A letter to an old flame

Montana;

I have been going from one section to another and I stopped at , "Relationships and Marrage". Your letter to Mark , March 02:04 I think was just beautiful.

I of course do not know Mark but I do know that tears of joy will come to his eyes after reading your kind and thoughtful words.

Joe Harris

P.S. I wrote this note to my wife Dulce although she had died four months earlier....."Love does not have to be a spoken word or passions set ablaze, love is a feeling of a deep interpeace ,of trust and there is a knowing of tenderness so profound that words are unable to explain .....our love.
Your husband
Joe

Joe, your beautiful words make me certain that you are one of those rare men who know how to express their love in many ways.
I'm sorry you lost Dulce, but I hope your joy at having her in your life will comfort you for the rest of your life.

Joe- Dulce was indeed a lucky woman.

Beth
Yup, still scratching my head on this one.

Diane
I almost never talk to him anymore and obviously I don't see him in passing anymore since I moved to Canada. I'm not sure if he's involved with anyone as he didn't mention anything when I spoke to him a few months back. I wouldn't be interested in starting up another relationship with him since we are still both the same people we were back then and I know it wouldn't work. I'm actually not interested in starting any relationship at this time as I am enjoying my life just the way it is and as my father use to say "if it's not broken, don't fix it" ;-)

CJ
What makes you think I'm peeved at you?

Joe
Thank you very much. I am terribly sorry for your loss and I think your words are beautiful as well. Dulce was indeed a very lucky woman to have such a loving husband.

did you send it?
I had decided this weekend to send a letter to an old flame. But the whole conversation here has made me pause.

The letter (email actually) was more on the line of how is life treating you and sorry we have not kept in touch over the years...we were going in different directions so we parted ways [about 20 years ago]. But we lost contact due to some missed phone calls and some moves. I recently saw her email address and photo in an article so I had thought of sending her an email. Is that wrong? Some of the responses here sound like once you break up that you should not see each other again...is that true? Life seems way to short and there always seems like their is room for another friend. But I don't want to cause pain or I guess I would not be too happy if she simply ignored it and never replied. Wow never realized a simple hello could be so complicated!

So my question is...did you ever send it?

John

Gee, me, I am a fan of continuity.. Usually we have all moved on, that is the nature of life. But most of us like to reconnect to people we cared about.

I have always thought it a little weird that people you really care about disappear, for this or that reason, or you do the same to them.
All this intimacy............... and then blank.

I'd love to hear from someone from years ago, and wouldn't take it as a plea to start dating yet again, more like a human connection.

Flyfish
Welcome to A2K. I hear what you're saying and I also was all ready to send the letter until I read some of the responses here, which made me stop and think about it. I still haven't sent it and am unsure if I will. Still thinking about it.

Interesting article in the New York Times:

Oh, Those Web Entanglements: British Spouses Deceived

(Long) excerpt:



This is overwhelmingly about people who are married, though.

everyone is probably right
Lots of interesting comments and thoughts...you folks are pretty cool...

It seems like there is so many ways to look at this...no one answer will fit. The article made me think if I am being honest with myself about this. I am really not sure. Its more like I would like to let fate have a hand at this...or at least let the other person a have voice in this.

My Buddhist readings have shown me the value in letting go of such things. They are part of my ego. I guess I can't let go completely of someone...at least this one...oh well...guess no enlightenment for me this life!

She was/is my first true love. No doubt. Maybe with the first we define so much of how we characterize our future relationships that we never really forget. I think this is true for those of lucky enough to have had a very postive first experience. Maybe that is what is happening to the people in the article. i could relate that she felt like she had never left and that he remembered so many details. Maybe we were to young and did not know how good we had it. Time often let us know.

The fact that I have been thinking about this for so long worries me. This was the first group of people who I have talked to who said to think twice...my friends all tell me to call her. I don't want to cause pain. How does this balance with those who would say nothing ventured nothing gained? When do you get off the slide lines and play the game? If they were miserable in the article ... do you think those around them did not know that?

How about if you look at as I meet her walking down the street? Should I ignore her? Like the person who quoted one of Paul Simon's old songs. By the way how did that end up?

I am getting dizzy. This has way to many permuations. I have some travel this week so it will mean a lot of nights alone in a hotel room to think about this. My vote right now is to send it and let the cards fall. If change comes out of this...I think I am ready...if nothing comes out it...then it will be easier to let go...sadder but easier.

John

Oh, I think you can certainly just call. There was another article in the NYT about how Google has changed things -- people regularly Google old flames, old acquaintances, etc.

I think most of what we were talking about in terms of Montana (I forget how much I actually said, I remember agreeing with what others were saying) was not so much the contact in and of itself, but the method, what was said, how it was said, what expectations are, etc.

I think it's certainly a good idea to think about all of this BEFORE you call -- get your head clear, figure out what your motivations are, figure out how you would react to various possible scenarios. (As in, if she doesn't remember you; if she is indifferent; if she has negative memories; if SHE wants to rekindle things; etc.) But that doesn't necessarily mean that you shouldn't call, at all.

I had an ex who called me 10 years after the end of the relationship. He was in town for a meeting. I couldn't figure out how he'd tracked me down, and asked him - it was before most people had internet access. He'd gone to a lot of effort to find a home and work number for me. The thought really creeped me out. I literally had to go home and take a shower. The relationship was good, very good, in its day, but the re-contacting - ick.

That makes sense to me.

Google does manage to make it more casual, and I think that the more effort that went into it, the creepier. (Vs. being bored while on hold and typing a bunch of names into Google, say.) But I can see how contact, at all, could still be fraught.

I don't understand why that would be creepy, if you had a good relationship. Care to expound? I figured creepiness only came from weird people.

Montana, I would not send the letter. You both know where each other are, communicate occasionally, and it seems to be at a level you both seem comfortable with. I would leave it at that and file the letter as a summation of your private thoughts. A memo to yourself as it were.

In my case it was by accident. I was reading a yoga site and there she was advertising a class she was teaching. Neither of us was into yoga when we were together. I thought it was kind of cool we both got into it on our own.

But I don't think you can predicte the reaction. Someone else may have been touched that he had worked so hard to find her...others...would agree with her and look for some strong soap. In her case she probably feels her privacy has been violated. Quite understandable. How do you get it back?

I guess lost loves is why we write poetry, sonnets and movies for the lifetime channel!!

Oh well...

Wow. Talk about over thinking. For starters; men seldom get "creeped out" by Women, because the fairer sex is infinitely less dangerous. Besides; it's not as if you're stalking him... you live in another Country for crying out loud.

Montana; you wrote a kind letter out of the goodness of your heart. Having read a good deal of your posts, I feel confident in saying so. Further, if your memory of this man made him worthy of such thoughts, I can only assume he will take it for the incredibly kind gesture that it is. If this proves incorrect, what have you lost? On the other hand, if you don't send it, you will have forfeited an opportunity to bring someone you care about some genuine pleasure... and possibly a rekindling of a friendship that has provided you with some of your fondest memories. What a shame that would be.
(Yikes, that sounded a little sensitive … Go send that letter now, damn it! :wink: )

Flyfish, I don't know you well enough to know if you're a creep or not... so I can't really advise you. However, since you are not a member of the fairer sex, you should use far more caution so as to not creep out your friend (but contact only if you're not a creep! :wink: )
(ah, that's better )

I did contact, back in the mid eighties, a fellow I had loved very much back in the early seventies. I had just figured out that he must have been gay. I was still in letter contact with a woman md who had gone to med school with him, and
mentioned to her that I was suddenly and quite late, hah, sure that he was gay. And she said, he had just told her, a few weeks before. So fifteen years had passed.

To be a little clearer, he would disappear from time to time, and be rather quiet for a bit. He told me about having rage about some matters, and was seeing a psychiatrist. Some time later he did a residency in psychiatry. So, it had occurred to me he might be gay or bi, but I thought that wasn't it - it sure didn't seem to be it - and that there was some other problem he wasn't ready to talk about with me. This complexity did not show up in our sexual relationship, he is way high on my lifetime list of lovers.
This was 1971, which must seem prehistoric to many here, and was, in terms of gays being able to come out as gays.

Anyway, I wrote him a short note, since our mutual friend gave me the address, and he called and we see each other every couple of years since then. He has a long time mate, and we all get along.

The basis for the continuance of the friendship is that we did used to be friends as well as lovers, and still communicate well on a lot of subjects. Our continued friendship adds a sense of life continuity for both of us. We are all aging, the continuity is special. So wild, life is.

What is my point - that with relationships where the lover was also a friend, I think it is possible to renew the friendship years later, separate from the possibility of renewed romance. On romantically getting back with people, I think that might be pretty hard, and I guess that would be where the creepiness would come in, if someone was pushing for it many years later. Though I suppose it could happen, as people mature and know themselves better.

I don't agree on either of those points, O'Bill. I've spoken to several IRL men on this subject - some of them did get creeped out by having been tracked down/contacted. I'll go back to an earlier point that I made - that the person who is being contacted can't even tell you what their reaction is going to be in advance. If you'd asked me a year earlier what I'd think about getting back in touch with B., I'd have told you that would be great. The reality of hearing from him, was very different from the theory.

I really like flyfish's recent take on this. More sonnets could be a very good thing.

SCoates, good, non-creepy people are capable of doing creepy things. We all have different tolerances for things, and don't always realize when we're over-stepping others' boundaries. In a way, it's like buying presents for people. Do you buy them what you'd like to get, what you think they should have, what you think they'd like, what you think they need, or what they've actually told you they want? Tough to know which is the right way to go.

I've known situations where I would have liked to look up an old friend, but I know they would think it was creepy. But still, I don't know how I know...

Every time I introduce myself to a stranger, or call an old friend; I run the risk of creeping them out. If I accidentally do, I can say something like "Sorry, I didn't mean to creep you out... just wanted to meet you or say hello or whatever". It isn't that big of a deal. I think it would be silly to pass on a potential opportunity to bring joy to someone I cared about enough to write such a letter.

Okay, so this is how I see it;
Worst case scenario: Dude gets a little creeped out. Big deal. He'll certainly get over it. And nothing changes.
Best case scenario: Montana renews a friendship with someone she once cared deeply about and may one day again.
Most likely scenario: Dude at least recognizes the inherent kindness in the gesture and is touched. I know I would be.

At the end of the day: There is a good deal of upside compared to virtually no downside. I try very hard not to ever put myself in a position of wondering "what if?" Life is just way too short for that. You feelin me?