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Far-left liars endanger us all

 
 
JustWonders
 
  1  
Reply Fri 30 Jul, 2004 10:07 pm
Quote:
No, people are demanding that everyone have the same rights in society without regard to your personally held prejudices against them.


Some of the people. Not all of the people, at least not as it relates to gay marriage. Polls show 62% are against gay marriage.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 30 Jul, 2004 10:18 pm
Without a discussion of relative merits of polls or the fear-mongering of politicians and preachers, ask yourself what the polls would have said in 1954. Or in 1894; fifty years ago, i'd warrant that more than half the population if "polled" would have opposed abortion. That is not true today. This bit of hate- and fear-mongering will not last either. This too, shall pass.
0 Replies
 
JustWonders
 
  1  
Reply Fri 30 Jul, 2004 10:24 pm
Setanta wrote:
Without a discussion of relative merits of polls or the fear-mongering of politicians and preachers, ask yourself what the polls would have said in 1954. Or in 1894; fifty years ago, i'd warrant that more than half the population if "polled" would have opposed abortion. That is not true today. This bit of hate- and fear-mongering will not last either. This too, shall pass.


Just barely.

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/poll010702.html
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 30 Jul, 2004 10:39 pm
You just love those numbers, don't ya, Boss? It really helps to have partners in crime when you're bent on interferring in the lives of others, doesn't it.

As Anatole France said: Just because 50,000 men believe a wrong thing, it is till a wrong thing.
0 Replies
 
mesquite
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 12:02 am
Baldimo wrote:
The bible says that marriage shall be between a man and a woman and doesn't state anything else.

The bible says a lot of stuff, a lot of really nasty stuff. I wouldn't even let my kids read it until they were 17. How about all that killin' and incest and stuff not to eat ? Do you take to heart all of it or only the parts that fit your own bigoted views?
0 Replies
 
JustWonders
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 07:10 am
Setanta wrote:
You just love those numbers, don't ya, Boss? It really helps to have partners in crime when you're bent on interferring in the lives of others, doesn't it.

As Anatole France said: Just because 50,000 men believe a wrong thing, it is till a wrong thing.


Setana - I have only recently discovered A2K , and although I've felt compelled to post on occasion, it's generally to state a fact or point out an opposite, yet valid, point of view. It's interesting to me that even when pointing out a simple fact, many here find it necessary to reply with personal comments towards the poster in support of their own viewpoints. I replied to your "sweeping generality" feeling somewhat secure that you were one of the few that avoid this type of discourse. I was wrong.

I've no doubts from reading through many of your posts that you are intellectually superior to me. However, the fact that a person is intelligent does not automatically make him or her superior to those who are less intelligent.

I see now that you're just another of the really smart (albeit socially clueless) people who have found their niche on A2K. I get the impression you think it would be much better if we'd all shut up and listen to you and let you help us to see the error of our idiotic ways.

And you call me Boss? Bite me Smile
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 07:33 am
JustWonders wrote:

Setana - I have only recently discovered A2K , and although I've felt compelled to post on occasion, it's generally to state a fact or point out an opposite, yet valid, point of view. It's interesting to me that even when pointing out a simple fact, many here find it necessary to reply with personal comments towards the poster in support of their own viewpoints. I replied to your "sweeping generality" feeling somewhat secure that you were one of the few that avoid this type of discourse. I was wrong.


There is no personal observation about you implicit in that unless you are indeed one of those who considers it proper to interfer in the rights of others. This is definitely a "if the shoe fits" kind of thing, so if you are offended, ask yourself from what that stems. When i "get my back up" i do, intentionally, through out condemnations of classes of intolerant people--i am always interested to note when people respond to such generalities by taking personal offense. It says a lot about the person taking offense.

Quote:
I've no doubts from reading through many of your posts that you are intellectually superior to me. However, the fact that a person is intelligent does not automatically make him or her superior to those who are less intelligent.


This is a completely unwarranted assumption on your part. I have no opinion on the subject of your intelligence, and have no interest in the subject either, for that matter. I've not seen enough of what you write to form an opinion, and wouldn't be likely to do so in any event. When people are plainly inarticulate, wantonly misspell or misuse words, and otherwise display a lack of command of the language, i will take note of that. As it happens, i've not seen that in the few posts of yours which i have read. See above the "shoe fits" comment.

I do not waste a moment of life in the consideration of the relative "superiority" of persons. However, i do understand the people are frequently given to finding reasons to take offense. Far be it from me to deprive you of your entertainment

Quote:
I see now that you're just another of the really smart (albeit socially clueless) people who have found their niche on A2K. I get the impression you think it would be much better if we'd all shut up and listen to you and let you help us to see the error of our idiotic ways.[/qtuote]

I've not suggested to anyone anything about a relative statement of my intelligence. As for socially clueless, it appears that you are not immune from the impulse you impute to me of insulting others when challenged on your ideas. Your impressions are a subject of not the least interest to me, because it is evidence of your having chosen to see something in what i write for which you don't have direct evidence; although, of course, such a statement gives you what you consider adequate reason for the follow:

And you call me Boss? Bite me Smile[/quote]

Boss is an appellation which i apply without distinction, and which ought not to be taken as indicative of any perceived relationship. I wonder if you see the irony in leveling charges against me for having made personal remarks, and then ending your petulant tirade with this? Perhaps. Either way, it is immaterial to me.

When i was born, black people and white people were legally prohibited from marrying one another in the majority of states. Little black children and little white children did not attend the same schools, until the Supremes, in Brown v. Board of Education, articulated the principle that separate is not equal. Women were formally and blantantly excluded from many organizations, and were actively excluded from many professions, and from law schools and medical schools. In many states then, an allegation of adultery was considered grounds for justifiable homicide if a man shot his wife. In Eisenhower's America, i don't doubt that many people would have responded that god was in his heaven and all was right with the world. You have cited a statistic that 62% of the population oppose gay marriage--i would point out to you that absent a description of the sample polled, and the full text of the questions asked, this is a meaningless figure. But i don't dispute that the majority of people oppose gay marriage; i will point out that polls don't poll children, and in ten or fifteen years, the majority of adults may well have an entirely different opinion. When i pointed out that the majority of the population now favors a woman's right to an abortion, your reply is "just barely." This may change with time as well, and in either direction. Your "just barely" reply, however, is freighted with an implication that there is no significance, or little significance to the circumstance. The point i was making is that people's attitudes change with time--and attitudes toward abortion are a striking example. As the elderly die off, and the youthful become adults, social attitudes change, and the net effect is one in a direction of more tolerance.

If you are not one of those bent on interferring in the lives of others, then you have no reason to take offense at what i wrote. If you are, then i'm glad to have offended you. Have a nice life.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 07:39 am
JustWonders wrote:
I see now that you're just another of the really smart (albeit socially clueless) people who have found their niche on A2K. I get the impression you think it would be much better if we'd all shut up and listen to you and let you help us to see the error of our idiotic ways.

And you call me Boss? Bite me Smile

Now who's being socially clueless here ... ? :wink:

<sighs> so many people with long toes ...
0 Replies
 
swolf
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 07:56 am
Setanta wrote:


When i was born, black people and white people were legally prohibited from marrying one another in the majority of states. Little black children and little white children did not attend the same schools


I remember that as well. And then, in 1964, congress passed a civil rights act containing pretty much everything Martin Luther King Jr. had ever asked for and, for all intents and purposes, racism was dead and buried in America. That, however, was too good for the fricking demmunist party; they had to re-invent it, as we all know.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 08:03 am
nimh wrote:
<sighs> so many people with long toes ...


Baldimo accused me of dancing . . . with all the long toes in evidence, i'd love to ! ! !
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blueveinedthrobber
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 09:25 am
nimh wrote:
[<sighs> so many people with long toes ...


Please do not insult a delightful race of beings like Hobbits this way.....
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blueveinedthrobber
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 09:28 am
Big Dogs and Big Bears....top 'o the food chain.....
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timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 Jul, 2004 09:55 am
I got muh steel-toed, double-soled, waterproof, hobnailed, log-rollin' boots right here ... anybody wanna dance? Mr. Green

Akshully, I figure the real poblem is idiologically bound, nonthinking, stereotyping, label-mongering, lock-step sheeple on both sides of the fence; neither has any desire to enter into dialog or to explore and exchange ideas, but rather both sides are tolerant only of their own beliefs, determined to see only themselves vindicated and their opponents vanquished. That's pretty much a no-win situation for all.

Idiocy is not exclusive to any idiology.
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Sun 1 Aug, 2004 05:18 pm
mesquite wrote:
Baldimo wrote:
The bible says that marriage shall be between a man and a woman and doesn't state anything else.

The bible says a lot of stuff, a lot of really nasty stuff. I wouldn't even let my kids read it until they were 17. How about all that killin' and incest and stuff not to eat ? Do you take to heart all of it or only the parts that fit your own bigoted views?


To say I'm bigoted is a wrong assumption on your part. I don't think I'm better then a gay person, I just don't think we should change laws to fit someone's personal choices.

Do you smoke? Well I do and there are tons of bigots around. I can't smoke where I want to and people look down on those who do, are you one of those people? If so that would make you a bigot.
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Sun 1 Aug, 2004 06:43 pm
My personal take is that there are absolute Human Rights ... period. To endorse specific gay rights or women's rights or ethnic rights or any other subset of rights does nothing but dimish, even invalidate, the entire concept of Human Rights. It should be noted too that rights entail obligations ... among which chief is the obligation to respect the rights of others.

Oh, yeah ... and:

http://www.ohs.org/exhibitions/Treasures_of_Oregon/images/exhibit_boots.jpg
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sun 1 Aug, 2004 09:41 pm
Amen Timber. The inalienable right envisioned by the Constitutional founders were those things that require nothing of anyone else other than their non interference. If what Citizen A wants requires Citizen B to provide or change or give up something, then Citizen B has a vested interest in determining what s/he will provide or change or give up.

Once a law has been made equitable for all people whether gay or straight or male or female and all are subject to the same conditions and/or requirements and/or conditions of that law, to add a layer of X-rights for anybody has the effect of making the law inequitable. Those for whom the law will be made inequitable should have at least as much say as those who want the change.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 1 Aug, 2004 11:05 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
Those for whom the law will be made inequitable should have at least as much say as those who want the change.


That's correct, Foxfyre.

And, indeed, I always like parliamentary work best, when there are hearings about changes re terrorism laws, and all those terrorists give their statements in the holy halls, discuss the pro and contra with the lawmakers ... ... :wink:
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 2 Aug, 2004 03:45 am
Hmm, interesting Walter. But what special rights is the German parliament giving to terrorists these days? Smile
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 2 Aug, 2004 06:45 am
They usually don't come to parliamentary hearings nor are they invited.
(Ah, we are not democratic, you want to say?)
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 2 Aug, 2004 08:14 am
Foxfyre wrote:
Amen Timber. The inalienable right envisioned by the Constitutional founders were those things that require nothing of anyone else other than their non interference. If what Citizen A wants requires Citizen B to provide or change or give up something, then Citizen B has a vested interest in determining what s/he will provide or change or give up.


You have been asked before to indicate what it is that you or anyone else are "giving up" if homosexuals are accorded the right, to which they are already due, to enter into a contract having the full force of the same contract when entered into by a heterosexual couple. You have failed to provide any reasonable statement of what you are giving up.

Quote:
Once a law has been made equitable for all people whether gay or straight or male or female and all are subject to the same conditions and/or requirements and/or conditions of that law, to add a layer of X-rights for anybody has the effect of making the law inequitable. Those for whom the law will be made inequitable should have at least as much say as those who want the change.


This bit of nonsense presumes that homosexual people have all the rights of heterosexual people, and are demanding special consideration. They are not; they are simply demanding access to the same contractual rights and obligations now exclusively enjoyed by heterosexual couples. By your standards, as heterosexual couples can marry, and enjoy privileges and immunities by Federal statute as a result, and homosexual couples are denied those privileges and immunities--as i said, by your standards, such laws are inequitable.

You're obliged to do some hilarious mental contortions to make this seem as though the homosexual were demanding speical treatement--i'm not surprised, however, that you seem to think that position is justified.
0 Replies
 
 

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