Attack in London Today

McTag wrote:

nimh wrote:

Does Britain have jury trials?

A joke I suppose?

Nope, just ignorance. We dont have jury trials, kinda frown on them. Think most of continental Europe doesnt have jury trials. I just didnt know about Britain.

I think France still has juries in its criminal trials. Possibly one of the few European jurisdictions to do so.

Crimes are tried by the Cours d'Assises composed of three judges and a jury of nine citizens drawn by lot from a list of names. The judges and jury together decide whe-ther the accused is innocent or guilty and on the sentence to be passed. However, for certain particularly 'sensitive' cases, e.g. those concerning terrorist crimes, there are special Cours d'Assises composed of seven judges sitting without a jury.

Officer's complaint about shooting inquiry rejected

By Geneviève Roberts
Published: 26 August 2005

A firearms officer who complained about the investigation into the killing of Jean Charles de Menezes has had his complaint rejected, the Independent Police Complaints Commission said last night.

The officer took offence to comments made by the commission's deputy chairman, John Wadham, last week, when he disclosed that Sir Ian Blair had resisted the setting up of the inquiry. He said the fledgling commission had won an "important victory" for its independence in overcoming the Met's opposition.

Sir Ian had written to the Home Office in the hours after the shooting inquiring about having an internal police rather than an IPCC inquiry, because he was concerned that secrets about anti-terrorist tactics could be made public. At the time the Met wrongly believed that officers had shot dead a suicide bomber.

Mr Wadham said: "The Metropolitan Police Service initially resisted us taking on the investigation but we overcame that. It was an important victory for our independence. This dispute has caused delay in us taking over the investigation but we have worked hard to recover the lost ground."

Last night, a spokeswoman from the IPCC said a complaint was received the following day from a Metropolitan Police officer - reportedly a firearms officer - objecting to the comments. The complaint was rejected on 24 August by the chairman of the IPCC, Nick Hardwick, and not deemed to undermine the continuing independent investigation into the incident.

The IPCC spokeswoman said: "Nick Hardwick has considered the complaint made about the comments that John Wadham made. People are free to criticise and disagree with us but this is not a conduct matter and therefore no further action will be taken."

As news of the complaint emerged, senior Brazilian officials examining Me de Menezes' death were preparing to return home after completing their four-day fact-finding mission in London. Yesterday morning the delegation met the Southwark coroner, John Sampson, who will ultimately hold the inquest into the death of the innocent Brazilian.

Meanwhile, an eye-witness revealed that officers fired at Mr de Menezes for over 30 seconds at three-second intervals when they killed him at Stockwell Tube station on 22 July.

According to The Guardian Sue Thomason, a journalist, ran for her life, fearing that the police officers were terrorists who had opened fire on commuters.

A firearms officer who complained about the investigation into the killing of Jean Charles de Menezes has had his complaint rejected, the Independent Police Complaints Commission said last night.

The officer took offence to comments made by the commission's deputy chairman, John Wadham, last week, when he disclosed that Sir Ian Blair had resisted the setting up of the inquiry. He said the fledgling commission had won an "important victory" for its independence in overcoming the Met's opposition.

Sir Ian had written to the Home Office in the hours after the shooting inquiring about having an internal police rather than an IPCC inquiry, because he was concerned that secrets about anti-terrorist tactics could be made public. At the time the Met wrongly believed that officers had shot dead a suicide bomber.

Mr Wadham said: "The Metropolitan Police Service initially resisted us taking on the investigation but we overcame that. It was an important victory for our independence. This dispute has caused delay in us taking over the investigation but we have worked hard to recover the lost ground."

Last night, a spokeswoman from the IPCC said a complaint was received the following day from a Metropolitan Police officer - reportedly a firearms officer - objecting to the comments. The complaint was rejected on 24 August by the chairman of the IPCC, Nick Hardwick, and not deemed to undermine the continuing independent investigation into the incident.
The IPCC spokeswoman said: "Nick Hardwick has considered the complaint made about the comments that John Wadham made. People are free to criticise and disagree with us but this is not a conduct matter and therefore no further action will be taken."

As news of the complaint emerged, senior Brazilian officials examining Me de Menezes' death were preparing to return home after completing their four-day fact-finding mission in London. Yesterday morning the delegation met the Southwark coroner, John Sampson, who will ultimately hold the inquest into the death of the innocent Brazilian.

Meanwhile, an eye-witness revealed that officers fired at Mr de Menezes for over 30 seconds at three-second intervals when they killed him at Stockwell Tube station on 22 July.

According to The Guardian Sue Thomason, a journalist, ran for her life, fearing that the police officers were terrorists who had opened fire on commuters.

Meanwhile, an eye-witness revealed that officers fired at Mr de Menezes for over 30 seconds at three-second intervals when they killed him at Stockwell Tube station on 22 July.

According to The Guardian Sue Thomason, a journalist, ran for her life, fearing that the police officers were terrorists who had opened fire on commuters.

As a side issue, in this country when a citizen is called up for jury service (there are few exemptions) they have a most unpleasant time, spending little of their time in an actual trial, waiting around with nothing to do, and given next to no information. Very poor.
You have to be very dedicated to your duties as a citizen to do the job properly. Some aren't.

Inquiry into de Menezes leak begins

The police watchdog has appointed a former inspector of constabulary to carry out an independent inquiry into the leaking of highly sensitive material from the Jean Charles de Menezes investigation.

Bill Taylor, formerly Her Majesty's Chief Inspector of Constabulary for Scotland, will look into how documents from the Independent Police Complaints Commission's (IPCC's) inquiry found their way into the media.

He will also review the existing IPCC inquiry into the leak and decide what action is necessary against any individuals involved.

An IPCC spokeswoman said he would report to Nick Hardwick, the organisation's chairman, "as soon as possible", but she was unable to say whether this would be within weeks or months.

The announcement follows the publication of letters from the Police Federation and Metropolitan Police Federation to the Home Secretary calling for an independent inquiry into the leaks.

They demanded that someone independent of both the police and the IPCC investigate last week's disclosures, which re-ignited the controversy over the shooting of the innocent Brazilian.

Alan Gordon, vice chairman of the Police Federation, went further, saying in a letter to the Home Office that the leaks called into question the IPCC's ability to conduct investigations in a "professional and independent manner".

In a statement tonight, the watchdog said: "The IPCC announced that it had appointed Bill Taylor, formerly Her Majesty's Chief Inspector of Constabulary for Scotland, who is independent of the IPCC, to lead the inquiry into the leak of unauthorised material from the IPCC that was reported in the media on August 16 and on the following days.

"Mr Taylor has been asked to review the existing internal IPCC inquiry and then direct any further action he considers appropriate.

"He will make recommendations relating to any individuals involved and what steps the IPCC could take to reduce the risk of such unauthorised disclosure in future."

'Third man' tells of bomb hunt ordeal

Gym card link put Somali in danger during police shooting

Ian Cobain and Vikram Dodd
Tuesday August 30, 2005
The Guardian


A man being sought by the police team which accidentally shot dead Jean Charles de Menezes has spoken for the first time to the Guardian of his shock at being caught up in the search for the would-be suicide bombers.
Abdi Omar, a Somali-born bus driver, was one of two men detectives were looking for when they began following the young Brazilian from his home in south London. Mr Omar is a friend of one of the four suspects, Hussain Osman, and rents a flat above the apartment where Mr de Menezes was living.

"It could have been me who got shot that day," Mr Omar said. "I don't know what to make of all this. I don't know what I should do."

Police had been watching the block where both men lived, in Scotia Road, Tulse Hill, because they had discovered Mr Omar's gym membership card in a rucksack holding the bomb intended to blow up a tube train in Shepherd's Bush, west London.

However, Mr Omar says he had lent his membership card to Hussain Osman, a suspect since arrested in Rome and facing extradition to Britain.

He said he was friendly with Osman, an Ethiopian-born British citizen, also known as Hamdi Adus Issac, who lived in Stockwell, south London.

"I knew him from the gym, although not well, not 100%," said Mr Omar, 42. " I lent him my card. But I have no idea why it was in the rucksack."

An army surveillance specialist, on attachment to Scotland Yard, had begun watching the flats where Mr Omar lived at 6.30am on the day after the failed attacks.

Mr Omar was living in a second-floor flat in the block, while Mr de Menezes was on the first floor. Police had decided to monitor everyone leaving through the front door.

When Mr de Menezes emerged the soldier was, according to his later statement, relieving himself, and was unsure whether he had been watching either Mr Omar or Mr Osman.

The soldier would have been issued with at least one CCTV image of the Shepherd's Bush bombing suspect. He may also have had a photograph of Mr Omar: it is understood that Mr Omar's picture was on his membership card from the South Bank Club, a £395-a-year gym in south London.

According to members of Mr Omar's family, his mother-in-law was manhandled by armed police when they raided the home of his estranged wife a few hours after the death of Mr de Menezes.

The family said three plain-clothes officers with submachine guns surrounded his wife, Aziza Hassan, the couple's 12-year-old son, and her 74-year-old mother as they emerged from their home off Harrow Road, west London.

"She suffered a heart attack, and although she is now out of hospital, she needed heart surgery," said Mr Omar. Scotland Yard would not comment, other than to confirm that a complaint was being investigated.

Questioning Ms Hassan, detectives realised her husband had left the country five days before the bombing, after telling relatives that he was making a short trip to Somalia. Apparently, this heightened their suspicions. Mr Omar denies going to Somalia but says he was abroad on July 21. "I knew nothing about what was happening until I came back."

He says he went to see the police when he returned to London two weeks ago. "They questioned me like they weren't interested. They asked me: 'Why do you think we are suspecting you?' I said: 'I don't know'. By this time they knew all about the gym card, and they told my lawyer later that they were not interested in me.

"They have damaged my life and my family. But if they ask me, I would help them."

yes yes ok

but what about the CRICKET?

Sad? More than that, I figure.

"An army surveillance specialist, on attachment to Scotland Yard, had begun watching the flats where Mr Omar lived at 6.30am on the day after the failed attacks."

Just thought I would highlight this from Walters Guardian post as it illustrates what I was saying about how British secret intelligence operate.

gf going to the Aussie therapy site