Will You Watch the Debate?

What can I possibly say that hasn't been said? Kerry stated his case and Bush echoed the same old, same old. So much so the he might just have not bothered to appear and sent in a tape. In fact that probably been the best course of action. Since he appeared, between his blinking and smirking, to be as deer caught in the headlights of an oncoming car.
The question now is did it have any impact on the undecided or even that at this point they exist.

The local poll in todays paper said the debate swayed people to bush 4 to 1..........no need to worry when fear and ignorance are on your side.....

That's why I want Linkat to stop in with her take! (Apparently a true undecided.)

That must be a highly conservative local paper there, BPB.

I'd be interested to hear what Linkat has to say too.

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/index.html

Score six for Kerry in Ohio



You've seen the TV scene a hundred times: A network news station corrals six undecided voters -- three women, three men, two of whom are black, three white, and one seemingly of Middle Eastern origin -- in a library in Small Town, America. Mr. Correspondent then asks about the Big News Event.

You don't want to seem cynical but these staged town hall meetings sure do seem to spur predictable answers from our good neighbors, The Undecided.

But not this time.

Who are the faces behind the early polls that show Kerry won the debate? They are these six folks in Massillon, just outside of Canton, in swing state Ohio, speaking with NBC correspondent Ron Allen.

So why are you, Jennifer Bauer, an executive assistant, still undecided?

"I'm not convinced George Bush is doing the right thing over in the war," Bauer says. "And I think John Kerry has a good knowledge of foreign policy."

And you, Phillip Elum, small business owner, you voted for George Bush in the last election -- what did you think of Bush's performance in the debate?

"His performance was fine," Elum says. "But John Kerry gave me a higher comfort level in his capability of being commander in chief and in homeland security."

Julie Farley, dental office manager, you are a "security mom." Who do you think will keep the country safer?

"I think John Kerry will."

John Kerry?

"Yes. I think President Bush puts fear in us. And I think John Kerry is a leader and is basically just going to handle it."

Bob Phillips, you are a Persian Gulf veteran and now work at the veterans' administration. Who do you think has a better plan for Iraq, for getting the troops home the soonest?

"I think John Kerry does, just for the simple fact that he wants to make it a coalition ideal, where everybody gets involved. Where George Bush is making our troops more involved."

So who had the stronger night?

All six: "John Kerry."

-- Kevin Berger

Kerry was the CLEAR winner last night!!!

No doubt about it. I loved the "daughters on a leash" comment. If Bush feels that way about his daughters, imagine how he feels about us! And, Kerry's response, "Well, I've learned not to do that," hit me as a much more respectful father figure.

Another thing that I don't think has been addressed yet was all of the stammering around Bush did. I would love to see a 60 second commercial putting together all of the pauses, stammering, blank looks, attempts to figure out what to say... Ending with the HUGE "Whew! It's hard work!" Along with his body language, he appeared tired, worn out, and mentally strained. Add that to the big breath and comment on how hard it is to be President and one has to wonder if he's up to another week of this, let alone another 4 years.

I agree. I almost wanted to ask him why he was running again if the job was just too hard for him?

I also really liked the daughters on a leash comment.

Someone should have put Bush on a leash. Before he defecated on the world.

Omigod FreeDuck that is so cool!!!!!

I mean, it's one article, six people, not anything statistically. But wow!

I love this. Love love love love it:

Same here! I know it's not statistically anything, but it IS Ohio (swing away) and it does give Kerry supporters a boost.

Unfortunately a leash doesn't prevent defecation...perhaps it would be more appropriate to say it's too bad someone didn't put a cork in his ass.......before he plugged the world up the ass.......

Swing on, Ohio!

(I'm SO glad I live here. I would want to live here if I didn't live here just so I could get out and do something.)

I'd share that opinion ...

Pointing out that Karzai in Afghanistan "controls all of one city, Kabul" is just "pessimistic leftwing talking points"? Pointing out that "The rest of Afghanistan is controlled by warlords, some of whom are Taliban" is just more "pessimistic leftwing talking points"? Citing the Strategic Studies Institute is just more "pessimistic leftwing talking points"?


Not without some solid infrastructure, a strong army and basic humanitarian support, no. Why did you think Afghanistan was in the grip of those very same disunited warlords for almost a decade before the Taliban took over? Because back then, the Afghans wanted democracy less passionately than they do now? Of course not, now and then the Afghans must have felt the same. But what do you do if the warlords have more weapons than you do, and are for strategic reasons considered "untouchable"?

Some sort of democracy can be wrought in Afghanistan, I'm sure most Afghans will appreciate it. But not as long as we don't provide Karzai with the kind of logistics and material he'd need to even become some of those warlords' equal. That's just more "pessimistic leftwing talking points"? Not unless you live in a kind of cloud-cuckoo land where the only thing that's needed to make something work is to tell yourself, "it will work, it will work, it will work, how can it not?"

Nimh, I think that it shows what a miserable failure the UN and NATO are at peace keeping and nation building. We should never have let them take over Afghanistan as they have no heart for it.

OK, OK here I am. I feel so popular. I hope I can do this justice.

Overall I think they both did well and look well. Some silly stuff I cannot stand, but tried not to pay attention to - Bush's smirks and Kerry's fake looking smile. Aside from that I tried to get through the crap and came up with the following:

Positive issues and facts I got on Bush - He did a great job immediately following 9/11. We did catch many of the high-level Al Qaeda terrorists. He handled that aspect of foreign policy very well. He has experience dealing in war as a President.

Positive issues and facts I got on Kerry - Granted hind site helps - Current stance on Iraq. Would prefer to have other countries help out. I agree that we should have waited before jumping into war. Support financially and with troops of other countries. I agree that I do not think that Sadaam was in a current position to get stronger especially with the UN and inspectors around. As long as he was being pressured and kept a close eye on, he was not in immediate danger and we would be all the around better off if we kept our focus on Al Qaeda.

Questions about Bush - After his speaking about certainty, etc., it seems he would be unlikely to admit he made an error. If Bush came out and said he made an error and jumped too quickly in attacking Iraq, but at this point we need to finish and help the Iraqis to assemble some sort of order, I would feel better about the Iraq situation. I think we are stretching our military too far. I feel concern the military does not have proper equipment to protect themselves as best as possible.

Questions about Kerry - His plan for Iraq does sound the best at this, but is it possible? Can he begin to pull military out of Iraq? Can he pull together other countries? Can he help to counter the damage of our reputation among other countries? He does not have the experience Bush has as commander in chief.

I need to look at the Johnkerry.com website to see more details of his plan. I assume Bush has a similar website.

Squinney
Squinney, you will love this. The DNC put together a film clip of Bush's frustration facial expressions.

http://www.democrats.org/

BBB

Thanks, Linkat! Very nice summary.

Do you feel like it swayed you in any way? Towards or away from a candidate?

Right now, I am swayed toward Kerry. Only that I would like to get out of Iraq as quick as possible, but of course want to make sure the Iraqi people can sustain stability. My impression is that Kerry wants to get out of Iraq quickly whereas Bush does not seemed as concerned about this. The question is if Kerry's plan of 6 months plausible. That is why I need to thoroughly read his website. Hopefully he explains his plan in more detail and explains how he could achieve this.

I am very interested in seeing the vice-presidential debates.

But then again I live in Massachusetts so my vote will not have much impact. I still think it is important to vote because if it is not a landslide for Kerry in Mass. then that is also sending a message.