I'll Never Vote for Hillary Clinton

It is funny how all those phantom twigs build up to a mountain of phantom twigs.

There were not 64 Sanders delegates that were refused seating at the convention. But don't worry, you bought into it. It seems you can't see the phantom forest for the phantom trees as well.

“If the Democratic Party is to be successful in November, it is imperative that all state parties treat our campaign supporters with fairness and the respect that they have earned. I am happy to say that has been the case at state conventions in Maine, Alaska, Colorado and Hawaii where good discussions were held and democratic decisions were reached. Unfortunately, that was not the case at the Nevada convention. At that convention the Democratic leadership used its power to prevent a fair and transparent process from taking place. Among other things:

* The chair of the convention announced that the convention rules passed on voice vote, when the vote was a clear no-vote. At the very least, the Chair should have allowed for a headcount.

* The chair allowed its Credentials Committee to en mass rule that 64 delegates were ineligible without offering an opportunity for 58 of them to be heard. That decision enabled the Clinton campaign to end up with a 30-vote majority.

* The chair refused to acknowledge any motions made from the floor or allow votes on them.

* The chair refused to accept any petitions for amendments to the rules that were properly submitted.

No problem Engineer, here are are a couple of links...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=435x0dQ5Lzg

http://heavy.com/news/2016/05/nevada-democratic-convention-what-happened-roberta-lange-delegates-election-fraud-videos-recount-denied/

A fair process by Roberta Lange and the people running the convention would have gone a long way to avoiding this debacle. I am not saying that the abusive behavior of the Sanders supporters is excusable, I am saying that things are not so "simple" when you step out of the echo chamber.

parados wrote:

It is funny how all those phantom twigs build up to a mountain of phantom twigs.

There were not 64 Sanders delegates that were refused seating at the convention. But don't worry, you bought into it. It seems you can't see the phantom forest for the phantom trees as well.

As I mentioned before, we can nit pick and argue about every detail. Here are some complaints set forth in Bernie Sanders' statement:

Quote:

“If the Democratic Party is to be successful in November, it is imperative that all state parties treat our campaign supporters with fairness and the respect that they have earned. I am happy to say that has been the case at state conventions in Maine, Alaska, Colorado and Hawaii where good discussions were held and democratic decisions were reached. Unfortunately, that was not the case at the Nevada convention. At that convention the Democratic leadership used its power to prevent a fair and transparent process from taking place. Among other things:

* The chair of the convention announced that the convention rules passed on voice vote, when the vote was a clear no-vote. At the very least, the Chair should have allowed for a headcount.

* The chair allowed its Credentials Committee to en mass rule that 64 delegates were ineligible without offering an opportunity for 58 of them to be heard. That decision enabled the Clinton campaign to end up with a 30-vote majority.

* The chair refused to acknowledge any motions made from the floor or allow votes on them.

* The chair refused to accept any petitions for amendments to the rules that were properly submitted.

Let's take those twigs and add them to all the twigs we've gathered since Bernie Sanders began his campaign ... and then add all those twigs to all the other twigs we've been gathering for the last three decades ...

that's a huge mountain of evidence that perhaps our political parties are corrupt ... and that democracy in the United States is an illusion ...

Those alleged "phantom trees" might come within your sight if you remove your blinders. But, there's a lot to be said about willful blindness. If you're satisfied with the illusion ... carry on. Enjoy your bliss.

The hardcore Bernie supporters are the epitome of the herd mentality, you can see that right?

Every single Hillary supporter I've seen on this board would vote for Sanders if he were the nominee.

...members of your herd...

...And to patronize....

Debra Law wrote:

parados wrote:

It is funny how all those phantom twigs build up to a mountain of phantom twigs.

There were not 64 Sanders delegates that were refused seating at the convention. But don't worry, you bought into it. It seems you can't see the phantom forest for the phantom trees as well.

As I mentioned before, we can nit pick and argue about every detail. Here are some complaints set forth in Bernie Sanders' statement:

Quote:

“If the Democratic Party is to be successful in November, it is imperative that all state parties treat our campaign supporters with fairness and the respect that they have earned. I am happy to say that has been the case at state conventions in Maine, Alaska, Colorado and Hawaii where good discussions were held and democratic decisions were reached. Unfortunately, that was not the case at the Nevada convention. At that convention the Democratic leadership used its power to prevent a fair and transparent process from taking place. Among other things:

* The chair of the convention announced that the convention rules passed on voice vote, when the vote was a clear no-vote. At the very least, the Chair should have allowed for a headcount.

* The chair allowed its Credentials Committee to en mass rule that 64 delegates were ineligible without offering an opportunity for 58 of them to be heard. That decision enabled the Clinton campaign to end up with a 30-vote majority.

* The chair refused to acknowledge any motions made from the floor or allow votes on them.

* The chair refused to accept any petitions for amendments to the rules that were properly submitted.

Let's take those twigs and add them to all the twigs we've gathered since Bernie Sanders began his campaign ... and then add all those twigs to all the other twigs we've been gathering for the last three decades ...

that's a huge mountain of evidence that perhaps our political parties are corrupt ... and that democracy in the United States is an illusion ...

Those alleged "phantom trees" might come within your sight if you remove your blinders. But, there's a lot to be said about willful blindness. If you're satisfied with the illusion ... carry on. Enjoy your bliss.

Let's say we all had the scales removed from our eyes, and we could 'see' as you do, Debra Law...
What in your estimation would be the next step?

snood wrote:

What in your estimation would be the next step?

We need a political system that actually works for the people. Let's start there.

Debra Law wrote:

We need a political system that actually works for the people. Let's start there.

that's a fine goal. one I think most people around the world hope for

what is the first practical step to achieving this goal in the United States?

Debra Law wrote:

...members of your herd...

...And to patronize....

The hardcore Bernie supporters are the epitome of the herd mentality, you can see that right?

Every single Hillary supporter I've seen on this board would vote for Sanders if he were the nominee.

I dislike Hillary Clinton. I think she represents a 20 year step backwards for the Democratic party

That being said. I am going to vote for Hillary Clinton because she is the Democratic nominee. After I complain a little, I am going to fall into line and accept this crappy situation I am in, just like you all want me to (and Hillary needs me to).

Debra Law wrote:

snood wrote:

What in your estimation would be the next step?

We need a political system that actually works for the people. Let's start there.

that's a fine goal. one I think most people around the world hope for

what is the first practical step to achieving this goal in the United States?

ehBeth wrote:

Debra Law wrote:

snood wrote:

What in your estimation would be the next step?

We need a political system that actually works for the people. Let's start there.

that's a fine goal. one I think most people around the world hope for

what is the first practical step to achieving this goal in the United States?

Rejection of the status quo, hard work and dedication. That's the first practical step.

For instance, hanging your hat on the "closed primary" tree while ignoring the overall political party purpose for "closed primaries" is the forest you're ignoring.