17
   

Man's life Over, Cops Decide He Watched Child Porn in First Class

 
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:34 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
Well, you and BillRM are now at an equal level of paranoid hysteria.


Sorry dear but men had been hooked up to a devices that measure their penis reactions to being shown picture of children.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penile_plethysmograph

Post-conviction usePhallometry is widely considered appropriate for treatment and supervision of convicted sex offenders: "Courts have permitted plethysmographic testing for monitoring compliance by convicted sex offenders with the conditions of their community placement as part of crime-related treatment for sexual deviancy."[36] Its use for the treatment and management of sexual offenders is recommended by the Association for the Treatment of Sexual Abusers.[37] Becker notes it "should never be used exclusively in forensic decision making."[38] The sexual assault trial of basketball player Kobe Bryant in Colorado brought this device and its use to public attention before the case was dropped in 2004, because Colorado law would have required evaluation with this device following conviction.[39] The United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit recently addressed the procedures required before a federal supervised release program could include penile plethysmograph testing.[40] The device is routinely used at civil commitment facilities, but "some clinicians and offenders say it is easy, particularly in a laboratory, to stifle arousal and thus cheat on a plethysmograph test."[41] This has been reported to occur in 16% of cases.[42]

During the Catholic sex abuse cases, the reliability of the test was questioned by some officials in the Roman Catholic Archdiocese of Philadelphia. Later, these officials chose to seek therapy at an institution where the plethysmograph was not used.[43]

[edit] Canada
BillRM
 
  1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:35 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
And I'm impressed with the job those prosecutors do.


I am not however......... see the high school principle that needed to spend 150,000 to clear his name because of the lack of common sense of a DA that I had already posted about.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  3  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:36 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:

Sorry dear but men had been hooked up to a devices that measure their penis reactions to being shown picture of children.


That's only in the case of convicted sex offenders.

So now you're worried about that too? Laughing
BillRM
 
  0  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:38 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
That's only in the case of convicted sex offenders
.



They are trying to get the courts to allow it before a conviction dear heart.
firefly
 
  2  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:40 pm
@BillRM,
You and Hawkeye deserve each other. You're both on the same wave length. And neither of you are discussing the topic of this thread.

Share your paranoid hysteria with each other. Laughing

You are both good at turning yourselves into objects of ridicule and scorn--it's what you do best.
BillRM
 
  0  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:42 pm
@firefly,
By the way Firefly what is your problem with the UK law on the subject that spell out in far more details the level of crime in having pictures of pre-18 years olds shown in a sexual manner and more sane level of punishments also?
BillRM
 
  0  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:48 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
You are both good at turning yourselves into objects of ridicule and scorn--it's what you do best.


Yes and those innocent families that had their doors broken in and gun pointed at their heads must had been just paranoid and hysteria for being upset over being innocent victim of the war on CP.

It never can happen even when the news keep reporting it happening and with more FBI honey pots you was so happy about it going to happen more and more.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:48 pm
@BillRM,
I have no problems with our laws.

You're in broken record mode.

Go talk to Hawkeye.
BillRM
 
  0  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:50 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
I have no problems with our laws.


Too bad that a large percents of federal judges do not agree with you and do have problems with our laws in this area.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 04:56 pm
@Linkat,
Quote:
I don't know how many times firefly has stated it wasn't older teenagers - you must be pretty thick in the head as you keep saying what about an 18 and 17 year old. Duh - we all know we ain't talking about that.


She can say anything she wish to but the Federal law as written having a sexual picture of a 17 years old or a picture of an infant being rape is the same crime.
Ticomaya
 
  6  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 06:23 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
... but there are guys who are who insist that they never even looked at the contraband who have the "sex criminal" tag for life now.

Yes, the prisons are full of criminals who insist they are innocent.
hawkeye10
 
  -2  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 06:24 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
She can say anything she wish to but the Federal law as written having a sexual picture of a 17 years old or a picture of an infant being rape is the same crime.
Not to mention that with as much as DA'a and Child Protective Services use threats of legal action to bully citizens to conform to their will there is no basis for accusing those who are concerned about the actions of the state of paranoia. Only the truly informed can have no concerns about how child SAFETY! is used by the state. There are far too many credible stories of people who have pled to crimes that they insist that they never did only because the downside of having their day in court was too great due to charge loading, by its actions the state proves over and over again that winning is more important than is justice.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 06:33 pm
@firefly,
DAVID wrote:
It was directly in violation of the federal statute.
So far as I remember,
firefly wrote:
I just re-read the federal law and the passenger who took the photo really wouldn't be in violation of the law because he immediately reported it to law enforcement.
That 's in the statute?


firefly wrote:
Also, the photo the other passenger took might just have been a shot of Smith looking at his laptop, without showing a clear image of the screen. He wanted to show that Smith had used the laptop.

Similarly, someone who accidently downloads child pornography is not in violation of federal law if they make immediate efforts to delete it and/or notify law enforcement.
Are u sure?
I heard or read (informally) of someone being convicted n sentenced
to heavy time just for clicking on an FBI link. (I don 't have the case.)
He alleged that it was accidental.



firefly wrote:
The feds really aren't looking to arrest innocent people
for possession of child pornography--they really are looking for pedophiles.
How is that defined?
For instance, looking for nazis or commies was important
if thay were spying or sabotaging, but if someone merely
liked to read about communism or nazism, approving
of either of those systems mentally, without active conduct,
shoud not be cause for criminal prosecution (anathema,
tho thay both are
) the point being
that the territory between the ears shoud be immune
from government surveillance or interference.
Next, will thay control the poetry ?

The idea of government taking an interest in citizen's emotions or artwork is scary.
( BOTH the nazis & the commies did that; I think the Inquisition took an interest in that too. )
That is not the same as chasing rapists (concerning whom I can see it being reasonable
to inflict capital punishment, which HAS been done in American history).
That approaches perilously close to our pledging allegiance
to whatever government (or vocal segments) decide to believe.
Passionate emotions do not generate new legislative jurisdiction.
I can easily remember when homosexuals were held in impassioned abhorence; not so much any more.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 06:37 pm
@izzythepush,
firefly wrote:
The feds really aren't looking to arrest innocent people for possession of child pornography--they really are looking for pedophiles.
izzythepush wrote:

This is just Bill stirring up paranoia about the pornography laws, because he's one of the few people who's got something to worry about.
Shall we say that accepting jurisdiction over artwork,
the manifestation of citizens' emotions, must be accepted
because it is being applied to a pariah group ?
Shall it be a question of whose ox is gored ?

Safety lies in keeping government: "weak, starved, and inoffensive" as Heinlein put it.





David
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 06:42 pm
@Ticomaya,
Ticomaya wrote:

hawkeye10 wrote:
... but there are guys who are who insist that they never even looked at the contraband who have the "sex criminal" tag for life now.

Yes, the prisons are full of criminals who insist they are innocent.


The difference is that those who claim that they plead guilty of one charge for the crime only because going to court could have resulted in four other guilty verdicts for the same act because of the charge loading practice have a good argument that they were bullied by the state into taking the plea bargain. The state would have a better leg to stand on if they charged people with one crime for their bad act, instead of as it does work hard to figure out how to parley that one bad act into many crimes.
DrewDad
 
  1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 07:01 pm
@Ticomaya,
Ticomaya wrote:

Yes, the prisons are full of criminals who insist they are innocent.

It's the guys who claim "it's their fault for leaving the door unlocked!" that make me want to hit my head on the desk.

Hawk and BillRM are two others that make me want to do so.
gungasnake
 
  1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 07:02 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
There are far too many credible stories of people who have pled to crimes that they insist that they never did only because the downside of having their day in court was too great due to charge loading, by its actions the state proves over and over again that winning is more important than is justice....


I've mentioned this before. There does not appear to be any sort of a half measure which would fix the problem, we need to totally get rid of the "adversarial" system of justice and move to something like the inquisitorial system which France uses.

The job of DA should not exist, it involves gigantic power and almost nothing you'd call accountability, and is too often the first rung of the ladder to political careers for the Janet Renos, Scott Harshbargers, Mike Nifongs, Ronnie Earles, and Martha Coakleys of the world. Too often those careers are paved with the blood of innocents.

0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 07:09 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
That 's in the statute?

You can read it for yourself.

This is just a portion of it--the part I think is relevant to the passenger who took the photo--athough he may only have taken a picture of Smith using the laptop. Whether his photo even clearly showed what was on the laptop screen is speculative.

I think the passenger's actions, and those who download by accident, would be covered by the Affirmative Defense if they followed the necessary actions in the AD. But, honestly, I don't think the passenger who took the photo even violated the law.
Quote:
18 U.S.C. ยง 2252 : US Code - Section 2252: Certain activities relating to material involving the sexual exploitation of minors

Any person who...
2) knowingly receives, or distributes, any visual depiction
that has been mailed, or has been shipped or transported in
interstate or foreign commerce, or which contains materials which
have been mailed or so shipped or transported, by any means
including by computer, or knowingly reproduces any visual
depiction for distribution in interstate or foreign commerce or
through the mails, if -
(A) the producing of such visual depiction involves the use
of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct; and
(B) such visual depiction is of such conduct;...

(B) knowingly possesses 1 or more books, magazines,
periodicals, films, video tapes, or other matter which contain
any visual depiction that has been mailed, or has been shipped
or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, or which was
produced using materials which have been mailed or so shipped
or transported, by any means including by computer, if -
(i) the producing of such visual depiction involves the use
of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct...


(c) Affirmative Defense. - It shall be an affirmative defense to
a charge of violating paragraph (4) of subsection (a) that the
defendant -
(1) possessed less than three matters containing any visual
depiction proscribed by that paragraph; and
(2) promptly and in good faith, and without retaining or
allowing any person, other than a law enforcement agency, to
access any visual depiction or copy thereof -
(A) took reasonable steps to destroy each such visual
depiction; or
(B) reported the matter to a law enforcement agency and
afforded that agency access to each such visual depiction.
http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/110/2252
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  3  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 07:11 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
The difference is that those who claim that they plead guilty of one charge for the crime only because going to court could have resulted in four other guilty verdicts for the same act because of the charge loading practice have a good argument that they were bullied by the state into taking the plea bargain. The state would have a better leg to stand on if they charged people with one crime for their bad act, instead of as it does work hard to figure out how to parley that one bad act into many crimes.

"Bullied by the state"? "Leg to stand on"? Laughing

Yes, as I said, the prisons are full of innocent criminals.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Fri 2 Dec, 2011 07:14 pm
@Ticomaya,
Quote:
Bullied by the state"? "Leg to stand on"?

Yes, as I said, the prisons are full of innocent criminals.
Maybe you are wealthy enough and well connected enough to take on the state when it comes after you unjustly (like DSK) but most of us are not. The argument that there was no practical choice but to allow the state to roll them has legs, as many of us think about what we would do in that situation and conclude that we very well might do the same thing.
 

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