17
   

Schools closed-exotic animals prowl Ohio - Sozobe?

 
 
Setanta
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:25 am
@msolga,
No, and don't try your bullshit condemnation tricks, either. This is an objection to the hyperbole of horror with which you routinely comment on things about the United States which you don't like. It's an objection to the kind of over-the-top "I can't believe a civilized nation in the 21st century . . . " rhetoric you so routinely employ. But then, how can i object? We're such a bunch of brute savages, barely out of the stone age . . .
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:36 am
@Setanta,
Well I think you are being overly sensitive about the US.
My comment was about the treatment of animals.
You may believe that my concern is "bullshit condemnation", but that sort of treatment of "exotic" animals deserves condemnation ... as does the Australian live sheep export trade. I see no justification for either.

Quote:
We're such a bunch of brute savages, barely out of the stone age . . .

Calm down, for heavens sake. You are overreacting.
Do you have a problem with the rules being tightened up so that animals are not treated in the way that these have been?

Setanta
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:43 am
@msolga,
Bullshit condemnation was a response to that knocker Setanta comment (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean). But it is typical that you want to twist this in a feeble and obvious attempt to suggest that if i don't completely agree with everything you write, then i don't care about how animals are treated.

I have a problem with the hysterical tone of your comments, so don't keep trying to imply that my objection concerns the treatment of animals. It concerns your typical indulgence in rhetorical hysteria to express your outrage.
Setanta
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:45 am
As for overreacting and over-sensitive, you might have a different perspective if the forum you visited was daily bombarded with hundreds of absurd and unreasonable condemnations of Australia and all things Austalian, especially in the light of the apparent complacence with which the critics view their own nations.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:53 am
@Setanta,
Quote:
I have a problem with the hysterical tone of your comments, so don't keep trying to imply that my objection concerns the treatment of animals. It concerns your typical indulgence in rhetorical hysteria to express your outrage.

Really?
So unlike your comments directed at me.
The tone of my response to you would have been entirely different if your comments to my posts (not directed at you) had been different.:
Quote:
....don't try your bullshit condemnation tricks, either. This is an objection to the hyperbole of horror..

See what I mean?

This is silly.
I don't know why you're carrying on like this, but I think it's a pointless exercise. A total waste of time.
Do you want to discuss the topic or just throw around abuse because you don't agree with my perspective?
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:59 am
@Setanta,
Quote:
As for overreacting and over-sensitive, you might have a different perspective if the forum you visited was daily bombarded with hundreds of absurd and unreasonable condemnations of Australia and all things Austalian, especially in the light of the apparent complacence with which the critics view their own nations.

And I am totally responsible for this, Setanta? Confused
Why don't you blast all the US critics who are making you so angry then, instead of having a go at me on this thread?

I repeat, I was talking about the treatment of animals on this thread.
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 03:59 am
@msolga,
Your rhetorical skills are pathetic. I did not say that i don't agree with your "perspective," and that's not the source of my objection. I understand that you want to continue to make out that that is the reason i have reacted the way i have, because you want to take your typical, phony tone of moral superiority.

I am not bound to discuss only the topic of the thread, which does not happen to be the treatment of animals in the United States, although that would certainly be a reasonable direction for a digression such as you now want to institute. An equally reasonable digression would be a discussion of your addiction to expressions of hysterical outrage.
Setanta
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:02 am
@msolga,
Here's another straw man. I haven't said that you're totally responsible for that. Don't overreact, don't be over sensitive. There is no critic of any kind here who is "making [me] so angry." Don't confuse disgust and contempt with anger.

Quote:
I repeat, I was talking about the treatment of animals on this thread.


Just how do you allege animals are being treated on this thread?
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:07 am
@Setanta,
Quote:
Your rhetorical skills are pathetic.

Whereas yours are so brilliant. Neutral

I've had enough of this, Setanta.
I think it's a waste of my time & in no way related to anything I have said about the treatment of animals on this thread.
I don't know what the heck you're "saying", exactly.
You seem to be saying all sorts of things & you seem to be very angry.
I'm leaving it here because I've had enough.
This is stupid.



Setanta
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:12 am
@msolga,
Yeah, it really is stupid to attempt to turn a human interest story thread into a referendum on how animals are treated in the United States--i'm glad you finally recognized how silly you've been.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:25 am
@Setanta,
Quote:
Yeah, it really is stupid to attempt to turn a human interest story thread into a referendum on how animals are treated in the United States--i'm glad you finally recognized how silly you've been.

It is much more than a "human interest story", in case you haven't noticed.
Animal welfare is part of the "story", surely?:

Quote:
18 Bengal tigers - dead
9 male lions - dead
8 female lions - dead
6 black bears - dead
3 mountain lions - dead
2 grizzly bears - dead
1 baboon - dead
1 wolf - dead
1 grizzly bear - recaptured
3 leopards - recaptured
2 monkeys - recaptured
1 macaque monkey - missing
1 grey wolf - missing


My concern (to refresh your memory) was:
Quote:
....Is it actually legal for a person to collect "exotic" animals in some "private zoo" like this?


It seems, from the information I have read on this thread, that the federal Animal Welfare Act needs to be tightened up & address the issue of "private zoos" like this one, in the future.

Do you have any argument against that?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 04:38 am
I have an argument against the claim that that was the subject of the thread. That was a digression introduced by Chicken Little, another famous drama queen around here. As i have already pointed out, this is not an unreasonable digression.

But let's keep the subjects straight here. Despite your constant attempts to robe yourself in moral glory, my objection was the tone of hysterical hyperbole which you adopted with that "I can't believe a civilized country in the 21st century . . . " bullshit. The obvious implication is that you don't consider the United States to be civilized. It is perfectly reasonable to object to such an hysterical accusation.

If it was not your intention to imply that, then i advise you to write more careful, to give some consideration to the implications of what you write before you post it.

You can continue to attempt to adopt a tone of moral superiority. My objection had nothing to do with the treatment of animals--my objection was to your slighting remark about the United States.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 05:16 am
@Setanta,
Quote:
You can continue to attempt to adopt a tone of moral superiority. My objection had nothing to do with the treatment of animals--my objection was to your slighting remark about the United States.

OK, if you consider my concern for animal welfare to be one of "moral superiority", well so be it.
But, as a participant of A2K threads, I'm allowed to express my opinion on such things, yes?
Same as you are allowed to have your opinions on whatever subjects, Setanta.
We are here to discuss issues that we have opinions about.
Animal welfare is a subject I have very strong views about.
If you don't like that, then too bad!

I suggest that, when you use terms like:
Quote:
(my) tone of hysterical hyperbole

and:
Quote:
...your constant attempts to robe yourself in moral glory ..


That you are talking complete & utter rubbish ....

Quote:
The obvious implication is that you don't consider the United States to be civilized. It is perfectly reasonable to object to such an hysterical accusation.

Sigh.
No more "civilized" (in terms of some aspects of animal welfare) than my own country (Australia) is, in continuing with the live cattle export trade. As I would have thought would be perfectly clear by now.

Why do you continue to carry on with the nonsense that I've suggested that the US is any worse than any other country in its treatment of animals? I have said no such thing.

Why do you persist in seeing my concerns about "private zoos" in some states of the US as some anti-US statement & not an animal welfare concern?
I would not be posting my views the subject at all if not for the news reports & this thread today.

Quote:
If it was not your intention to imply that, then i advise you to write more careful, to give some consideration to the implications of what you write before you post it.

Actually, Setanta, I did write pretty carefully.
It was your subjective reading of my posts that has been the problem here.
You seem to think that the point of my posts was to attack the US.
You are completely wrong.
And you have been pretty offensive in your wrongful assessment & your responses to what you imagine I'm arguing.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 05:23 am
@msolga,
Jesus, it's just one straw man after another with you. I didn't say your concern for animals was a matter of moral superiority--that was a condmenation of the tone you take. And that's just another example of you attempting to take that morally superior tone by trying to imply that i'm criticizing your "concern" for animal welfare.

It is not utter rubbish that each time i have pointed out your slighting remark about the United States, you attempt to claim the subject is the treatment of animals, and that's when you introduce your hysterical tone, a tone which implies your moral superiority.

Why should it be "perfectly clear" to me when i don't see you making a comparison of the degrees of civilization between the United States and Australia, and i don't see you making remarks which imply that Australia is uncivilized?

YOU have constantly attempted, until now, to avoid the burden of your remark. YOU have constantly attempted to make it appear that i don't care about animal welfare, because you want to wrap yourself in moral indignation.

As for my having been offensive, you can expect that when you make offensive remarks which condemn a nation of more than 300 million people out of hand.
msolga
 
  0  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 05:39 am
@Setanta,
Setanta, I seriously have had enough of you on this thread.
List all these "straw men" for me, please. Go on.
You don't appear to be clear about what you're objecting to .... to anything I've posted here.
And don't you dare suggest, yet again, that I have been unfair, or anti-US, here!
You've expressed your "objections" to my posts in the most objectionable way possible.
If you're trying to discourage participation in A2K threads, you're doing an absolutely admirable job!
Go back & read your own posts here.
They are rude & they are confused.
What are you actually saying, apart from being aggressive & not liking what I've said?
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 05:45 am
@msolga,
I've been perfectly clear about what it is that i object to. That you want to avoid that, and attempt to make it appear that i object to your "concern" for animal welfare doesn't change the fact that i have consistently objected to your tone of moral superiority from which you condemn an entire nation. If you've have enough, stop reading my posts.

Once again, tediously, i object to your hysterical, hyperbolic condemnation of an entire nation. I am contemptuous of you because you employ a tone of moral superiority. I am contemptuous of you because you continue to falsely allege that i object to your "concern" for animal welfare. This thread wasn't about animal welfare. There's nothing wrong with discussing that. There is something wrong with condemning an entire nation, in hysterical and hyperbolic language, based on a false allegation of what the thread is about.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 05:53 am
@Setanta,
Quote:
Once again, tediously, i object to your hysterical, hyperbolic condemnation of an entire nation. I am contemptuous of you because you employ a tone of moral superiority.

Well I think you are completely wrong & also off your face here, Setanta.
Get a grip.

I am contemptuous of YOU because you have said next to nothing here about my concerns about the regulation of private zoos .... which was my initial concern here.

I am also considerably less than impressed with your tendency to employ personal insults, rather than rational counter-arguments to get your point (what ever it is Confused ) across.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 06:07 am
@msolga,
God knows what idiocy "off your face" represents. If you consider it a personal insult to be told that you employ a tone of moral superiority, then don't do it. I have said "next to nothing" (actually, nothing at all) about your concerns about the regulation of private zoos because that wasn't what i objected to. I know you want to make that the topic, to imply that i don't care about animal welfare so you can take the moral high ground.

My point (which you have avoided, so don't try to claim that it is not clear) has been, all along, that you employed hysterical hyperbole in condemning an entire nation as uncivilized. Dance to your heart's content, you can't avoid the fact that that is what you did. As for rational counter-arguments, i haven't been discussing the regulation of private zoos or your concerns about animal welfare, so there have been no arguments for me to counter, rational or otherwise. In fact, you're the one who has avoided discussing my objection. You're the one who will not address your condescending moral tone, and who will not acknowledge that you condemned an entire nation because of a single incident described at the beginning of this thread.

You also continue to ignore that this thread was not about a discussion of animal welfare--that's just what you would like to turn it into.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 06:09 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
The Miss Olga Outrage (TM) routine again . . . i can't believe that any civilized nation in the 21st century allows the unregulated exportation of live sheep. Every nation has its flaws, and all systems of laws have their lacunea. But it gets tedious hearing from Miss Olga just how barbaric we are, and the incredulity with which she greets this.


This was my post. It was about your condemnation of an entire nation. It was not an objection to your wonderful love of all the little lambiekins.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 20 Oct, 2011 06:21 am
@Setanta,
I think you're out of your tree, Setanta.
Seriously.
Have you not read a single thing I've posted about the Australian live animal trade, in response to your comments earlier?
Have you not looked at the link to my thread about this subject which I also posted here?
No, of course not.
It doesn't suit your "argument" at all.
If anything, that thread is far more damning of Australia than anything I've said here about "private zoos" in some US states.
But not to worry ... let's not let mere details like this get in the way of whatever anti-US theory it is you're convinced I've been pushing on this thread.


 

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