40
   

I'll Never Vote for Hillary Clinton

 
 
DrewDad
 
  4  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 02:18 pm
@Robert Gentel,
Best analysis I've seen: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/mapping-the-changing-face-of-the-lone-star-state/

Quote:
in 2012, 63 percent of votes came from the 14 most populous counties in Texas; the other 240 counties account for just 37 percent.


Quote:
So, the most densely populated areas in Texas are increasingly diverse, Democratic and relevant, but that’s only part of the story. They’re only kind of blue, and their relevance remains hindered by a general lack of electoral engagement that is unmatched in their surroundings. Assuming rural Texas remains staunchly red, Democratic candidates won’t win Texas until they win over suburban voters. Texas is red.


So, I don't see it changing in 2016, or even 2020, but change is coming.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 03:23 pm
@DrewDad,
They both lie.
Quote:
The Bernie Sanders campaign misappropriates the credibility of two New Hampshire newspapers in a new TV ad that boasts of his endorsements for the Democratic presidential nomination.
The ad, titled “Endorsed,” leaves the misleading impression that the Nashua Telegraph and the Valley News endorsed him. They did not.
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 03:35 pm
@DrewDad,
Thanks for that. Ultimately I think this may be one of the cases of us interpreting the same data with different degrees of positivity.

I definitely see opportunity for the Democrats to win Texas and a trend of Republicans losing ground (that they will have to evolve to reverse) but overall am not bullish on a blue Texas.

I think it's more likely that the Republican party modernizes to staunch the bleeding than I do that the Democrats take Texas in my lifetime, but stranger things can happen and I definitely agree with some of the analysis of Republican strongholds being weakened.
revelette2
 
  3  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 03:38 pm
@RABEL222,
Not to nickpick and get into other people's arguments (bad habit of mine, maybe it comes from being a wife/mother/grandmother?) Anyway, from what I have gathered from ossobucco is she will vote for Bernie in the primary and if he loses to Hillary, she will vote Hillary. Perhaps your lectures are misdirected.

I understand your legitimate point about the direction of the highest court in the land not being more conservative which it will be if Trump (God forbid) becomes elected or any other republican. Call it fear mongering or facing reality, same thing.
DrewDad
 
  2  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 03:43 pm
@Robert Gentel,
Robert Gentel wrote:

Thanks for that. Ultimately I think this may be one of the cases of us interpreting the same data with different degrees of positivity.

I definitely see opportunity for the Democrats to win Texas and a trend of Republicans losing ground (that they will have to evolve to reverse) but overall am not bullish on a blue Texas.

I think it's more likely that the Republican party modernizes to staunch the bleeding than I do that the Democrats take Texas in my lifetime, but stranger things can happen and I definitely agree with some of the analysis of Republican strongholds being weakened.

Either outcome is desirable from my standpoint.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  2  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 03:45 pm
@revelette2,
More confusing, even to me, is that I have been slightly moving to Hillary C in the primary the last week or two, and now may read something (linked on which thread, well, never mind, I'll find it) that may put me back firmly to Bernie first. Anyway, I've been saying I'll primary for Bernie and then vote for the dem nominee for several months now. Thanks for noticing, not meaning that sarcastically - these thread pages pass quickly.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Thu 18 Feb, 2016 06:17 pm
@DrewDad,
I appreciate the support. I do hope it's sincere. My conscience leads me to vote for the Indie or Green party candidate if Bernie isn't the nominee of the Ds.

revelette2
 
  1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 10:22 am
@Lash,
The only real candidate of the green party is (I googled it) is Jill Stein. 2016

Quote:
Green Party Presidential Candidate
Physician, Reformer, Environmental Activist
2016 Green Party Presidential Candidate Jill Stein

Jill Stein

Jill Stein is no stranger to national politics. As the Green Party nominee in 2012, she understands the rigors of a national campaign. Stein is a fierce advocate for the environment and believes that investments in green issues can propel the American people and economy forward.


Here is a list of the Independents presidential 2016 potential candidates.

In my opinion other than Bloomberg, voting for any of those unknowns has the effect of giving your vote to someone who definitely does not hold the same views as Sanders. If Hillary looks like she will get it, doubt Bloomberg would run against her.
source

Lash
 
  1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 10:45 am
@revelette2,
I'd already researched Stein, and her policies are quite close to Bernie's.
http://www.jill2016.com/plan
If she's on the general ballot and he's not, I can place this vote in good conscience.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  2  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 10:50 am
@joefromchicago,
joefromchicago wrote:

DrewDad wrote:
I concur. Which is why I want to understand Edgar, since he's the one that opened with the salvo "I'll never vote for Hillary."

Confused

Yes. I am joefromchicago.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  2  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 10:56 am
All I can say is, if you want a Republican president why not vote for Cruz or Bush? If you want something more, Sanders stands alone.
revelette2
 
  2  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 11:34 am
@edgarblythe,
Right, it seems all you can say. I'll vote for Sanders if Hillary looses. Hillary is miles apart from Cruz or Bush and anyone who says otherwise is engaging hyperbolic language with no truth to it.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 12:56 pm
http://www.ibtimes.com/hillary-clinton-emails-secret-negotiations-new-york-times-trade-bill-lobbying-2315809

Hillary gets an in your face bust. Just a few more lies confirmed.

engineer
 
  5  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 01:21 pm
@Lash,
Wow, read the article and it looks like the State Department was ... doing exactly what the State Department is supposed to do. They were working with the Times to make sure the Times didn't foul up a hostage situation with a premature article. The were lobbying the Senate on trade bills they were negotiating. Exactly what lies do you think this shows?
DrewDad
 
  2  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 01:22 pm
@edgarblythe,
edgarblythe wrote:

All I can say is, if you want a Republican president why not vote for Cruz or Bush? If you want something more, Sanders stands alone.

Which is still not addressing the question.

What's your play if Sanders doesn't get the nomination? Stay home? Vote third party? Vote Republican? Hold your nose and vote for Hillary?

I get that you don't like Hillary Clinton. Might it be that you dislike the Republican party nominee even more?
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 01:26 pm
@DrewDad,
Oh. I said somewhere on a2k that Jill Stein is my second choice.
DrewDad
 
  2  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 01:37 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:
In the primary, our votes definitely count, especially since there are only two Democrats seeking the nomination. There will be a winner, and the delegates will be sent to the Democratic National Convention.

An update on this. I thought the delegates for the convention were winner-take-all, but they are assigned proportionally, as long as the candidate receives 15% of the vote.

https://ballotpedia.org/Presidential_election_in_Texas,_2016
Quote:
Texas is expected to have 252 delegates at the 2016 Democratic National Convention. Of this total, 222 will be "pledged delegates." Pledged delegates will be allocated to a candidate in proportion to the votes he or she receives in the state's primary. A candidate will be eligible to receive a share of the state's pledged delegates if he or she wins at least 15 percent of the votes cast in the primary. There are three types of pledged Democratic delegates: congressional district delegates, at-large delegates, and party leaders and elected officials (PLEOs). Congressional district delegates are allocated proportionally based on the primary results in a given district. At-large and PLEO delegates are allocated proportionally based on statewide primary results.[3]

Example: Assume that there are three presidential candidates. In District 1, Candidate A won 60 percent of the vote, Candidate B won 22 percent and Candidate C won 18 percent. Approximately 60 percent of the pledged delegates allocated to District 1 would be bound to support Candidate A at the national convention. Approximately 22 percent of the delegates would be pledged to support Candidate B, and 18 percent would be pledged to support Candidate C.

Thirty party leaders and elected officials will serve as unpledged delegates. These delegates are not required to adhere to the results of the state primary.[3]
0 Replies
 
Debra Law
 
  -1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 03:03 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:

Fear mongering is getting to overused to the point it has lost it's meaning. Snood has made a legitimate point that talk has a way of generating trends or thinking of other people. Not all states are states where votes don't matter. I am a democrat, I will support any democrat over a republican because I believe in the democrat platform and I do not believe in the republican platform, for that reason alone, no matter who gets it in the democrat ticket, I will vote for him or her. I will vote for Hillary in the primary because I believe she will be better president than Bernie who I believe is too one subject to be an effective president. I also believe any president right now will continue to be involved in conflicts overseas regardless of what they say right now because the world in general is in a terrible time. I wish the Arab spring of which Obama supported would have been more successful than it turned out to be. But it wasn't and we are dealing with some of that failure now plus the failure of the Iraq war plus problems with Russia and so forth. These problems will not go away with putting our heads in the sands and just ignoring them and I believe Hillary is better placed to deal with it. The rest to me is rhetoric that sound good. Moreover, on domestic issues, Hillary and Sanders are not far apart despite her ties to "big money." If like people say Hillary changes with the poles, that in itself is not a bad thing if the blacklivesmatters becomes more powerful, perhaps it would influence the unjust justice system of whoever ends up being elected. I think either one of them would be about the same despite Hillary's ties to private prisons.

I think the animosity comes from fervent Bernie supporters if the rest of the electric is anything like these threads.


Fear mongering is still fear mongering, regardless of whether calling something what it actually is somehow loses its efficacy. I understand that all left-leaning people are expected to support the Democrat party candidate no matter who that candidate may be. And perhaps that expectation would have merit if the Democrat platform was more than just a fairy tale. However, the Democrat platform is just as much a fairy tale as the Republican platform. Adults shouldn't believe in fairy tales because doing so makes us no better than sheeple who willingly follow dear leader to the slaughterhouse.

Hillary, along with other established members of our political parties, will always do what is best for them and their corporate sponsors. When will they truly start acting in the best interests of the people?

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 03:11 pm
@Debra Law,
Good question. If history is any indication, their promises are fiction. What have they acclomplished that have benefited the American people vs Wall Street.
Anyone?
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Sat 20 Feb, 2016 03:33 pm
Clinton Nevada dirty tricks
http://usuncut.com/politics/clintons-campaign-just-got-busted-impersonating-union-nurses-in-nevada/
 

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