Why Obamacare is a Failure

Stop feeding the troll.

All of the greatest endeavours in human history from the pyramids to the Hoover dam have been caused by people working together. Rugged individualism is another word for selfishness, divide and rule. You're spending so much time looking down on people who you think may be getting something for nothing that you're letting the Uber rich off scot free.

Their wealth didn't come out of nowhere, it's dependent on resources of the planet on which we all live, and the labour of others.

Some people don't earn enough to save, some people are born too disabled to work. Do you seriously want to live in a society where those people are left to die, or forced to beg for scraps?

It's not just you who has to pay his taxes, it's everyone. It makes for a better society with less crime. Your ridiculous gun laws aren't the only reason for your high homicide rate compared to other developed nations, it's an unequal society. It fuels anger and resentment.

At the end of the day the only people who benefit are the aristocracy, and you're kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

I pay taxes, and I do so happily.

I've been retired since 1998, and we still pay our taxes - maybe not happily but with knowing our government needs to fund its many responsibilities. Is there waste? Sure; it's not a perfect operating system.

Most of the United States of America was founded through rugged individualism of "Settling the West". You see personal responsibility as being selfish? What is wrong with being responsible for oneself? Has the UK become so reliant on government support that there is no room for personal responsibility?

You say I am looking down on people, but I am not actually doing so. I am suggesting that people should be responsible for their actions and their decisions. Lots of people make terrible decisions. It's a fact of life. The decide to commit crimes, they decide to not hold down a job, they decide to not attend school, they decide to not pay attention in school, they decide all aspects of their lives.

Is that looking down on someone? I don't think so.

Let's look at the uber rich. Tell me some that are not uber rich as a result of hard work, either theirs or their parents? I suppose we should not include the landed gentry and aristocrats in your country. The Queen probably hasn't worked her butt off attaining her position though I am sure that she is a good person.

Bill Gates is uber rich. He worked for his money. Sam Walton died uber rich through a lifetime of work. Carlos Slim is a really wealthy guy. He worked his entire life to be so. The list goes on and on and on. The majority of wealthy people have become wealthy as a result of a lot of work and some good amount of luck.

You speak of the greatest endeavors in human history were caused by people working together... paid for by whom? I believe the Pharaoh was responsible for the pyramids. Do you think that a bunch people just got together and decided to build a pyramid? Hoover Dam? a giant group effort paid for by tax dollars and loans. Tax dollars paid by the wealthy and the businesses of the nation. Every large project has had backers of some sort. People don't work for free anymore. They banned slavery.

See, you villainize the employer by saying that they made their money on the labour of others... duh. But the employees aren't exactly not getting soemthing from the employer. They get paychecks, vacation days, sick time, reliable income, health insurance etc. Employers do indeed get something from their employees. But, did Microsoft just start out as a giant conglomerate? No. It started in a garage and had a couple guys working hard and having great ideas.

Yeah, I know that there are people that don't make enough. I see them every day. I see them buying cigarettes, I see them going to bars and spending too much on booze. I see them having expensive cell phones and watching giant TV's. I see them buying lottery tickets and expensive clothes on credit cards that they will never have any hope of getting paid off in their life times. They never learned to save their money. They are too wrapped up in living for now that they can't see a future for them selves.

Oh, and just hush about the US gun laws.

Now, where do you think that the majority of tax money comes from? The middle class and those that are poverty stricken?

I also pay my taxes. I also pay my sales taxes and all the other taxes that Americans pay. We sometimes pay taxes several time on one thing. My wife also gives to several charities and my family volunteers many hours to help others every month. We are not oblivious to the plight of others especially the less fortunate than us.

I never said you were oblivious, but you're not prepared to pay enough taxes for UHC. Actually, America did pay more in health care than us, (I don't know about now with Agent Orange gutting everything) but still never had UHC. That's what happens when you have a populace more prepared to pay for the profits of insurance executives than the care of the sick.

You might want to ask why your taxes are so obvious. We pay VAT but it's included in the price, not added on afterwards. When you're made to be aware of the, (relatively) tiny amount you pay you're more likely to listen to the fat cats who want to slash the (huge,) amount they pay.

I've heard tell of towns in America that can't afford full time fire fighters, something's not right there.

They decide to be born orphans, or disabled, or the victims of crime.

You are being selfish, divide and rule alright.

Alright, I'll stop. Sorry just see your post.

Odd thing about it is that I fully support a single payer healthcare system in the US.

I'm pretty free, in my way, and I didn't vote for him. As I've mentioned before, not all 330 million of us in US are the same. I don't refer to your countries in generalizations, or at least try not to; if I do, it's to praise/enjoy the good.

I am not supine, have been involved in what is now called progressive politics since almost when I started to read, circa 60 years of interest, and participation.

Stop it with the sweeps and learn to use words like "some", "many". Amalgamating large populations is insulting.

Sorry, but if I have to couch everything I'll be here all day. If more people were like you you'd have UHC. Unfortunately too many of your fellow voters are more concerned about someone poor getting something for nothing than making sure the rich pay their way.

Someone like Trump could never get elected in any other developed nation.

Again sorry for the generalisations.

I have genuine sympathy for you Osso, we often agree, and it didn't started yesterday, but on this one you Americans have to digest the fact.
Trump is obvious raving crazy lunatic bullshit n voting for him is plain dumb. No one in the ******* planet has yet gotten the reason/s why a massive amount of Americans voted for him. This a fact worldwide like it or not.

Really, then why did you vote for someone who is gutting it? Even now when plans for Trumpcare penalise the poor and benefit only the very rich you still have him as your avatar.

Doesn't look like you support UHC, not as much as you support tax cuts for the uber rich in any event.

Thank you both. I can get testy, as people know.

I of course agree with the assertions of both of your posts, it's just that some of us can feel battered again when we are already being multiply battered.

Obamacare is/was not single payer healthcare. Not even close. So please do not compare it as such.

You have no idea what Trumpcare will be like beyond reading the drivel that people like Blatham spoon feeds you.

Thank God the world has you to speak for it. Halle-frickin-lujah.

Under Trumpcare, 14 million will lose their health insurance. I don't see that as positive in any way.

Lol... Those 14 million don't WANT Obamacare. They are forced to have it and when it goes away they will no longer be FORCED to have it.

You can't lose something you don't want. It's like taking a leech off your dick. Would you consider someone getting that leech off as "losing it" or "Getting rid of it"?

If you really believe they don't want health insurance, you need to check into an insane asylum.