24
   

Arizona does it again!!! (Is this legal?)

 
 
Ticomaya
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 03:56 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Lustig Andrei wrote:
parados wrote:
Can you please cite the specific law that makes illegal?

They are deportable under the law but I am unclear what crime they are committing and which court they are charged in.


Excellent point, parados. That a person is in this country illegally makes him/her subject to deportation. It does not in any way curtail their rights as visitors from another country.

I take it you didn't follow MM's link. Here it is again:

Quote:
8 U.S.C. ยง 1325 : US Code - Section 1325: Improper entry by alien
(a) Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection;
misrepresentation and concealment of facts

Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States
at any time or place other than as designated by immigration
officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration
officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United
States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the
willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first
commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or
imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent
commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or
imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.

cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 03:57 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
I'm also wondering if their highway patrol will check to see if they're illegal immigrants with legal other state's driver's license?

Will they allow them to pass through, or throw them in jail for "breaking" their state law?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 04:00 pm
@Ticomaya,
Tico, You're missing the point; they were born in the US (they're considered naturalized citizens) of immigrants who came into the US before the law was passed, or their parents brought them into the US. They didn't have a choice, but to follow their parents.
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 04:01 pm
@Ticomaya,
Thanx for that, Tico. You're right -- I hadn't followed MM's link.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 04:12 pm
@mysteryman,
Quote:
Any alien who is apprehended while entering (or attempting to
enter) t


It might be illegal if CAUGHT entering but once here it isn't the same crime.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 04:15 pm
@Ticomaya,
Not illegal to BE in the USA. It is only illegal to enter.
mysteryman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 04:35 pm
@parados,
So if you break the law and don't get caught, then you have done nothing illegal.
Is that your position?
edgarblythe
 
  3  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 04:54 pm
If they are granted amnesty they are no longer illegal.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 06:54 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:
Tico, You're missing the point; they were born in the US (they're considered naturalized citizens) of immigrants who came into the US before the law was passed, or their parents brought them into the US. They didn't have a choice, but to follow their parents.

What point is it that you think I'm missing, c.i.?
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 06:58 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:
Not illegal to BE in the USA. It is only illegal to enter.

If you are an alien and you are IN the US, then you ENTERED the US. The law does not ONLY apply to those perched midway on the US border -- it applies to those who ENTERED the US "other than as designated by immigration officers," to cite only to subsection (a).
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:08 pm
@Ticomaya,
If they are born in the US, they are US citizens. They are US citizens by virtue of their birth in this country. They are not illegal in any way.

Beyond that, the children who follow their parents into this country "had no choice." So, what are you expecting to do with those children? Especially if their parents are already gone?
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:09 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
He is required by Article 2 Section 3 of the Constitution
to: "take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed".


He gives a pass to the Bush/Cheney band of war criminals/terrorists and that doesn't even twig in what passes as your brain, Om. I wonder why.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:17 pm
@mysteryman,
If you break the law and don't get caught then they can't charge you with that crime later without evidence.

If you jaywalk, are you arguing that the police can pick you up and charge you with a crime whenever they want to? Being in the country isn't illegal. They have to have some evidence of how you crossed to actually charge you with a misdemeanor. They can however deport you without evidence in a civil procedure.
Ticomaya
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:17 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

If they are born in the US, they are US citizens. They are US citizens by virtue of their birth in this country. They are not illegal in any way.

Yes, that is true. Why do you think I missed that point?

Quote:
Beyond that, the children who follow their parents into this country "had no choice." So, what are you expecting to do with those children? Especially if their parents are already gone?

Personally, I think the DREAM ACT should be passed. What are you expecting to do with them?

I think you are confusing me with someone else. Perhaps you're lumping all conservatives into the same pot, again.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:18 pm
@Ticomaya,
Ticomaya wrote:

parados wrote:
Not illegal to BE in the USA. It is only illegal to enter.

If you are an alien and you are IN the US, then you ENTERED the US. The law does not ONLY apply to those perched midway on the US border -- it applies to those who ENTERED the US "other than as designated by immigration officers," to cite only to subsection (a).

Sure. Now how did they cross? What evidence do you have that makes their entrance a crime according to the law you just quoted. You need evidence. Just being in the country is not evidence enough to break the law you cited since you have no evidence of how they crossed.
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:19 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:
They can however deport you without evidence in a civil procedure.

Bull. ****.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:22 pm
@parados,
Good q; even world war veterans don't have ID's that fits the requirement of some of the states to vote.

How is anyone going to identify all those so-called "illegals" in this country?

Tico is good about talking on the subject of laws, but he hasn't shown how he's going to enforce it.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:22 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:
Sure. Now how did they cross? What evidence do you have that makes their entrance a crime according to the law you just quoted. You need evidence. Just being in the country is not evidence enough to break the law you cited since you have no evidence of how they crossed.

Yes, you need evidence.

Please don't try to lecture me about evidence. I'm in a courtroom every day.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:24 pm
@Ticomaya,
Being in a courtroom every day doesn't mean much. Nobody has to tell you many areas of the laws are specialized.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2012 07:26 pm
@cicerone imposter,
. . . and nobody hase to tell me how many lawyers never go to court for anything. I would like someone to tell me why they went into law in the first place.
 

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