If Jesus is God, how is he called God's only begotten son?

Quote:

Smileyrius asked: .. how would you interpret the illustration of the friendly Samaritan?

What's to "interpret"? It's not written in Klingon is it?
A guy was bust up at the side of the road, so somebody helps him.. Smile

1 Reply

Quote:

Neologist said:@RF- So, I ask you again. If a person calling himself a christian claims Christ is equal to his father, do you consider that person a christian?

Only God knows if any of us qualify to be called a Christian!
Perhaps God will simply overlook peoples mistaken belief if they think God and Jesus are the same.
In fact I had an e-mail debate with a Baptist minister a few months ago who insisted Jesus WAS God. I knew him from years ago when he was a sensible young freelance street preacher, but after joining the Baptists I can only assume he's lost his marbles, I suppose that's the effect organised religion has on its followers.. Wink

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@Romeo Fabulini,

Your ever growing reluctance to discuss anything with any substance is a shame.

I'll let you get back to cutting and pasting. Your audience is out there somewhere

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@neologist,

I wasn't raised religious. No disrespect to believers, but I never understood why Jesus never called himself God or even messiah....

1 Reply

@Germlat,

Germlat wrote:

I wasn't raised religious. No disrespect to believers, but I never understood why Jesus never called himself God or even messiah....

He is not God

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@neologist,

I suppose that is a good enough reason for not claiming to be God.

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@Romeo Fabulini,

Smileyrius wrote:

: .. how would you interpret the illustration of the friendly Samaritan?

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

What's to "interpret"? It's not written in Klingon is it?
A guy was bust up at the side of the road, so somebody helps him..

neologist wrote:

So, I ask you again. If a person calling himself a christian claims Christ is equal to his father, do you consider that person a christian?

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

Only God knows if any of us qualify to be called a Christian!
Perhaps God will simply overlook peoples mistaken belief if they think God and Jesus are the same.
In fact I had an e-mail debate with a Baptist minister a few months ago who insisted Jesus WAS God. I knew him from years ago when he was a sensible young freelance street preacher, but after joining the Baptists I can only assume he's lost his marbles, I suppose that's the effect organised [sic] religion has on its followers..

I see you can sashay many ways, Romeo.

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@neologist,

Ok, so I thought he was to Christians? Are you not Christian? So you know...I'm just interested...not judging you.

1 Reply

Quote:

Germlat said: I wasn't raised religious. No disrespect to believers, but I never understood why Jesus never called himself God or even messiah....

He made it plain many times that he WASN'T God, but he did say he was the Messiah. (Messiah means "Anointed One" or "Saviour").. Wink

Here's a little tale i've woven around a Bible incident in John chapter 4 involving a woman we'll call Leonora..

LEONORA
Leonora had had a rough life. A string of lovers had treated her bad, and now she'd ended up with another here in this remote village in old Samaria miles from anywhere, going out of her skull with boredom and feeling as if life was passing her by.

Then her latest fancy man shouted from the other room telling her to go get some water,so she trudged wearily down the road in the sweltering heat to the well.
A few travellers who she'd never seen before were sitting there in the shade of the trees looking tired, yet good-humouredly talking among themselves, and one of them smiled and asked her in a Galileean accent to draw some water for them.

She was surprised that a Jew would talk to a Samaritan , but he chatted a bit more with her about "living water" and other matters, and about her poor track record with men who used her like a doormat.
She told him how she yearned for the bright lights of Jerusalem where things happened and where it said in the ancient scriptures the Messiah would appear, though if and when that would be, nobody knew.

She said she liked to dream what he'd be like, a warrior king maybe, in bright silver armour riding a proud white horse, and that he'd explain everything to the people once and for all.
"Huh! i'll never see the Messiah stuck out here" she said as a tear rolled down her cheek, "when i die that's it,nobody'll remember me or even know i existed, and he wouldn't want to talk to a nobody like me anyway..".

The man gently brushed away her tear with his fingertips, lifted her chin, gazed straight into her eyes and softly replied with a smile:- "I'm him. He's talking to you now.."
And the woman in that tiny remote village long ago will be remembered in the Bible until the end of time..

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/jes-leonA.gif

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/jes-hug.gif

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"The woman said, "I know that Messiah" (called Christ) is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us."
Then Jesus declared, "I who speak to you am he." (John 4:26)

1 Reply

@Germlat,

Without Jesus, we would all be up the proverbial creek. He is the one who fulfilled the Hebrew law and gave up his perfect human life so that we could have a relationship with his father. So far he has fulfilled half of the prophecy of Genesis 3:15.

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Quote:

The Riddler (Neologist) said: I see you can sashay many ways, Romeo.

There you go again mate, speaking in riddles, why don't you just spit out what you're trying to say like a man?.. Wink

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

I wrote:

I see you can sashay many ways, Romeo.

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

There you go again mate, speaking in riddles, why don't you just spit out what you're trying to say like a man?..

Er! . . .
You are the one evading questions, sir.

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@Romeo Fabulini,

But... Jews considered many a messiah. A messiah wasn't considered divine in nature. I think even Alexander made the cut. According to Jews, Jesus did not meet the criteria.

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Quote:

Neologist said:@RF- You are the one evading questions, sir.

I make a point of NEVER dodging a question from anybody mate, so your allegation makes you a serious contender for the naughty step again.. Wink

Jesus said "Thou shalt not bear false witness" (Matt 19:18 )

1 Reply

Quote:

Germlat said: But... Jews considered many a messiah. A messiah wasn't considered divine in nature. I think even Alexander made the cut. According to Jews, Jesus did not meet the criteria.

I don't give a rat's ass what the Jews think, they had it in for Jesus ever since he told the snooty priests- "You're full of krap" (Matt 23:27) so no way were they going to admit he was the Messiah after that!
His arrival was foretold MANY times in the scriptures centuries before, for example in the Old Testament-
"Shout, Daughter of Jerusalem! See, your king comes to you, righteous and having salvation, gentle and riding on a donkey, on a colt, the foal of a donkey" (Zechariah 9:9)
And that prophecy was fulfilled in the New T-
"They threw their cloaks on the colt and put Jesus on it. As he went along, people spread their cloaks on the road" (Luke 19:35-37)

Perhaps the Jews think it refers to the Lone Ranger?.. Wink

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

I wrote:

:@RF- You are the one evading questions, sir.

Romeo Fabulini wrote:

I make a point of NEVER dodging a question from anybody mate, so your allegation makes you a serious contender for the naughty step again..
Jesus said "Thou shalt not bear false witness" (Matt 19:18 )

Oh? In that case

Quote:

So, I ask you again. If a person calling himself a christian claims Christ is equal to his father, do you consider that person a christian?

You forgot that one.

1 Reply

@neologist,

I've never understood the claim of Jesus being God. He never proclaimed himself to be that. I've never received a satisfactory reply...anger every time. I've never intended to offend anyone..simply to understand the belief.

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

So ...riding on a donkey was the proof you required? The Jews had many criteria that determined who the messiah would be. Jesus didn't make the cut. Don't forget Christianity was derived from Judaism. There were rules in place too determine who was the messiah....if Jesus didn't fulfill the prophesy, why should the Jews be to blame for the lack of belief.

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@Germlat,

Germlat wrote:

I've never understood the claim of Jesus being God. He never proclaimed himself to be that. I've never received a satisfactory reply...anger every time. I've never intended to offend anyone..simply to understand the belief.

I also never understood the claim, or the doctrine of the trinity. I assume most who call themselves christian likewise do not. That's why I asked Romeo about the Athanasian Creed, the doctrine which specifies an identity in essence and personality between the 3 phases, or faces if you prefer. If you examine it closely, it truly is a God dishonoring doctrine, cheapening the value of the ransom sacrifice and making superfluous all the expressions of the Hebrew Law which existed to identify the Christ. Once you learn about the relationship between Jehovah and his first creation, you begin to understand the special bond they both have with us. Read proverbs chapter 8, if you will. Read carefully and see if you can discern who is the one speaking.

1 Reply

@neologist,

Thanks for the reply...I'll read about it.

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If Jesus is God, how is he called God's only begotten son?

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