility now. The petrochemicals that are produced all up and down the Mississippi River --much of that has floated into this bowl. I mean this has become, you know, the biggest toxic waste dump in the world now. Is the city of New Orleans because of what has happened.

DANIEL ZWERDLING: Federal officials say that nobody in America has confronted these conditions before. Not across an entire city. Not after an earthquake. Not after floods. Not even after September 11th:
0 Replies
 
 

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