Please stop with the porn

Only a 3 year old thread bump.

porn
My boyfriend and I have been together 2 years now. When I met him at work I was told a month into dating that I was seeing a porno pervert. I decided to question him about it and he, of course, downplayed his porno/playboy addiction. He said he owned a few porno's when in fact what is a "few" to him is over 400 of them.I found out he owned around 400 of them 6 months into our relationship when I was finially allowed into his place. He is 47 and hasn't dated a "steady" girl since he was 24 years old. He said some girl he dated for 6 years left him for someone else and broke his heart so he didn't want to get hurt again. He spent his evenings after work at his mom and dad's house watching tv and going on vacations with them. He started getting playboys and porno's to "keep from getting his heart broke." He admits the girls became his "girlfriends." When we went out a few months he finially told me he had a problem with me and it was my weight. That he was use to seeing girls who were little blondes with tiny little waists. I am thinking "USE TO?" How can you be use to dating this when all you had was 1 girlfriend and that was when you were 24? Apparently he was telling me I wasn't up to porn star or playboy centerfold standard. I was devestated. For 6 months that we dated all I heard about was how this high school chick he dated was a little goddess and she was so beautiful and intelligent. (She became a nurse and married a well known doctor in our area). Finially I had to put my foot down about the whole ex girlfriend thing....shut up or break up..that was over 20 years ago....move on.
One night after making love, he told me he went to an x rated shop to get some more porno's and saw swinger mags. He bought one. One thing led to another and he contacted a husband and wife swinger. He then told me how he contacted them and went to their house and he screwed the man's wife while the husband video taped it. I was sickened by it. Then I asked him if he used a condom and he told me no...that he figured they were safe since they were married....!!!! I said "Hello? You found these people in swinger magazines....you were NOT the first and will not be the last they had sex with...are you out of your mind?" Then he admitted they were not the only couple...that he did this 2 other times. The last 2 times was with the same couple. He said he stopped because he agreed to screw the wife while the man watched but the last time he went there the man attempted to perform orally on him. Actually went down on him. He said it wasn't for him and he left. I feel that his excessive porno watching contributed to this desire to try swinging.
I also have been having problems with his playboy's since the girls in it are 18, 19 and 20 lately.....spencer scott was 17 when the pics were taken and held until she turned 18...this month the girl lindsay wagner is 20. I feel a 47 year old man should be more mature than wanting to look at girls that young...(I have daughter's that age and they were sexually assaulted when younger by a minister) I feel he should have more respect for what I went through than to contribute to things that highten the sexual exploition of women.
We fight daily over this playboy/porno issue.
I keep telling him we are 2 different people from 2 different backgrounds and although I love him I do not love his lifestyle and his values on this subject. He tells me he is a guy and all guys do this....I feel at 47 you cease to become just one of the "guys" and should be matured into manhood.
I feel having over 400 porno's is an addiction especially since you went out of the "fantasy" zone and actually acted out the fantasy by hooking up with swingers who could have had aids or hiv. He has also admitted he has fantasized when we make love that we are making a porno and someone is taping us. This makes me sick. I find sex is something god put between a couple to be private..something only they can share without the whole world butting in. I find it sacred. I feel he cheapens it and me to where there are times I really have to focus on something else or I won't be able to let him touch me.
Also he comments on how beautiful the porn stars are and the playboy centerfolds but he never comments on me except to say "Your beauty is on the inside where it counts." What kind of bullshit is that? How am I suppose to be turned on by him when I am hearing that? I'm sorry but I just don't find a woman who has a different penis sticking out of every orafice of her body a goddess or beautiful....what I find beautiful is a woman who is respectible about her body.
We are living in a society where sex is available everywhere. We cannot get away from it. It's in newspapers, tv, internet....girls are having eating disorders in order to look porn star perfect or playboy perfect and men feed this to us every time they buy a porno, a sports illustrated or a playboy. Not to mention all the other mags that have to put a half naked size 3 and under girl in something to feed sexual fantasies.
I love myself and I told my boyfriend that I am on the verge of breaking up over this issue. I am not married to him and therefore do NOT have to live in it . Contrary to what he says...NOT ALL men have this desire to oogle naked young women when they are 47 years old. Most men by that age are out of this college "boy" mentality. Most men I know anyhow. I told my boyfriend that after 2 years of dating the playboys/porno's should be finding their way out the door not us fighting daily over them. All I hear from him is "Pussies are beautiful..the girls are goddesses...I am a man and men look at beautiful women. I am not obsessed with this." I am 45..I am not stupid...I know men are going to look at women but when it hurts your relationship to the brink of breaking up and you haven't dated for over 20 years then something is wrong. Especially if you have someone who loves you and you prefer to lose them over a cold flat page of a magazine or the cold flat tv screen. He did tell me he loves me but also in the same breath he tells me I am the one with the problem...excuse me..I have never acted out with swingers, I do not have porns....I do not have the need for looking at young barely legal boys to get a rush from my brain to my nether regions.
I told him tonight..there is no need for fighting...we just break up and go on as friends...I will get over him and he I. I love me more than I love him. I want a healthy relationship.

That is just my opinion.

adding to the post
Adding to my previous post above...
Last year when the Victoria Secret fashion show came on...he came over for supper. He turned on this fashion show and I told him NO. I have other concerns with him that lead me to believe he is OCD and this obsession with looking at naked women and almost naked women is a part of that obsession. I worked in nursing 19 years and there is a healthy attitude with men looking at women and there is the one which requires intensive counseling. Anyhow, it came out that he taped the Victoria Secret fashion show just in case I wouldn't allowed it watched in my home. I asked him why the need to tape the show and he told me the women are so beautiful and he has to look at them. To me this is shallow.
It is one thing to see a beautiful woman in passing..you admire and go on...but when you are with your significant other and they have a problem with this you do not feed that problem. You RESPECT who you are with. If he had not told me about taping it I would have been none the wiser but he made it a point he had to tell me. It is like a little boy doing something taboo and mommy has to spank him over it.

Last night we had a free Cinemax weekend and of course with those satellite channels you get the soft porn...knowing I do not want this watched in my home...he turns the channel on it anyhow just seconds after I ask him if he wants to go upstairs and have some fun. I was trying to talk to him as this girl is taking a vibrator rubbing it all over her body and he completely is so engrossed with it that he doesn't hear a word I say. I had to yell at him to get his attention. Needless to say...the fight was on. I went up to bed alone....told him not to touch me and if he wanted to continue watching this instead of coming upstairs to make love to me then the KY Jelly was in the top drawer and the massage oil was on the table...to knock himself out but when he was finished pack up all his weekend gear and go to his own home. I am tired of this and I don't have to go through it on a daily basis. I do not want him touching me or even laying in the same bed with me. After 10 minutes of fighting I went to bed alone and he came up wanting to then caress me...trying to smooth things over into lovemaking. I am sick of this.

Working in nursing and knowing he has OCD (undiagnosed in his case) I see everyday his measuring out every little thing he does, getting the deer in the headlights look when his schedule is thrown off by even a minute, the eating of ravoli every single day for lunch for 2 years straight and now the eating of something else every single day for lunch for 1 and a half years straight....the porno and the "need" to see naked women is an obsession...not a normal man's view of women but more than that.
When it comes to sex with a real live woman he cannot get excited about it and acts so indifferent when it comes to actually doing the act. The porno's has him laying in bed on his back with his hands crossed over his chest in a "ok come on and please me" attitude. I am not a porno whore to just please him. Also you would think a man who has over 400 porno's and has watched them would know what to do with a woman in bed....he doesn't. I have had to teach him and show him things to do to me in bed. I bought garter's and stockings, etc...still no "turn on" for him with me in them...just gets harder than a brick after being stimulated with a playboy or a porno. The girls have to be porno star/playboy centerfold beautiful or there is nothing out of him.

It comes down to this...he enjoys this and wants no help with his OCD...I want something different in a man. This is not the life for me and I have dated many men who do not have this desire to purchase porno or playboys. There are just many different maturity levels in men. Some have to have it and some can admire a woman in passing and leave it at that. I am use to the latter. That is what I want. I have a right to want what I want just as much as he has the right to want his porno's and playboys. I am just sickened by the whole aspect of it because where does it end? Men are sexually molesting babies and young children and the sexual explotation just gets worse. When do we draw the line at "OK STOP?"

Hmmmm?

Hi Slappy,

I just noticed this thread. Interesting insights!

I agree with most of what you've said in your original post. The male brain circuitry and hormones predispose them to falling for porn. Women are wired differently and stimulated in a different way.

While facts in endocrinology and neurobiology have plausible explanations for male inclination toward porn and ogling, we should not assume that we can use these facts to justify such male indulgence. It's practical on a girl's part, however, not to mind her partner watching porn up to acceptable levels, especially in this day when the market is flooded with such material. However, she has to be wary of signs of porn addiction in him. Addiction, whether to drug or porn, is an indicator of mental instability. Addiction to porn is a recipe for disaster. Such men don't deserve to be in a relationship. The reason why I think girls can approve of porn-watching by their boys to an extent is that no studies so far have confirmed a link between porn-watching and general wellbeing and success in life. So a little porn, like little alcohol, is not bad, IMO.

In any case, watching porn, little or more, is not good mental health over a long term. Hormones do increase the likeliness of a behavior (in this case, watching porn), but they are not determiners of any external behavior by any means. Personally, if I had to choose between a guy who watched a little bit of porn and one who didn't watch it at all (granted I had some means of finding that), all other things being equal, I would choose the latter. I can confidently say from my experience that certain types of men are more likely to feed on porn. Past experiences and conditioning play a huge role. Some guys are morally so upright that they would never look at porn, no matter how strong an urge they experience at times. That's an indicator of strong character. Good guys will always exert self-control. Same goes for ogling and other related things. In the end, it is, I think, a matter of choice.

jesus, i'm so glad such morals are objective, or i'd think this was a load of wank... (no offense)

Spidergirl,

What you just said maybe true in India but around here it is lacking in significance, to use an euphemism...

I said quite a few things. What exactly are you referring to, Francis?

And porn is big in India, too. So there.

I am not getting into a debate on morals here, but I needed to clarify that we all follow a universal code of morality which is hardwired into the brain. Most people know the difference between the right and the wrong, but few translate that knowledge into behavior.

correct. either you're declaring the debate already won, or the issue undebatable- objective.



maybe you can start a neural-morality cult. or will science prove what morals we should have without your insight, like it did with eugenics?

I am not sure where this is going. I have kept the facts and my POV separate, and I am not imposting my POV on anyone.

Here you go:

Neural origins of morality:

http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/2007/05.03/15-hauser.html

Too much is not OK:

http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/500720/

Psychology of porn:

http://newsnet.byu.edu/story.cfm/13911

and morality is more vague than -you- might think.

Tinygiraffe:

There is someone Judith who has conducted research on the effects of pornography on mind. If my motive had been to simply "prove" my point, I would have posted the link to her paper and website, too. I didn't; I have found several glitches in her paper myself.

I agree that if you applied yourself to it, you could find any number of papers corroborating your opinion or stance on something. I haven't tried to do it. I had known about the universal moral code and brain circuitry thing long before. (If you are going to major in neurobiology, you have to know such stuff.)

My previous post might have implied something that I didn't want it to. If I found out, let's suppose, that my (future) husband looks at porno, I would understand. Since I am aware of the biology thing, I wouldn't react initially (I understand it can happen with men.) I would also understand that people make mistakes all the time. I wouldn't ask him to stop right away. I would discuss. And so on.

But all said, I do feel that just because men are hardwired in a way that predisposes them to falling for porn, we cannot justify it. We are hardwired even for polygamy. But then, how many of you have more than one wife/husband/lover at a time? My point really is that we can't assume that it's OK to look at porn. Of course, if my husband is looking at it, that's a different story, and I wouldn't impose all my generalizations on him. That problem would require an entirely different approach. In fact, I might just leave it for him to decide and not meddle into his personal life, but again, generally speaking, I think men can't use the brain circuitry blah blah to justify watching porn.

I am not married. I don't have a personal issue with porn, but since this is so closely related with biology (my major), I am always intrigued by the topic. I obviously don't want to be biased, but my POV on holding ourselves accountable for our behavior stands...

spidergal, if you don't want a guy that looks at porn (immediately or eventually,) good luck to you. but you can insist on limiting your search to any group of people- whether redheads, libertarians, or conjoined twins. (pity if one doesn't look at porn and the other does...)

i just take issue with your implication (i could have sworn you came right out and said it) that the morality around porn is absolute... you're jumping ahead talking about "justifying" it- before it would need justification, you'd have to be sure it's wrong. and for that matter, i don't know where you get the idea that polygamy needs justification. you're assuming there is an objective "right and wrong" to draw from. you may be up to date on neurology, but where does it say we have objective access to anything, let alone morality- assuming (another big if) that such a thing even exists?

Spidergirl,

I was refering to this:





Equating strong character with looking at porn now and then might be of the order of dellusional behavior.

We both know, or you should, than man and woman's brains are not wired the same way.

However, you, despite your scientific knowledge, are throwing us your gynecentric perspective as an absolute.

(Is neural circuitry getting to your brain?)

But let me explain:

- I'm not talking about porn addicts. I'm talking about ordinary men, which I consider myself to be one.

- Watching porn is like eating a candy now and then, not like being a compulsive candy eater.

- For those who know what voluptuousness is, porn is like drinkink a cold beer in a hot day, in the shades of a patio, while listening to the murmur of the fountain.

Telling me that good guys don't do that because of some "universal moral", well, it's unnamable.

There's some confusion, here. Right now, I am on a run, but I will fill you guys in soon.

Spiderporn, spiderporn, does whatever a spiderporn does.

I had a talk withthe GF about porn in the shower today. It was after a rigorous tumble if you catch my drift.

She asked me if I liked it. I said yes.

She asked if it was the girls I liked. I said yes.

i then explained that watching porn was enjoyable to male sexual enthusiast much like watching professional basketball on TV. The sport fan still enjoys shooting hoops in his driveway regaurdless of the fact he or she can't slam dunk. Much is the same for porn. I told her, the performance was exciting, but I still like to shoot hoops too.

She couldn't disagree, we were both out of breathe.

T
K
O

P.S. - Oh and I almost forgot. I asked her about porn too. She said she watched it too. She said that she has been watching it more and more recently. She said that when she was in highschool amny years ago and her and her friends found some they watched it out of curiousity but the porn that she had found was obviously taylored for men. many years now to the prensent she has looked again and found porn that taylors to what excites her. When she realized there was diversity in porn, she stopped making broad generalizations.

She used to feel threatened by porn because she didn't understand it. but once she found what excited her, and she experienced first hand that her feelings for me weren't affected, she began to feel less jealous.

P.P.S. - I don't understand the men in relationships who quit shooting hoops and only watch TV. They're no true enthusiast.

You need to get out of the research lab and meet some men in real life.

i remember a woman i was with, i took pictures of her wearing just a bedsheet, they showed off the shape of her body perfectly. i suppose this was acceptable, but if not for the sheet it would have been morally (objectively!) wrong?

another time, i was with a woman that had a video camera connected to a television. we got the camera at a variety of different angles, but she didn't keep a tape. if she had, i assume watching it would be morally (objectively!) wrong? it was fun to watch, even though i was committing a sin against some universal morality.

or perhaps these things are okay, but then porn itself is morally (and objectively) wrong?

or perhaps the line between is artificial, and you can do experiments all day long and prove nothing regarding morals.

"no amount of experimentation can ever prove me right; a single experiment can prove me wrong." - albert einstein

LOL i feel like im in middle school!

if there is a universal morality, it would make no sense to have us put cock inside vagina in person and its ok, but on tape its "hell-time"?

...

Porn is there when your girl is not. girls dont deal with fleshy sacks between their legs that fill with white fluid. constantly.

i mean come on, it has to go somewhere!