Is There Any Chance Christie Did NOT Know About the Dirty Tricks?

The likelihood that given the kind of leader he happen to be that his closest advisers would take such actions without him knowing about it seem very small on it face.

Or when once the **** did hit the fan and he ask what the hell was going on not one of them would had told him.

I can barely abide the governor of our state, FM...he is a pompous, arrogant, bullying miscreant who will throw the less fortunate under the bus just as fast as the most conservative politicians in our country.

But am NOT automatically assuming he was not telling the truth.

I do think we must acknowledge that he MAY HAVE known all along...and MAY BE lying.

I do think we ought to acknowledge that if underlings of his pulled this kind of stunt without him knowing...they must have thought it was the kind of thing that would please him.

We must acknowledge that "plausible deniability" often plays a huge part in these kinds of things.

But you are absolutely correct that none of us ought to automatically assume he was not telling the truth.

We are not jury members or a NJ state legislator hearing an impeachment process so we have no duty not to used a normal level of commonsense and assume that the good governor did not have his staff act in such a manner without him knowing about it.

Im smiling at your admission.

I agree with Frank. I think it's highly unlikely he didn't know, though possible, but if he somehow didn't, that's not so good either. Somewhere recently I saw a headline about the immense costs involved, not to mention the great aggravation and danger potential to drivers. He would at least have hired people who thought this kind of trick was a terrific idea.

Politicians do have a track record. And, it is not necessarily an assumption. It may be the most probable explanation. Either his people did the dastardly deed, thinking he would appreciate it, or they did it hoping he wouldn't find out. The first seems more reasonable to me. Why would they do it on their own, against his wishes?

This is true and we are not impeaching him nor sending him to prison. We are just holding him accountable. Forming an opinion about his leadership.

I believe him when he says he didn't know about it. I could be wrong, but for now there is no real evidence to suggest he is lying.

I am disappointed that it appears that his aides weren't certain that he would never tolerate a deed like this, and therefore never attempt it, but maybe they were and just thought they would never be found out. Irrespective of his reaction to the stunt, they were, obviously, stupidly arrogant enough to think they would never never be found out. His reaction is only part of the trouble they are in.

How do people in positions of power develop this sort of disconnection with reality? Even if one assumes that they were just doing something they thought was in keeping with the bullying ways of their boss, they had to know (if they gave it one minute of serious thought) that revelation of their misdeeds could seriously damage the political aspirations of their boss.

How did anyone at the IRS not only think it was OK to target conservative groups but that someone up the chain would be pleased with their actions?

How did the president of the United States come to think that it would be OK to blatantly lie to the American people about keeping their plans and doctors...period?

These people are the government.

You are right. Theres no glory in being incompetent over being the thug who ruled this fiasco.
Either way he has to answer (but for different areas of concern)

Since it was in the late summer it was thought of as a mere inconvenience rather than the deal it would ultimately grow to become.

I think it has pretty much been established that the IRS DID NOT just target conservative groups...but many kinds of groups.

You had a terrific post going here...but this sentence should not have been included.

So they just misjudged the result? Hardly justification.

then too government has gotten pretty cavalier about shutting down all or parts of major roads. It is now common to shut down one side of the interstate for entire 20 mile chunks for many months for rebuilding instead of five mile chunks because it saves a few bucks, a few years ago there was the closing of an interstate for 5 hours so the police could find and mark the locations all of the shell casings from a two car shoot-out were NO ONE WAS INJURED, about 6 weeks ago they shut down extremely heavily used southbound I-5 just outside of Olympia for much of a day because one bad accident even though water and a limited access military base made for zero detour possibilities. We do it for rail too where out here when a railroad gets shut down because of a mud slide, even if it never even touches the tracks, freight trains roll as soon as it is cleared, passenger trains are not allowed for three days because of SAFETY! . now days everything seems to take priority over getting systems up and running again, we the people are told to suck it up and drive on, to stop bitching.

In an America that increasingly does not work a mostly closed down bridge is supposed to be just a routine hassle that we are supposed to take, the idea that government officials might be punished for it is barely a thought because it does not happen. Think about it..."we are doing a study" worked for months to explain why a bridge was barely functioning! That does not happen unless the citizens have been conditioned to take this bull **** quietly.

Says you. I obviously don't agree, but at least you didn't try and argue that Obama isn't a blatant liar.

I don't have anything smartass to say to you so heres a picture of Laurel and Hardy dancing

Well...there certainly are many fact checkers who argue that the IRS did not target conservative groups to the exclusion of non-conservative groups. They targeted groups they thought did not meet the criteria for tax exemption...which included lots more than just conservative groups.



There is no way I would try to argue that any politician is not a blatant liar. Politics and lying go together like a horse and carriage.

Here's a wikipedia article on the issue...there are many others you can Google.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_IRS_scandal

When it comes to current political issues, I'm afraid I don't find wikipedia to be reliable. Too many partisans (right or left) are desperate to tell us all what happened.

I understand...and I sorta agree. But most of the regular media also reported the findings of the investigating bodies...and the only people who still think the IRS selectively targeted conservative groups...

...are conservatives.

And the only ones who think they didn't are liberals.

Imagine that.