31
   

Why Obamacare is a Failure

 
 
thack45
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 06:21 am
How Republicans’ obsession with tax cuts for the rich drove their health care plan over a cliff

Quote:
...pressuring legislators is far more effective when the legislation itself is not astonishingly unpopular. As it was, House leaders lost both the coalition’s most and least conservative members, along with many in between. It’s hard to believe a strategy of structural reform would have fared worse.

Instead, high-end tax cuts trumped all other considerations. For all the disagreement among House Republicans about other ramifications of the AHCA, there was virtually no disagreement on this element — even though it made the GOP legislative task near-impossible.

What’s more, in acceding to Ryan’s priorities, Donald Trump showed that his populism was as phony as his university. When push came to shove, he was willing to sacrifice the people who voted for him on the altar of tax cuts for the rich. Perhaps the most surreal moment in the whole surreal debate came in an exchange with Fox’s Tucker Carlson, who asked Trump whether he understood that the “counties who voted for you will do far worse under your plan." Trump’s reply? "Oh, I know." (Trump professed to believe such problems were small and could be fixed in the Senate, but they lay at the heart of the bill.)

Lest there be misunderstanding, very few Americans share the GOP political class’s obsession with marginal tax rates on the affluent — excepting the affluent who donate to the GOP political class. Even a majority of Republican voters oppose new tax cuts for wealthy households.*

But being spectacularly out of step with the public on this issue is nothing new for the Grand Old Party. At the outset of the Iraq invasion, Tom DeLay famously said: “Nothing is more important in the face of war than cutting taxes.” Republican leaders from Gingrich to Bush to Ryan have consistently placed the battle to cut taxes for the wealthiest at the top of their to-do list.

Indeed, the priority of high-end tax cuts dictated Ryan’s grand strategy. Health care reform — or, rather, tax cuts under the banner of health care reform — was to be round one. Round two has been structured around a Border Adjustment Tax that would raise a trillion dollars to fund additional tax cuts targeted (surprise!) even more on the wealthy than the 2001 cuts achieved under President Bush.


*I would've liked a source on this
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 09:26 am
@thack45,
Are middle class republicans waking up from their stupor?
Linkat
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 09:39 am
Because it hurts the very people that many of these politicians are claiming they are trying to help. The thought is good but like many of these government programs it hurts those that are working and contributing financially to the system.

The middle working class is now paying more for healthcare and getting less services and less choices for their dollars. Health insurance premiums have skyrocketing for us - my take home pay has decreased each year as a result. I just finished my taxes for 2016 and we made $8 thousand less than the previous year - my salary did not change, my bonus changed by $500- the only other thing to change was dental insurance by a few pennies and my health care.

Coverage previously - I had co-pays ones that were reasonable $25 regular doctor visit, $50 for urgent care and hospital visit $100. Now I have to pay a high deductible of $6k for family and then once reached 10 percent. There are also limits. Unfortunately for my daughter she had a serious injury and she requires surgery -- for all the initial visits we have met the $6k and looking at the price of surgery I will probably have to fork out more than another $2 thousand at minimum. And she is getting close to her lifetime limit on PT already at age 14! So depending how much more she will need this too will end up coming directly out of our pocket.

How does one pay for all this when they are in middle class? We are cutting out any contribution to 401k for retirement and instead having all this go into a health saver account. This is what happens to middle class they have to give up their retirement after years of working and contributing.

I am glad others are getting insurance and health care they need - I am not heartless and want others to get care that is needed, but the middle class whom everyone is claiming they are trying to protect -- are actually the ones getting hurt.


thack45
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 10:56 am
@cicerone imposter,
No idear. I don't get exposed to a lot of the feelings of moderates – be they left or right. Hopefully that's the case, but the EIB microphone & such never quits
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 11:34 am
@Linkat,
Trump speaks with forked tongue, but many believe his BS at the detriment of their own self interest. If they bothered to look for the facts, they would find that all proposals by Trump hurts the middle class and helps the wealthy.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/anthonynitti/2017/03/01/president-trump-promises-massive-middle-class-tax-cuts-but-will-he-deliver/amp/
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 11:41 am
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Trump speaks with forked tongue, but many believe his BS at the detriment of their own self interest. If they bothered to look for the facts, they would find that all proposals by Trump hurts the middle class and helps the wealthy.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/anthonynitti/2017/03/01/president-trump-promises-massive-middle-class-tax-cuts-but-will-he-deliver/amp/


Replace Trump with politician. This is not just a Trump issue neither is it a democrat or republican issue - this is a politician issue. They all say they are for the middle class yet when has any more recent (past 10 years or so) government policy helped the middle class?

Why do you think Trump got elected? Because he is a nice guy---because people liked him? No - because people are sick and tired of politicians and their lies. Trump had no politicians supporting him including the republican party he was running in?

He won because everyone is sick and tired of the politicians and their lies. I honestly don't think hardly anyone really likes him but he isn't a politician and so far they haven't helped us - it was a cry of desperation.

At least that is my thought.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 11:47 am
@Linkat,
Trump already had a history of bigotry, scamming and lying. That was common knowledge to those who bothered to read and/or listened to the media.
I have also read that the majority of Trump supporters were the uneducated. That makes sense.
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/education-not-income-predicted-who-would-vote-for-trump/
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 11:53 am
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Trump already had a history of bigotry, scamming and lying. That was common knowledge to those who bothered to read and/or listened to the media.
I have also read that the majority of Trump supporters were the uneducated. That makes sense.


Probably look up every other politician out there and see how many probably have similar history - they are just better at hiding and know how to shut their mouths and play the game.

Heck we almost had a first man that had sex in the oval office with an intern and lied about it. And the guy is still popular and would have won an election over his wife. That might not be bigotry but this beats out Trump on lying, scamming and women's rights by a mile.

I am not a fan of Trump but he is the president we have now whether we like or not. At least financially I figure we can't get much worse.

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 11:55 am
@Linkat,
Yes, Trump is the president with the lowest rating for his first months in office. It's been in the 36 to 40% range.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 11:58 am
@Linkat,
Okay, show us every other politician's rating compared to Trump.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/trump-is-beating-previous-presidents-at-being-unpopular/
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 12:56 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Huh - I never said anything in regard to Trump's ratings I actually said that I think most people do not like him.

I even said without mentioning him by name that Clinton is a much more popular president and still is even though he lied to the American people on national television about having sexual relations in the oval office - and he'd probably still be voted in today over his wife.

So basically what I am getting at is - Trump may be all those things you claim - but aside from the proving whether Clinton is racist or not - he did worse in my opinion on lying and scamming seeing he lied right on national tv to the American public but yet everyone still loves him.

Clinton has a certain charisma that Trump doesn't.



cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 01:58 pm
@Linkat,
I'm sharing Trump's ratings with other readers.
You are free to have any opinion on any politician - in this world.
The topic of this thread is Obamacare and Trumpcare.
Baldimo
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 02:01 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
I'm sharing Trump's ratings with other readers.

The daily update, you are quite dedicated.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  3  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 03:37 pm
@Linkat,
Quote:
but he isn't a politician and so far they haven't helped us - it was a cry of desperation.


Well after all Trump is a billionaire businessman. After 4 years of his B S it will cure peoples hatred of most politicians, but increase their hatred of billionaires.
0 Replies
 
Linkat
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 05:41 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Actually it is obamacare.

And you were discussing the ratings of Trump which was off topic from obamacare. I was discussing why I thought obamacare was a failure until you brought up trump. I was simplying providing my opinion why I thought he got voted in.

Not sure why your off topic Trumps mine especially why I was simply responding to what you stated.

I honestly think your hatred of the man is making you state things that are unreasonable. You can say something negative about Trump but if you support similar facts on any other person it is never any where near as bad as trump.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2017 06:38 pm
@Linkat,
What I say about any politician is protected by our Constitution. Trump is a bigot and liar, and I'm going to repeat that often.
Trump's approval rating proves my point.
You are free to defend Trump as well.

It's also about Trumpcare that would have been a crisis for 24 million Americans.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 03:06 pm
Thanks, Bernie!!

Obamacare is failing, but thanks to Bernie's information campaign last year, over 60% of Americans say that our country should provide affordable healthcare for our people.

The tide is turning. The Clinton/Pelosi rhetoric that single payer will never happen will be overturned in our lifetimes.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/ap-norc-poll-feds-ensure-health-coverage-48740388
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 04:34 pm
@Lash,
Bernie is a bit outside the fence. What's really inane is that Obama care can be fixed into what both ides can live with but "COMPROMISE" isa dirty word in DC and both sides are acting like petulant little kiddies.
Trump can actually show some leadership if he gets off his ass and stops being so damned thin skinned and would force congress to do the unthinkable. It would be somewhat of a relief to have the resultant health care bill named after both Obama/Trump .

naah, group intelligence is something weve learned to live without

0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 04:43 pm
I acknowledge that I infuse some of my political opinions with my hopes, but polls and rhetoric give hard evidence recently that public opinion about single payer is trending Yes.

Bernie's always been ahead of the pack.
Real Music
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Jul, 2017 08:04 pm
@Lash,
Quote:
I acknowledge that I infuse some of my political opinions with my hopes, but polls and rhetoric give hard evidence recently that public opinion about single payer is trending Yes.

Bernie's always been ahead of the pack.
Yes, I agree that (single payer/Medicare for all), is trending. I also agree that Bernie Sanders is probably the biggest reason for this trend. I do hope that we have single-payer in the not too distant future. If it continues to trend I suspect that we will have single-payer. Legislators, elected officials, and voters all across the country must continue pushing for single-payer.
0 Replies
 
 

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