U.S. General Suspended Over Iraqi Prisoner Abuse

I do not believe that the people responsible for this atrocity are representative of our armed forces in the ME, but they need to be hung from the highest tree IMO.

I agree.

Along with the U.S. Marines who shot, sniper style, at ambulances carrying the wounded in Fallujah.

Do they have high trees in Iraq?

Prison System
The entire Prison system needs to be monitored by "real" independent monitors. The USA needs to turn over this system to Iraq and get out of the country. There is no rule of law and the setup for abuse is obvious. Merely, bringing a few people up on charges is not sufficient. The entire system must be changed. As long as the US is in charge of this system the perception will be that the USA are the oppressors of Iraqis.

No wonder Iraqis polled say overwhelmingly the USA has failed to make them feel safer in post-Saddam Iraq.

In fact, a majority now feel less safe.

Can anyone in a right mind blame them when the US military engages in torture tactics like the ones mentioned?

Photos
The question is how long would this abuse have gone on if no photos had been taken? The fact that photos were taken and sent out also speaks volumes about the people that took them and sent them out.

No matter what the excuses or "isolated events" spin, the perception of widespread abuse of Iraqi prisoners is reaching millions of Muslims. It's too late for spin.
________________________________________

IRAQ: VIOLANTE, GOVERNMENT MUST INTERVENE ON TORTURE OF IRAQIS

(AGI) - Rome, Italy, Apr. 30 -

"The Italian government has to formally ask the American government for explanations on what happened, the measures taken against those responsible for the torture of Iraqi prisoners," said Quercia party Chamber of Deputies group leader Luciano Violante. "This violence is comparable to that which the Saddam Hussein's regime inflicted on its prisoners and which place Italian soldiers and hostages at risk. The entire situation is shameful and doesn't mesh with civil and democratic life. Freedom of information in the United States has allowed the entire world to hear of these horrors. Now it's up to our country, which has a long history of humanity and civility and which has the third largest amount of soldiers in Iraq after the United States and Britain, to visibly and effectively - said Violante - to guarantee the respect for human rights in Iraq. On these issues, the government must quickly address the proper Chamber of Deputies and Senate in order to obtain decisions from their respective presidents". (AGI)

http://www.agi.it/english/news.pl?doc=200404301908-1253-RT1-CRO-0-NF11...


Iraq: Torture not isolated -- independent investigations vital
Related documents
Iraq: One year on the human rights situation remains dire
18/03/2004

Press release, 30/04/2004

There is a real crisis of leadership in Iraq -- with double standards and double speak on human rights, Amnesty International said today.

"The latest evidence of torture and ill-treatment emerging from Abu Ghraib prison will exacerbate an already fragile situation. The prison was notorious under Saddam Hussein -- it should not be allowed to become so again. Iraq has lived under the shadow of torture for far too long. The Coalition leadership must send a clear signal that torture will not be tolerated under any circumstances and that the Iraqi people can now live free of such brutal and degrading practices," Amnesty International said.

"There must be a fully independent, impartial and public investigation into all allegations of torture. Nothing less will suffice. If Iraq is to have a sustainable and peaceful future, human rights must be a central component of the way forward. The message must be sent loud and clear that those who abuse human rights will be held accountable.

"Our extensive research in Iraq suggests that this is not an isolated incident. It is not enough for the USA to react only once images have hit the television screens".

http://news.amnesty.org/mav/index/ENGMDE140172004

'The liberators are worse than the dictators'

By Paul Majendie

London - Photos purporting to show American soldiers abusing Iraqi prisoners drew international condemnation on Friday, with Arabs saying the United States campaign to win the hearts and minds of Iraqis was now a lost cause.

"This is the straw that broke the camel's back for America," said Abdel-Bari Atwan, editor of the Arab newspaper al Quds al Arabi. "The liberators are worse than the dictators."

"They have not just lost the hearts and minds of Iraqis but all the Third World and the Arab countries," he said.

'The liberators are worse than the dictators'
The CBS News programme 60 Minutes II on Wednesday aired photos taken at the Abu Ghraib prison last year apparently showing US troops abusing Iraqis held at what was once a notorious centre of torture and executions under ousted president Saddam Hussein.

The pictures showed US troops smiling, posing, laughing or giving the thumbs-up sign as naked, male Iraqi prisoners were stacked in a pyramid or positioned to simulate sex acts.

more
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?sf=2813&click_id=2813&art_id=qw10833494...

Here's what blogger Lt. Smash has to say on the subject:

I am glad it did come out, and she and her goons being investigated.

infowarrior, It's not only the Iraqis that are feeling unsafe; ask anybody around the world, and I bet they will also say they fear terrorism more today then one year ago. "Mission Accomplished" indeed!

Perhaps that was the mission, CI. Bush is banking on it keeping him in power.
This is sickening.
I've seen more than one story where troops from other nations say that some American troops can be brutal. Pretty sad.

I have to admit that I am surprised. I thought that it must be propaganda by someone against the coalition. I understand stress making you spontaneously do violent things, not excusing it, but understand it. However this seems to be something else entirely to me. This was a pattern that happened over time, wasn't it? They must be some kind of sickos. How did they get away with this. Also, how did the pictures get taken and would they have ever gotten caught without the pictures and if not why not?

Prisons bring out bad things in people. They need very firm control and constant oversight.

"Fear" is the most powerful weapon Bush has to offer and very little else.

Power
Having the power to invade other countries also brings bad things out in people.

And now there's more...

UK army probes alleged torture in Iraq

By Michael Holden

LONDON (Reuters) - A probe has been launched into allegations British soldiers tortured Iraqi prisoners, a day after similar revelations involving U.S. troops received widespread condemnation.

Britain's army chief General Sir Mike Jackson ordered an immediate inquiry after it emerged that the Daily Mirror in its Saturday editions was to publish photos of British soldiers abusing prisoners.

The paper told Reuters the images included one of a British soldier urinating on a crouching, hooded Iraqi.

"I am aware of the allegations which have been made today of abuse of prisoners by British soldiers in Iraq," Jackson said in a statement.

"The allegations are already under investigation. If proven not only is such appalling conduct clearly unlawful it clearly contravenes the British army's high standards.

"If proven the perpetrators are not fit to wear the queen's uniform. They have besmirched the good name of the army and its honour."

The British probe comes after U.S. President George W. Bush said he was "deeply disgusted" by photos released this week showing American troops abusing Iraqi prisoners held at the Abu Ghraib prison, once a notorious centre of torture and executions under ousted President Saddam Hussein.

The U.S. military has brought criminal charges against six soldiers relating to accusations of abuses from November and December 2003 on some 20 detainees, including indecent acts with another person, maltreatment, battery, dereliction of duty and aggravated assault.

Prime Minister Tony Blair, who had earlier strongly condemned the abuse involving U.S. soldiers, gave his backing to the army's investigation.

"The prime minister fully endorses both the statement by General Sir Michael Jackson and the action he is taking as well as the speed with which the army is acting," his spokesman said.

"The prime minister agrees that allegations of this nature are treated most seriously, but they should not be taken as a reflection of the general behaviour of coalition forces and the work they are doing with the Iraqi people."

Britain's forces in Iraq, concentrated in the south of the country around Basra, have previously been praised for their conduct towards the Iraqi people.

There have been previous inquiries into allegations of abuse against British soldiers in Iraq, but none have warranted such a high-profile response from authorities.

The human rights charity Amnesty International said it had warned U.S. and British authorities in Iraq that captives were being abused.

"We have talked to ex-prisoners, who say when they were taken into custody they were hooded and beaten, sometimes numerous times and subjected on some occasions to psychological torture and acts of sexual humiliation," Amnesty's Neil Durkin told Sky News.

"They (the provisional authority) simply have not acted on these reports. There is on the face of it a pattern."

Link

Since our armed forces are simply a reflection of their political leaders and since these are Bush, Rumsfeld, Chaney, Rice, Powell, and Blair, surely such behavior is only a natural consequence of allowing such dangerous creatures into positions of power?

I hate to condemn the entire armed forces to the actions committed by some of them. I do however condemn the authorities including the coalition leaders who have allowed that happen over a period of time without doing anything about. It is a disgrace and shameful both on the ones who have done those horrible things and the ones in charge who allowed it to happen.

The whole entire thing is a like a nightmare.

Ah, the Brits too, eh?
A long time ago, I read of a study that found that,
over time, many prison guards also become brutal to their prisoners, supposedly because of the complete power that they have over them. The study included using normal people in a play-acting scenario, acting as guards, with their peers as the prisoners, with similar results.
Apparently, too much power, over time, can lead some to this kind of behavior. Perhaps the "some" are the same kind of people who turn out to be abusive parents? I don't believe that this kind of control over other human beings can bring out the worst in everybody, because I know that I, myself, could never humiliate or brutalize anybody like that, under any circumstances. Behavior like that is just not in my genetic makeup. I don't recall if the study made any conclusions regarding prevention of this occurence. I think all involved should face very severe consequences. Acts like those are just as bad as violent rape or torture, to me, despite the smiling, cherubic face of the sick bitch in the photos. I would be so ashamed of her if I were her mother. I don't see any redemption for behavior like that. Those people are scum.

Americans, various Iraqis, and the rest of the world are unhappy with this.

Being violent is one thing, it is horrible and not to be condoned. But this disgraceful sexual indecent stuff is just too horrible and shameful for words. I am ashamed to be associated (by nationality or being from a country that is the head of the coalition) with the ones who committed this and feel like apologizing.