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Rising fascism in the US

 
 
Real Music
 
  2  
Wed 31 Jan, 2024 11:45 pm
@Lash,
Quote:
In my country, bureaucrats and lawmakers make things not work. They make it hard for people to make an honest living.


0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  3  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 03:15 am
I think Lash has been fed lines.

That cooperative healtcare system sounds so fake, as does the brainwashing charge.

We used to have a veggie coop here, a group of people got together and ran a greengrocers for a number of years.

It was successful, they all worked in the shop and split the profits.

It worked.

I can't see how a bunch of doctors working together and deciding their own prices is any different from a private medical practice.

Socialist Cooperative healthcaresounds good, but when you try to pin it down, it doesn't mean anything.
Lash
 
  -1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 04:23 am
@izzythepush,
I have my own ideas.
Inside the box thinking is trying to take the existing morass and hammer into into something that serves true healthcare and the people. In my country, we definitely can’t do that.
We need to utterly destroy this insurance scam—take the money we’re forced to pay for that and give it to healthcare professionals. We need no insurance and oodles of people who actually know how to diagnose health issues—which many of our doctors don’t.

They only know what Pharma says to prescribe.

Certainly, a worker owned coop can work—somebody smarter than me needs to figure out how.

Ownership should be local so they can be accountable to the local community they serve.

We need to utterly destroy the lordship of the rich over every aspect of our lives.

THAT is true Socialism to me.
It gives us ownership of what happens to our food, our schooling, the products we create and use…

And the ‘corporations’ are ours.
Lash
 
  -1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 04:25 am
@Lash,
We’re doing all the work anyway, we’re just being denied the profits and the decision-making power.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  3  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 05:00 am
@Lash,
It's just you say things that sound designed to shut people down and stop debate.

All your stuff about doctors and prescriptions is a result of your private healthcare system.

It doesn't happen with UHC, the solution exists.

You don't need pie in the sky untested ideas.

If you understood Socialism you wouldn't need to reference slave owning aristocrats.

That's who the Founding Fathers were, wealthy upper middle and aristocratic land owners who wanted more power and wealth for themselves.

Both Washington and Jefferson treated their slaves badly.

My reference is Kier Hardie, the first Labour MP.

He was working in the pit when he was ten years old.

If you want to know what real socialism is you need to go back to school.
Lash
 
  -1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 08:32 am
@izzythepush,

so·cial·ism
noun
a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
"we want a real democratic and pluralist left party—one which unites all those who believe in socialism"

I think my idea of socialism is truer to the actual definition. Your view of it seems to be closer to *what has become of it* via cronyism, mismanagement, and flabby growth.
hightor
 
  4  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 09:05 am
I've excerpted a few paragraphs from a very interesting article which looks at a number of books about Russia in the 2/22/24 issue of the New York Review of Books – you can register for free to read the whole thing.

Russian Exceptionalism

Gary Saul Morson wrote:
When Russian troops seized Crimea in 2014, German chancellor Angela Merkel, reporting on her conversation with Vladimir Putin, told President Obama that the Russian president seemed to dwell “in another world.” In a sense she was right: Russians and Westerners see the world quite differently, and our failure to understand Russia’s perspective made its actions seem surprising in 2014 and still more so when it invaded Ukraine in 2022.

How do Russians think about what their country is doing in Ukraine? If we are to grasp why so many have supported the attack on Georgia in 2008, the seizure of Crimea and eastern Ukraine in 2014, and the present war, we need to recognize that their fundamental assumptions differ from ours. Americans, for example, typically take for granted that the state exists to promote the welfare of its citizens, but Russians often believe the opposite. After all, individuals come and go, but Russia remains. And Russia is not just a nation; it is also an idea.

The “Russian idea,” throughout its many changes, has typically been messianic. It explains the world and gives life purpose; it shapes domestic and foreign policy and, more importantly, gives Russians a sense of their “Russianness”—which includes the ability to save the world. In his famous book The Russian Idea (1946), the philosopher Nikolai Berdyaev argued that Bolshevism owes as much to Russian messianism as to Marx. Medieval Russians, he and many others emphasize, often considered themselves the only true Christians. The Byzantines had, at the Council of Florence in 1439, recognized the pope to secure Western aid against the Turks, thereby betraying the Orthodox faith, which is supposedly why they succumbed to the Ottomans in 1453. From that point on, Moscow, the capital of the only independent Orthodox country until the nineteenth century, became the “Third Rome,” the heir to both Rome and Byzantium as the seat of Christendom. Russians were destined to save the world because, as the monk Philotheus explained, “a fourth Rome there will not be.”

Bolshevism inherited this messianic spirit. The Soviet Union would liberate the workers of the world and create the final utopia. It took Stalin to fuse Marxist internationalism with traditional Russian pride: internationalism would be the work of Russia, the savior nation. Stalin drew on a tradition of Russianness defined as a sort of super-nationality. Every nation manifests a special quality, but Russia, as Dostoevsky argued, displays the unique ability to absorb and perfectly express the qualities of all others. Because of this “receptivity” (ozyvchivost’), Dostoevsky concluded, Russians “may have a greater capacity than other nations to embrace the idea of the universal fellowship of humans, of brotherly love.” As proof, he adduces the Spaniards and Englishmen portrayed in Pushkin’s poems, who, he imagines, differ not a whit from actual Spaniards and Englishmen. I am reminded of the witticism that the linguist Roman Jakobson could speak Russian fluently in six languages.

After the fall of the USSR, ideologies competed to replace communism. Liberalism, considered foreign, was overwhelmed by various types of nationalism, one of which, Eurasianism, seems to have achieved the status of a semiofficial ideology. Putin uses Eurasianist phrases, the army’s general staff academy assigns a Eurasianist textbook, and popular culture has embraced its ideas and vocabulary. The better to build an empire, Eurasianism, like Stalinism, carries the banner of anti-imperialism, claiming to unite the world under Russian leadership in order to liberate it from Western cultural colonialism. It could be no other way. As Aleksandr Dugin, the movement’s current leader, explained, “Outside of empire, Russians lose their identity and disappear as a nation.”

Eurasianism began a little over a century ago. Unlike most of its rivals today, it has engaged some truly creative minds. Russian intellectual history, in fact, offers several movements in which powerful thinkers arrive at absurd and often repulsive conclusions. To understand them is to grasp how intelligent people anywhere can accept preposterous beliefs and claim “scientific” certainty for ideas counter to the very spirit of science.

Finding themselves in exile after the revolution and civil war, a group of Russian intellectuals, mostly from the nobility, regarded recent events as a catastrophe unrivaled in history. They experienced profound alienation from both their homeland and the European world in which they found themselves. In his essay “Two Worlds,” Pyotr Savitsky, the movement’s first leader, observed, “Russian exiles are like immigrants ‘from another world,’ like inhabitants of other planets.” Like earlier Russian émigrés, they found a home in the ideology they created.

“Two Worlds” is included in Foundations of Eurasianism, a collection of important texts from the movement, many of which appear in English for the first time. The Bolshevik coup, Savitsky and his fellow émigrés reasoned, simply accelerated the disastrous policy of Westernization pursued by Romanov tsars since Peter the Great. Russia must at last realize that it does not belong to European civilization. It belongs instead to the entirely separate world of “Eurasia.” Culturally, historically, and psychologically, Russians are a steppe people who resemble the Turkic and Mongolian (or “Turanian”) peoples of Central Asia. Far from being a calamity, the Mongol conquest of Russia (roughly 1240–1480) constituted a blessing precisely because it isolated Russia from Europe. It was in this period that the modern Russian character was formed, as a synthesis of the Slavic and the Turanian.

Absolutism, the only rule suitable for steppe peoples dispersed over a vast territory, came to Russia from Genghis Khan and his successors. When the Mongol Empire disintegrated, Russia became its heir. “And hovering over all Russia is the shade of the great Genghis Khan,” wrote the Eurasianist Nikolai Trubetskoy in The Legacy of Genghis Khan (1925). “Whether Russia wants it or not, she remains forever the guardian of this legacy.”

(...)

The book that catalyzed the Eurasianist movement, Trubetskoy’s Europe and Mankind (1920)—selected excerpts of which appear in the first volume of Foundations of Eurasianism—maintains “the equivalence and qualitative incommensurability of all cultures and all peoples of the globe…. There are no higher and lower cultures, there are only similar and dissimilar.” European arguments to the contrary are but “a means of deceiving people and justifying the imperialistic and colonial policies…of the ‘great powers’”—that is, all the great powers but Russia.

Remarkably enough, Trubetskoy’s relativism leads him to the conclusion that because cultures are equal, Europeans, who suppose otherwise, are worse than all others. All are equal, but some are less equal than others. The non-Western world must therefore unite against Europeans, because for relativists “the consequences of Europeanization” are “an absolute evil.” All countries must recognize that “there is only one true confrontation: that between the Romano-Germanics and all other peoples of the world, between Europe and Mankind.”

(...)

nyrb




izzythepush
 
  3  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 09:25 am
@Lash,
Your view of socialism is one that only exists in your own head and has no practical applications.

You spend most of your time attacking public sector workers.

I have never supported cronyism or mismanagement.

And you haven't given any concrete examples at all, just vague smear and innuendo.

Less goverment oversight gives more opportunities for corruption.

None of this is new, the far right have been doing it for ages.
izzythepush
 
  4  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 09:30 am
@izzythepush,
Denmark is one of the most Socialist countries in the developed world, and it's also one of the leastr corrupt.

Lash wants to overturn all that with pie in the sky, untested schemes which are wide open to corruption.

Local oversight only is what the slave owning states wanted.

It's not bloody rocket science.
hightor
 
  4  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 09:58 am
Lash condemns fascism and repression in the USA – but only when she can point a shaky finger at the Democrats and Biden. But it's fine for Republican governors to deny women reproductive rights, dismantle affirmative action, attack the teaching of Black history, conduct a full scale assault on Diversity, Equity and Inclusion initiatives, and undermine public health. We know she admires Putin's Russia – similarly, it's fine for critics of Putin to fall out of windows, die in jet crashes, or get poisoned in other countries. She won't say a word about the plight of LGBT activists in Russia. One wonders how protests which she claims to support, like the ones going on in France and Germany right now, would be handled in the Russian state.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 10:39 am
@hightor,
Additionally, her peculiar funny views of "socialism" and her unawarness about "co-op healthcare", how that works. Or not.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 10:45 am
Somalia is the most corrupt country in the world with a tiny civil service.
Lash
 
  -1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 11:51 am
@hightor,
You seem to see what you want to in my posts. I don’t know why you’re acting as if I prefer Russian government. It’s horrible in its own ways. Maybe it was a comment I made about Russia & China behaving comparatively better than the US UK Israel recently, but the bar is LOW. Everybody can beat genocide featuring dismembered and starved children.

Everything else, you’ve made out of whole cloth. Why not tell / write about something you know instead of trying to characterize me?

What form of government do you prefer and why?
Lash
 
  -1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 11:57 am
@izzythepush,
I guess European countries have enjoyed such a vastly different experience than lower middle class Americans that you can’t appreciate my ideas.

I feel like my country is in collapse and when people start rebuilding, I hope they think in terms of locally controlled cooperatives.
Real Music
 
  2  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 12:16 pm
1. I am grateful that we have the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency)
2. I am very happy that the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) exist.

Lash
 
  -1  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 12:17 pm
@izzythepush,
If it works for Denmark, they should keep it.
Localities can choose what works for them.
Our story isn’t yours.

Local control brings local accountability.

Lash
 
  -2  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 12:19 pm
@Real Music,
Real Music wrote:

1. I am grateful that we have the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency)
2. I am very happy that the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) exist.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAJlHxyapa0[/youtube]


THEY SUCK BALLS.
Ask East Palestine.
Ask Flint.
Ask Alaska.
Ask Lahaina.

None of our agencies work as they were designed.
0 Replies
 
Real Music
 
  2  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 12:25 pm
1. I am also grateful that we have the FAA (Federal Aviation Administration).
2. I am very happy that the FAA (Federal Aviation Administration) exist.

vikorr
 
  2  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 12:30 pm
@Lash,
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/7/8/uighurs-timeline
Quote:
China’s treatment of the largely Muslim ethnic group from Xinjiang has become a source of international tension with Beijing, which insists it is tackling extremism, accused of genocide.

...In the late summer of 2018, the United Nations revealed that at least a million Uighurs had been detained in “counter-extremism centres” in China’s Xinjiang province, thrusting the treatment of a once-obscure mostly Muslim ethnic group into the spotlight.

...secret documents have revealed a “deliberate strategy” to lock up ethnic minorities and erase their language and way of life.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Thu 1 Feb, 2024 12:31 pm
@Real Music,
THEY SUCK BALLS!

Doors exploding from planes because the FAA isn’t doing their jobs. I’m desperate to fly to my daughter and for her to fly to me, but flight is unsafe now thanks to shitty administration officials who either have no idea wtf they’re doing or who take bribes to say everything is good when IT’S NOT.

Do you have any idea what’s actually happening in this country?
 

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