What are your pet peeves re English usage?

McTag wrote:

Yeah, typical innit, ....

Now there is a 'word' I have not seen since the days of my youth! And typically it was only used among the First Nations people and certainly not the likes of you McTag! Wink

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[quote="Merry Andrew] I suppose it's natural for him to suppose that we, too, take our cues from the likes of William Safire, Richard Lederer or Barbara Wallraff.[/quote]

You must be, Andrew or folks like them. We've all heard the fairy tales repeated time and again but there's not been much in the way of a defence mounted for these peeves/fairy tales. It's strange too, how all these original thinkers seem to have the same story line and these story lines get repeated ad nauseam.

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McTag wrote:

JTT wrote:
Lord Ellpus wrote:

<Ellpus backs away quietly, with fixed smile and slight nod of head>

See Clary, you too can be saved. Go and sin no more child!

There's hope for ole McTag too.

When anyone starts quoting Stephen Pincker [sic], I reach for my revolver.

{Eminently intelligent thing to do.}

"...Ich entsichere meinen Browning", I believe was the origin for that.

This is not to attack Thomas, whom I hope will be my friend, but only to say I think a lot of what Pincker [sic] writes has little relevance to anything useful (or interesting to me). Also, some of Pincker quoted here and previously by JTT seems to be totally bonkers.

I write of course from a standpoint of deplorable ignorance :wink:

-----------------------------
S Pinker

So these are the "language mavens." Their foibles can be blamed on two blind spots. One is a gross underestimation of the linguistic wherewithal of the common person. ... But the language mavens would have a much better chance of not embarrassing themselves if they saved the verdict of linguistic incompetence as a last resort, rather than jumping to it as a first conclusion.

The other blind spot is their complete ignorance of the modern science of language -- and I don't mean just the often-forbidding technicalities of Chomskyan theory, but basic knowledge of what kinds of constructions and idioms are found in English, and how people use them and pronounce them.

-------------------------------------

Where oh where are these mavens when you need them?

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Ay Sontespli wrote:

McTag wrote:
Yeah, typical innit, ....

Now there is a 'word' I have not seen since the days of my youth! And typically it was only used among the First Nations people and certainly not the likes of you McTag!

Fairly common pronunciation in the UK, Ay. Equally common in British popular novels in its written form.

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Merry Andrew wrote:

Ay Sontespli wrote:
McTag wrote:
Yeah, typical innit, ....

Now there is a 'word' I have not seen since the days of my youth! And typically it was only used among the First Nations people and certainly not the likes of you McTag!

Fairly common pronunciation in the UK, Ay. Equally common in British popular novels in its written form.

Why isn't someone whining and kvetching about this one, Andrew? Smile

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Merry Andrew wrote:

Virago, my heartiest congratulations on your post to JTT. What amuses hell out of me that he is the most pedantic of pedants on this thread, yet instists on calling anyone who disagrees with him a pedant. And for someone who always falls back on Steven Pinker, I suppose it's natural for him to suppose that we, too, take our cues from the likes of William Safire, Richard Lederer or Barbara Wallraff.

Andrew, I think you mean Clary, McTag, Virago, yourself and a few others. Your descriptions of language more closely align you folks with the definitions of pedant/pedantic. All I've done is set the record straight.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cambridge online:

pedant
noun [C] DISAPPROVING
a person who is too interested in formal rules and small unimportant details

pedantic
adjective DISAPPROVING
giving too much attention to formal rules or small details:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Why do you have a problem with Steven Pinker. He is an acknowledged expert in the field of language. Let me try to remember who it is that you "pedants" Smile

have "fallen back on" to support your positions, hmmmm, {thinking}, hmmmmmm, {more thinking}, ... NO ONE!

It's been McTag supporting Merry Andrew who supports Clary who supports Pete who supports ... .

There's been some fun poked at each of you at one time or another and your knickers are all twisted up. Get over it. That door has swung both ways.

When you write falsehoods in a public forum, do you expect encouragement? Mr Ellpus was big enough to look at the facts and admit his error. What the hell's wrong with the rest of you? Let the jibes fly, if you will, I don't mind but, for god's sake, please provide some argument for your positions OR failing that, dig up something in the way of proof.

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JTT, most of us write for fun, for some diversion, and not as carrying out a crusade.
And not setting out to belittle people nor insult them. The title of the thread suggests something a bit lightearted. This is how most approach it.

I would suggest if you want to employ intellectual rigour and quote authors like Pincker, who has it seems to me very little to say to the ordinary person, then fair enough, say I, but you should employ common courtesy in the process. This has IMO been lacking.
You have been told about this before. Do you wonder people get prickly?

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McTag wrote:

JTT, most of us write for fun, for some diversion, and not as carrying out a crusade.
And not setting out to belittle people nor insult them. The title of the thread suggests something a bit lightearted. This is how most approach it.

I would suggest if you want to employ intellectual rigour and quote authors like Pincker, who has it seems to me very little to say to the ordinary person, then fair enough, say I, but you should employ common courtesy in the process. This has IMO been lacking.
You have been told about this before. Do you wonder people get prickly?

As I said, McTag, this door has swung both ways. But I probably don't have to point out that I don't much appreciate those who malign language and the people who use language, especially when these folks doing so know precious little themselves.

Do you wonder why I get so prickly?

One would think that you'd [generic 'you'] get the message. Yours is an intellectual pursuit that is similar in nature to the study of phrenology, without the research. On what grounds could you possibly think you [generic you] have the right to spread falsehoods about anything.

Let me get this straight. You're saying, "We pedants can state anything we want without applying to our comments any intellectual rigor". We can do this because we're being lighthearted about it??!!

Brilliant logic, Mr McTag, simply first rate! I'm agog!

Let me suggest that you [not the generic you] employ some intellectual rigor, Mr McTag. You [generic you, but you're included] keep making vacuous statements about not only Steven Pinker, but about language as well, with no reasoned arguments at all.

And you have the temerity to write this nonsense trying to paint me as the bad guy! Your logic grows more skewed with every uttered phrase.

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Mc Tag.....I hope you (AND the generic you) and all the others, have a great time at the forthcoming A2K Euro meet.
You have full permission to have a few whiskies, but I would advise that the generic you stays sober, as it may have to drive you home afterwards.
Ellpus (non generic)

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Oh dear. No olive branch then.

So be it; "Once more unto the breach ...!"

I quite like arguments about English, as well as polite discussions about it.

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DONT DO IT McTAG......STAY AWAY FROM THE LIGHT !

STAY AWAY FROM THE.........oops, too late.

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So funny, this pedantic discussing!

Perhaps JTT is using irony with the 'could care less' and waspish remarks.

I'm fascinated by people's peeves. For example, I've never heard rech, but I don't like to hear fit used as the past tense of fit (but it's fine in 'Joshua fit de battle of Jericho' because that's dialect).
I TOTALLY agree about literally but it occasions much hilarity so I say nowt and laugh up my sleeve.
I don't mind about the cake and eating it in linguistic terms but I took great exception to my husband doing it in romantic terms.

And so on

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I agree with Clary that people misusing "literally" can be very funny.

But one thing that does make me seethe with rage is people who make up fake etymologies and launch them on the world - and also the people who insist they must be true because they've "read them somewhere", and won't believe that any decent dictionary could disprove them.

It's bad enough being told that "keeping danger at bay" is about bay leaves, that "dead ringer" is about people being buried alive, and that "pull your finger out" derives from muzzle-loading gunnery (all pure fantasies). But there is a worrying tendency for people to invent offensive origins for phrases. Quite recently it was reported that workers in British public services were sent on courses where they were instructed not to use perfectly innocent words like "picnic" or "nitpicking" as they were "of racist origin".

Who do people do things like this? Grrrr!

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McTag wrote:

I quite like arguments about English, as well as polite discussions about it.

Clary wrote:

So funny, this pedantic discussing!

Between you and I, I could care less how English is spoken. Wink

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That's spoke, Thomas Smile

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"Belief is when someone else does the thinking." - Buckminster Fuller (1895-1983)

"Language Peeves too, are the result of someone else doing your thinking" - JTT (1932- )

That was an olive branch posting, Mr McTag. You should have seen the other one. Smile

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'course, Clary

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Just you look at them Clary and Thomas!

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Gosh, JTT, for a person of some 73 years, you have an amazingly modern outlook. Too modern for some tastes, as you will have recognised (he said wryly). I am much more hidebound than you. I hope though, not ossified.

There's an olive branch from a long-suffering Brit, reeling from what the Americans do with my beloved language.

"I may not agree with what you say- in fact I probably don't" -McTag (1944- )

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Is it safe to come out now?

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What are your pet peeves re English usage?

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