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U.S. General Suspended Over Iraqi Prisoner Abuse

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 06:27 am
Disgusting as this is, it doesn't help a situation in which the United States is already viewed very badly.

Not only from a public relations perspective, it is yet another image for the world to add to the pictures of civilians being killed in Fallujah.


The latest from the UK:

Quote:
Disgust over Iraq torture photos
Armed Forces Minister Adam Ingram has said if pictures of British soldiers torturing an Iraqi prisoner are genuine then they are "appalling".
Military police had to be given time to investigate photos which appear to show a soldier using violence and urinating on a captive, he told the BBC.

"Such wrongdoing if proven besmirches the good name of the... armed forces. We will not tolerate that," he said.

The photographs in the Daily Mirror have also been condemned by Number 10.

Earlier pictures showing American troops humiliating Iraqi prisoners, with a hooded and naked prisoner standing on a box with wires attached to his genitals, also generated outrage.

US President George W Bush vowed that those responsible would be "taken care of".


There is no place in our regiment for individuals capable of such appalling and sickening behaviour
Queen's Lancashire Regiment

Mr Ingram said there was no "culture of abuse" in the British Army despite the fact that five separate inquiries into maltreatment are under way.
He admitted: "If these allegations are true, they are appalling, they are despicable and there can be no justification for them at all."

And he said the Royal Military Police's "full intensity" inquiry would "not leave any stone unturned" in the investigation into the latest photos.

Those who are opposed to the coalition's occupation of Iraq would employ "full exploitation of these incidents", Mr Ingram said.

Unnamed captive

The Mirror says the pictures were handed over by British soldiers from the Queen's Lancashire Regiment who claimed a rogue element in the British army was responsible for abusing prisoners and civilians.

Speaking on condition of anonymity, the soldiers told the paper no charges were brought against the unnamed captive.

They allege that during his eight-hour ordeal he was threatened with execution, his jaw broken and his teeth smashed.


In Iraq we're in a nosedive - things are happening which were entirely predictable and predicted
Lord Hurd
Former foreign secretary


After being beaten and urinated on, he was driven away and dumped from the back of a moving vehicle, the soldiers claimed, unaware if he was dead.
The reason for making the photos public was, they said, to show why the US-UK coalition was encountering such fierce resistance in Iraq.

One told the paper: "We are not helping ourselves out there. We are never going to get them on our side. We are fighting a losing war."

Army spokesman Roger Goodwin, on behalf of the Queen's Lancashire Regiment, said there was "clearly some form of link to the regiment".

"But the precise form of that link, including whether the soldiers involved in the alleged atrocities were members of the QLR, needs to be established.

He added: "There is no place in our regiment for individuals capable of such appalling and sickening behaviour.

"The sooner they are exposed and ejected from the regiment, the better."


The regimental secretary, retired Lt Col John Downham, said: " We are furious that these people, whoever they turn out to be, have already besmirched our hard-earned good name and let down the many hundreds of QLR soldiers whose outstandingly successful tour in Basra was recognised by no fewer than 21 honours and awards."

Humiliating scenes

In a press conference, Sir Mike Jackson, Chief of General Staff, said: "If proven, the perpetrators are not fit to wear the Queen's uniform and they have besmirched the Army's good name and conduct."

Ahmed al-Sheik, editor-in-chief of Arab TV news channel, said the photographs would outrage Arabs around the world.

"These scenes are humiliating not only to the Iraqis, but to every Arab citizen around the world," he told BBC Two's Newsnight.

Meanwhile former foreign secretary Lord Hurd said the situation in Iraq was in danger of spiralling out of control.

"In Iraq we're in a nosedive. Things are happening which were entirely predictable and predicted.

"An army of liberation, particularly a British/American one, turns within hours into an army of occupation."

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/uk_news/3675723.stm


Daily Mirror frontpage today:

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/2/6/000134E8-60F9-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
0 Replies
 
Wilso
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 07:30 am
We're the good guys???
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 08:46 am
Just found another pic, showing a second site from the Daily Mirror:

http://www.spiegel.de/img/0,1020,350667,00.jpg
0 Replies
 
blueveinedthrobber
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 08:52 am
When the rest of the world turns against us because of the self inflicted karma being heaped on the general public by a few and somebody blasts one of my children to shreds I can be content in knowing that my child died a horrible death to combat the evildoers.That is a great comfort to me, as I'm sure it is to others. Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
infowarrior
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 09:03 am
I fear what George W. Bush, the neocons, and PNAC crowd have done in Iraq, with their unquenchable thirst for oil and empire, is lay the ground work for WWIII.

The Arab/Islamic world pitted against the Christian world. The USA has grossly undestimated the rage of the 22 Arab nations of the Middle East directed at America.

While many of these nations are poor, quite a few are wealthy thanks to oil, and with the recent intelligence discovery that Iran has nuclear capabilities at hand, coupled with the al Qaida network focused on a single nemesis (the USA), I worry Iraq war will only grew larger, sweeping into its vortex other Arab nations like Iran, Syria, the UAE, and eventually Saudi Arabia, all determined to destroy America.

Thank George! We couldn't have done it without you.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 09:38 am
No offense walter hintler, but I wish you wouldn't keep showing those pictures.

I hope that there isn't a WWW3, but if there is I guess all we can do is hope we survive and those of us who believe in it, pray.

I hope that we are making too much of the Iraq deal, but I have a horrible feeling we are not.
0 Replies
 
infowarrior
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 09:45 am
revel:

I respectfully disagree.

I think these pictures should be shown on every newspaper and on every news program in the USA.

It's high time Americans stop being treated like little children incapable of knowing what the Bush government is doing not only in Iraq, but in the rest of the world as well.

After all, we're paying for it, and we will be paying for it in many ways for decades to come.
0 Replies
 
John Webb
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 09:45 am
Thank goodness the media have no photos of what has been going on for years at Camp X-ray. Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 05:25 pm
Rummy
CACI International and Titan Corporation


Quote:
A military report into the Abu Ghraib case - parts of which were made available to the Guardian - makes it clear that private contractors were supervising interrogations in the prison, which was notorious for torture and executions under Saddam Hussein.

One civilian contractor was accused of raping a young male prisoner but has not been charged because military law has no jurisdiction over him.

Hired guns from a wide array of private security firms are playing a central role in the US-led occupation of Iraq.

The killing of four private contractors in Falluja on March 31 led to the current siege of the city.

But this is the first time the privatisation of interrogation and intelligence-gathering has come to light. The investigation names two US contractors, CACI International Inc and the Titan Corporation, for their involvement in the functioning of Abu Ghraib.

Titan, based in San Diego, describes itself as a "a leading provider of comprehensive information and communications products, solutions and services for national security". It recently won a big contract for providing translation services to the US army, and its involvement in Abu Ghraib is believed to have been to provide translators.


*Rummy is responsible in this because he allowed these private contractors and the CIA to be in charge of the interogations. If he knew he is directly culpable andif he didn't know he is still accountable.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1206725,00.html
0 Replies
 
IronLionZion
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 05:47 pm
Re: U.S. General Suspended Over Iraqi Prisoner Abuse
infowarrior wrote:
The prison where the abuses are alleged to have taken place was a notorious torture centre during the Saddam Hussein era.


Ah, the sweet, sweet irony.
0 Replies
 
mporter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 06:02 pm
I agree totally with Walter Hinteler and I am disgusted. Those pictures show the disintegration of the American Army, its leaders and its leadership.
They show a dreadful parallel to the atrocities committed by the German people on the Jews in World War II.

No, perhaps not the entire German people but at least its Army, or more precisely, the fanatic Nazis in that Army.
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 May, 2004 10:49 pm
Accountabilty!
http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2004/04/30/briefingrumsfeld,0.jpg
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 12:01 am
If you read The Independent today, www.independent.co.uk, you will see that this latest atrocity was not an isolated incident.

At least seven civilians have died at various locations in Iraq while in the custody of British troops.

It took the photographs to get it on to the front pages of the newspapers, that's all.

I believe we have had snipers firing at civilians. Discipline and morale has evidently broken down when these things can happen.

McT
0 Replies
 
Peter S
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 12:26 am
I have always thought they are there fighting for human rights.
I am very disappointed.
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 01:01 am
Well, let's consider the Bush administration dictionary so far, shalll we?

Free=dead
Liberty=dead
Democracy=foreign totalitarian occupation
Human Rights=torture

What a splendid "coalition," eh?
0 Replies
 
satt fs
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 01:39 am
The New Yorker obtained a report (not meant for public release).

The New Yorker: FACT

Quote:
0 Replies
 
John Webb
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 03:36 am
The accused General has claimed that she and her staff are being blamed unfairly for the actions of military intelligence over which she had no knowledge, control or responsibility.

If true, it looks like she is being used as a patsy by those at the highest levels.
Twisted Evil
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 03:52 am
0 Replies
 
Wilso
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 04:31 am
I believe that the "just following orders" defence has been used before!
0 Replies
 
pistoff
 
  1  
Reply Sun 2 May, 2004 05:03 am
Yes
Anyone in the Military has a right to refuse "unlawful" orders. In fact I was taught that when I was in the Military. Another excuse by other violaters was that they weren't aware of the the Geneva Convention Rules. Bullcrap!!! Those are taught to everyone that goes into combat. Also, does one need to have memorized these to know that torture and humiliating prisoners is morally WRONG?
0 Replies
 
 

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