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World stunned as US struggles with Katrina

 
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:25 pm
Sturgis wrote:
I suppose I sort of asked for that one, eh?


Ya did drop your left there for a wee bit longer than ya should have, Sturgis but not to worry, we all get our licks in at one time or 'nother.

Have a good 'un, Sturgis.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:27 pm
I honestly don't know, Lash. It's possible, I guess. Who knows? Ray Nagin's words have just stunned me. The mistakes that have been made. The problem of the addicts that no one wants to talk about. His sheer despair at government's lack of anything resembling an adequate response. It's a very chilly & depressing picture. I'm still stunned by his words.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:30 pm
[duplicate]
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:31 pm
Lash wrote:
Do you think it could happen in Oz?


Nope, Lash, they don't have the requisite number of voting age idiots.

Smile

But I see you've got your smoke machine set on high.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:31 pm
It is horrible, but considering the scope of the damage and the fact that it was about three crisis at once made it rather complicated to fix.

If it had been a hurricane without a flood, or with a flood thaqt receded, this wouldn't have happened.

NO is a bowl that filled with shitwater--plus we had nuts shooting and stealing... Too many complications for ANYONE to address in one day.

Herculean efforts were made, IMO.

But, Nagin's frustration, I understand. I think, though, out of frustration and pressure, more than a few people have scrambled to blame someone wrongly.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:33 pm
JTT wrote:
Lash wrote:
Do you think it could happen in Oz?


Nope, Lash, they don't have the requisite number of voting age idiots.

Smile

But I see you've got your smoke machine set on high.

So, its the fault of Americans that the problem was solved soon enough for your tastes in NO? Howard is your kind of leader?

Can you translate this buffoonery?

Quote:
But I see you've got your smoke machine set on high.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:35 pm
JTT wrote:
Lash wrote:
It is horrible, but considering the scope of the damage and the fact that it was about three crisis at once made it rather complicated to fix.

If it had been a hurricane without a flood, or with a flood thaqt receded, this wouldn't have happened.

NO is a bowl that filled with shitwater--plus we had nuts shooting and stealing... Too many complications for ANYONE to address in one day.

Herculean efforts were made, IMO.

But, Nagin's frustration, I understand. I think, though, out of frustration and pressure, more than a few people have scrambled to blame someone wrongly.


I see your machine has higher settings than high.

Are you capable of addressing an issue in a meaningful way?
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 07:39 pm
This sounds like a cheap shot, I know. But how could such a powerful country, which could so easily manage to "shock & awe" another, NOT have the resources & know how to act sooner & so very much better? How could life just go on, with a tragedy of this magnitude happening "at home"? The army, buses, police, food & medical supplies, every useful resource possible should have been there in force BEFORE it happened, when it became so obvious that so many could not leave. AT LEAST very soon after it became patently obvious that this was so HUGE. This is shocking & incomprehensible.
0 Replies
 
squinney
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:08 pm
I agree, msolga.

But, there was time for staging a Bush photo op.

Quote:
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
09/03/2005

Landrieu Implores President to "Relieve Unmitigated Suffering;" End FEMA's "Abject Failures"

WASHINGTON -- U.S. Senator Mary Landrieu, D-La., issued the following statement this afternoon regarding her call yesterday for President Bush to appoint a cabinet-level official to oversee Hurricane Katrina relief and recovery efforts within 24 hours.

Sen. Landrieu said:

"Yesterday, I was hoping President Bush would come away from his tour of the regional devastation triggered by Hurricane Katrina with a new understanding for the magnitude of the suffering and for the abject failures of the current Federal Emergency Management Agency. 24 hours later, the President has yet to answer my call for a cabinet-level official to lead our efforts. Meanwhile, FEMA, now a shell of what it once was, continues to be overwhelmed by the task at hand.

"I understand that the U.S. Forest Service had water-tanker aircraft available to help douse the fires raging on our riverfront, but FEMA has yet to accept the aid. When Amtrak offered trains to evacuate significant numbers of victims -- far more efficiently than buses -- FEMA again dragged its feet. Offers of medicine, communications equipment and other desperately needed items continue to flow in, only to be ignored by the agency.

"But perhaps the greatest disappointment stands at the breached 17th Street levee. Touring this critical site yesterday with the President, I saw what I believed to be a real and significant effort to get a handle on a major cause of this catastrophe. Flying over this critical spot again this morning, less than 24 hours later, it became apparent that yesterday we witnessed a hastily prepared stage set for a Presidential photo opportunity; and the desperately needed resources we saw were this morning reduced to a single, lonely piece of equipment. The good and decent people of southeast Louisiana and the Gulf Coast -- black and white, rich and poor, young and old -- deserve far better from their national government.

"Mr. President, I'm imploring you once again to get a cabinet-level official stood up as soon as possible to get this entire operation moving forward regionwide with all the resources -- military and otherwise -- necessary to relieve the unmitigated suffering and economic damage that is unfolding."


SOURCE

Equipment was brought in to make it look like the levee was being fixed. After the photo's, the equipment was removed. No repairs were actually made, although the equipment was there.

How ridiculous is that?
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:15 pm
squinney wrote:
I agree, msolga.

But, there was time for staging a Bush photo op.

Quote:
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
09/03/2005

Landrieu Implores President to "Relieve Unmitigated Suffering;" End FEMA's "Abject Failures"

WASHINGTON -- U.S. Senator Mary Landrieu, D-La., issued the following statement this afternoon regarding her call yesterday for President Bush to appoint a cabinet-level official to oversee Hurricane Katrina relief and recovery efforts within 24 hours.

Sen. Landrieu said:

"Yesterday, I was hoping President Bush would come away from his tour of the regional devastation triggered by Hurricane Katrina with a new understanding for the magnitude of the suffering and for the abject failures of the current Federal Emergency Management Agency. 24 hours later, the President has yet to answer my call for a cabinet-level official to lead our efforts. Meanwhile, FEMA, now a shell of what it once was, continues to be overwhelmed by the task at hand.

"I understand that the U.S. Forest Service had water-tanker aircraft available to help douse the fires raging on our riverfront, but FEMA has yet to accept the aid. When Amtrak offered trains to evacuate significant numbers of victims -- far more efficiently than buses -- FEMA again dragged its feet. Offers of medicine, communications equipment and other desperately needed items continue to flow in, only to be ignored by the agency.

"But perhaps the greatest disappointment stands at the breached 17th Street levee. Touring this critical site yesterday with the President, I saw what I believed to be a real and significant effort to get a handle on a major cause of this catastrophe. Flying over this critical spot again this morning, less than 24 hours later, it became apparent that yesterday we witnessed a hastily prepared stage set for a Presidential photo opportunity; and the desperately needed resources we saw were this morning reduced to a single, lonely piece of equipment. The good and decent people of southeast Louisiana and the Gulf Coast -- black and white, rich and poor, young and old -- deserve far better from their national government.

"Mr. President, I'm imploring you once again to get a cabinet-level official stood up as soon as possible to get this entire operation moving forward regionwide with all the resources -- military and otherwise -- necessary to relieve the unmitigated suffering and economic damage that is unfolding."


SOURCE


Heart-sinking stuff, squinney. Sad
From this long distance away, it appears to me that the US administration has as little regard for the poor & helpless folk of the US as they've shown for the poor & helpless of Iraq. These are real people whose lives are affected here!!! They are not just numbers & photo opportunities!
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:18 pm
Quote:
It is horrible, but considering the scope of the damage and the fact that it was about three crisis at once made it rather complicated to fix.

If it had been a hurricane without a flood, or with a flood thaqt receded, this wouldn't have happened.

NO is a bowl that filled with shitwater--plus we had nuts shooting and stealing... Too many complications for ANYONE to address in one day.

Herculean efforts were made, IMO.

But, Nagin's frustration, I understand. I think, though, out of frustration and pressure, more than a few people have scrambled to blame someone wrongly.

What's wrong with it? Your hyperbole is goofy.

Olga--

Where was the room for improvement?
I really think a lot of the carpers and incredulous people aren't getting a clear picure of what happened.

A Chronology of Hurricane Katrina

Saturday September 3, 2005 8:31 PM


By The Associated Press

A day-by-day look at Hurricane Katrina and its aftermath.

Wednesday, Aug. 24:

- Tropical Depression 12 strengthens into Tropical Storm Katrina over the Central Bahamas; a hurricane warning is issued for the southeastern Florida coast.

Thursday, Aug. 25:

- Hurricane Katrina strikes Florida between Hallandale Beach and North Miami Beach as a Category 1 hurricane with 80 mph winds.

Friday, Aug. 26:

- Katrina weakens over land to a tropical storm before moving out over the Gulf of Mexico. It grows to a Category 2 hurricane with 100 mph winds, veering north and west toward Mississippi and Louisiana.

- 10,000 National Guard troops are dispatched across the Gulf Coast.

Saturday, Aug. 27:

- Eleven people dead in Florida from hurricane-related causes.

- Katrina becomes a Category 3 storm, with 115 mph winds; a hurricane warning is issued for Louisiana's southeastern coast, including New Orleans and Lake Pontchartrain, and for the northern Gulf coast.

- New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin declares a state of emergency and urges residents in low-lying areas to evacuate.

- Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour declares a state of emergency. A mandatory evacuation is ordered for Hancock County.

- Coastal Gulf residents jam freeways and gas stations as they rush to evacuate.

Sunday, Aug. 28:

- Katrina grows into a Category 5 storm with 160 mph winds and heads for the northern Gulf coast.

- Nagin orders a mandatory evacuation for New Orleans. But 10 shelters are also set up, including the Superdome, for those unable to leave.

- Evacuation orders are posted all along the Mississippi coast.

- Alabama Gov. Bob Riley declares a state of emergency.

Monday, Aug. 29:

- Katrina, a Category 4 hurricane with 145 mph winds, makes landfall near Buras, La., at 6:10 a.m. CDT (7:10 a.m. EDT).

- President Bush makes emergency disaster declarations for Louisiana and Mississippi, freeing up federal funds.

- Katrina rips two holes in the Superdome's roof. Some 10,000 storm refugees are inside.

- At least eight Gulf Coast refineries shut down or reduce operations.

- Airports close in New Orleans, Baton Rouge, Biloxi, Mobile and Pensacola. Hundreds of flights are canceled or diverted.

Tuesday, Aug. 30:

- The hurricane death toll in Mississippi rises to more than 100.

- Two levees break in New Orleans and water pours in, covering 80 percent of the city and rising to 20 feet deep in some areas. Many people climb onto roofs to escape.

- Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco says everyone still in New Orleans - an estimated 50,000 to 100,000 people - must be evacuated. Crowds swell at the Superdome and the New Orleans convention center.

- Rescuers in helicopters and boats pick up hundreds of stranded people in New Orleans. Reports of looting emerge.

- About 40,000 people are in American Red Cross shelters, not including New Orleans.

- Bush cuts short his vacation to focus on the storm damage.

Wednesday, Aug.31:
- Nagin offers a startling estimate of New Orleans' death toll: ``Minimum, hundreds. Most likely, thousands,'' he says.

- ``At first light, the devastation is greater than our worst fears,'' says Blanco, Louisiana's governor.

- The looting grows exponentially. Thieves use a forklift to smash into one pharmacy. Blanco asks the White House to send more people. New Orleans police are called off search-and-rescue missions to combat out-of-control looting.

- Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt declares a federal health emergency throughout the Gulf Coast, sends in medical supplies and workers.

- Army Corps of Engineers estimates it will be at least 30 days or more before New Orleans will be pumped out.

- Bush authorizes a draw-down from the nation's Strategic Petroleum reserve.

- Gasoline prices surge above $3 a gallon and shortages crop up.

- Five offshore Louisiana oil rigs are reported missing and two more are adrift.

- An estimated 52,000 people are in Red Cross shelters. An additional 25,000 are in the Superdome, where conditions are worsening by the hour.

- An exodus from the Superdome begins, with the first buses leaving for Houston's Astrodome, 350 miles away.

- Pentagon mounts one of largest search-and-rescue operations in U.S. history, sending four Navy ships with emergency supplies.


- Water levels stop rising in New Orleans. Engineers work to close a 500-foot gap in a failed floodwall.

Thursday, Sept. 1:

- Looting, carjacking and other violence spreads, and the military decides to increase National Guard deployment to 30,000.

- Outside the New Orleans Convention Center, the sidewalks are packed with people without food, water or medical care, waiting for buses that do not come. Tempers flare.

- Nagin, the New Orleans mayor, calls the situation critical and issues ``a desperate SOS'' for more buses.

- Crowds at the Superdome swell to 30,000 with another 25,000 at the convention center. The first refugee buses arrive at the Houston Astrodome. Elsewhere, 76,000 people are Red Cross shelters.

- Violence escalates. Rescue boats are stolen by marauders, shots are fired at helicopters evacuating hospital patients.

- Doctors at two New Orleans hospitals plead for help, saying food, water and power are almost gone. Helicopters evacuate up to 600 patients but an estimated 1,500 others remain stranded.

- The death toll in Mississippi hits 126.

- Bush asks his father and former President Clinton to lead a fund-raising campaign for hurricane victims.

- Texas agrees to take in 75,000 hurricane evacuees.

- Six hundred massive sand bags arrive to help shore up New Orleans' broken levees.

Friday, Sept 2:

- Bush tours hard-hit Gulf coast areas and acknowledges the failure so far of government hurricane relief efforts. ``The results are not acceptable,'' he says.

- Thousands of National Guardsmen arrive in New Orleans in truck convoys carrying food, water and weapons.

- Congress approves $10.5 billion to cover the immediate rescue and relief efforts.

- The United States and European nations tap oil-and-gasoline stockpiles for 2 million barrels a day, hoping to stem gas shortages.

- Explosions rock a chemical storage plant in New Orleans and other scattered fires break out.

- Fifteen airlines get permission to fly up to 25,000 refugees out of New Orleans to San Antonio.

- Texas opens two more giant centers for victims after the Astrodome fills up. States as far away as Utah, West Virginia, Wyoming and Michigan offer to accept refugees.

- More than 50 nations pledge hurricane assistance.

Saturday, Sept. 3:

- Bush orders more than 7,000 active duty forces to the Gulf Coast.

- More than 25,000 residents have evacuated from New Orleans since Friday, the head of the Federal Emergency Management Agency says.

- Coast Guard says has it has rescued 9,500 people since Katrina hit.

What will you criticise? How would your country addressed this abny better?

The storm wasn't even that dangerous until THE DAY BEFORE IT HIT.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:20 pm
I saw footage of a levee being repaired.

It is disgusting to pretend it isn't happening.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:23 pm
Lash wrote:
I saw footage of a levee being repaired.

It is disgusting to pretend it isn't happening.

and I suppose you're going to tell us you saw men landing on the moon when everyone knows the film was faked from a studio in arizona?
0 Replies
 
squinney
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:26 pm
What? Do you think the Senator put out a press release that contained a lie about the repairs?
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:29 pm
All I know is I saw a levee in New Orleans being repaired in news footage earlier today.
0 Replies
 
squinney
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:30 pm
Quote:
...Four days after Katrina killed hundreds if not thousands, Republicans joined Democrats in shaking their heads.

"If we can't respond faster than this to an event we saw coming across the Gulf for days, then why do we think we're prepared to respond to a nuclear or biological attack?" asked former House Speaker Newt Gingrich, a Republican.

Republican Gov. Mitt Romney


Source - This was towards the end

Lash, you can't very well argue the response was adequate considering... When even the president knows it wasn't.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:31 pm
Lash

Sorry, it would take me hours (which I don't have right now) to go through all that detail, all those links....

But just following the news prior to Hurricane Katrina, we heard all the warnings, the orders to evacuate. Both from local level & federal. I'm thinking if it was known to be so serious at that stage & it seemed obvious that many folk would be stuck there .... well, I honestly don't know why all stops weren't pulled out at federal, state & local levels at THAT stage. (I fear I'm going over & over material that's been well & truly gone over on many A2K threads already ... But I'm still wondering)
0 Replies
 
sumac
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:36 pm
Nobody ordered the adequate response in a timely fashion.

Simple as that.

Perhaps everyone thought it was someone else's responsibility?

No organization chart or job description floating around?

Ever hear of "the buck stops here"?
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:39 pm
Levees are being repaired., but had to wait FOR MILLIONS OF GALLONS OF WATER TO STOP POURING OVER THEM FIRST.

Jeez.

This is very instructive about the people tryint to make hay through the worst tragedy this country has seen. You can't fix a levee while it's flooding. You can't protect people who refused to take your warnings. You can't feed people who are shooting at you.

Unbelievable.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Sep, 2005 08:42 pm
msolga wrote:
Lash

Sorry, it would take me hours (which I don't have right now) to go through all that detail, all those links....

But just following the news prior to Hurricane Katrina, we heard all the warnings, the orders to evacuate. Both from local level & federal. I'm thinking if it was known to be so serious at that stage & it seemed obvious that many folk would be stuck there .... well, I honestly don't know why all stops weren't pulled out at federal, state & local levels at THAT stage. (I fear I'm going over & over material that's been well & truly gone over on many A2K threads already ... But I'm still wondering)

You're a teacher. Surely you can read. There were no links, just facts, for those who want to know them. I'm beginning to see that doesn't apply here.

I won't waste my time.
0 Replies
 
 

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