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The Communist Origin of the Modern Conservative Movement VI

 
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 31 Dec, 2019 03:28 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
Actually I wouldn't. Because whether I agree or disagree with someone else's aims has nothing to do with the discussion I'm having with you.

Funny how this only applies to me and not the people pushing fake and false definitions.

Quote:
I'm suggesting that the use of the term "assault weapon" is imprecise and that arguing about "what it really means" is a waste of time.

Not a waste of time at all, those types of weapons have a selective fire switch, just like the rifle you used when you were in the military.

Quote:
There must be twenty pages of it here on this thread. Since there are only a handful of us taking part in this discussion I can state with some certainty that alleged misuse of the term here will not have any impact on the 2nd Amendment.

That's were you are wrong. This terminology is used by all the anti-gun groups including the MSM who are suppose to be the gatekeepers... It's used by the anti-gun politicians as well to change the laws. It will have an effect on the 2nd Amendment because lies are being told to ban scary looking guns.

Quote:
There aren't any "DNC candidates" as the national committee is already staffed. New candidates for positions in the DNC won't be chosen until after the 2020 election. I have no connection to the MSM, the antigun left, any candidates, or the DNC so it's pretty hard to see how I can be a "party" to anything.

This just proves that you are indeed party to something. You seem to always defend and protect the DNC. You know I'm talking about the candidates running for President but you continue to play games and insist you don't have an agenda, it's pretty clear you do. You are protecting the DNC and those who associate themselves with it, you only seem to pop up and pose these "questions" when I'm attacking the DNC, I know the game you are playing. My opinions and facts must be addressed, while Zardoz with his false info and lies can go about his business. Your agenda is clear.
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 12:15 am
@Baldimo,
You don’t have to defend yourself from an investigation. It does not cost you a penny. I know this from personal experience. HPD spent two weeks investigating me. I did not run out and hire an attorney because I knew I didn’t do anything. You don’t hire an attorney until you are charged with a crime. Even at that your first hearing they have is to prove to a magistrate that they have enough evidence to even bring you to trial. If you haven’t done anything there is not enough evidence to bring you to trial. Only the guilty fear an investigation and they are worried about what crimes that the investigation might uncover.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Trump been a life-long criminal that has that has danced between the rain drops because of his connections to organized criminals. When the criminals used the identical property scams that Trump used they were arrested and convicted but when Trump did the exact same scams, he walked away scot free by refunding part of the money. I am reading the Fusion GPS book that used extensive court records of Trump’s scams. A typical businessman might have a two-or-three-page court record of their involvement in court actions, the court report on Trump was 24 pages long. If ever anybody in the history of the United States deserved to be investigated it is Trump. Trump business partner in some of his scams was a convicted Russian mobster.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Many House members have been investigated, charged, convicted and jailed. One House member from California had to resign and will be convicted of campaign violation. He is trying to blame his wife. He even used campaign money to ship his pet rabbit from California that cost $600. There has been a constant stream of House members investigated some were the subject of law enforcement stings. Since 2010, 130 House members have been investigated that is about one out of four. Even something as trivial as making boob squeezing gestures in his past was enough to cost a democratic senator his job. By this standard Trump would have been long gone. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Generally, I will look for a mainstream news source with a reputation for accuracy. Sometimes that is no possible and then you must look for sources that can be corroborated by other sources.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Do you not understand that facts are facts they don’t change you can’t spin facts? You can deny facts but you can’t spin them. Opinion however are different. Opinions however are all spin. Take a plane crash. The newscaster says a plane crashed at 11:32 with 10 people on board. All on board died. These are all facts and can’t be disputed but when the newscaster says the cause was pilot error, that is opinion because it won’t be determine until after an investigation. Another newscaster can say the cause was heavy fog but that is just opinion. A rival plane company could say it was a problem with the way the plane was designed. This spin would be intended to benefit the rival company. It is all about determining what are facts and what is opinion.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The actual facts show that the Dayton shooter went on line to hero worship the El Paso mass murderer. It looks as if he had a last-minute conversion before he decided to become a mass murderer. The El Paso mass murder showed him the true way.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There is no way around the fact that no innocent person has anything to fear from an investigation. In fact, an investigation will prove they are innocent.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There were laws written specifically to protect whistleblowers otherwise they would never come forward because they would be retaliated against. For instance, an employee knows that the wiring on a new plane is being done by people who are not qualified electricians. Now there is a production schedule and the company was way behind without enough qualified electricians. If you say something to management you will be fired, the decision to use unqualified people was made by management. If the planes go down hundreds will die. What do you do? You can’t afford to lose your job but you don’t want those people to die. The whistleblower law allows you to file a complaint with the FAA anonymously. Without the whistleblower’s law people will die. This was a real case at Boeing recently. It is just like Homeland security says, “if you see something say something.” The whistleblower law was intended to keep as all safe not to conceal Trump’s crime.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I think that is more garbage made up whole cloth by Fox News which is part of the Trump campaign. By the way Obama is not running this year.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Not all politicians are pathological liars I have worked with hundreds. According to the Republicans the absolute worst thing a president could do was lie. It was such a violation that the Republicans impeached Clinton over a single lie. There are some politicians that tell an occasional lie when it benefits them but there has never been another pathological liar even close to the Whitehouse. A pathological liar has absolutely no credibility and no one would listen to them. What happened here was Trump was a television celebrity who came into peoples home every week like guest. Whitehouse insiders have noted that Trump is a functional illiterate who only reads at an eighth or ninth grade level. This why he has trouble using a teleprompter. He is unable to read his own executive orders and his aides know it and do as they wish. Trump has the vocabulary of an 8th grader. This is the secret of Trump’s appeal to the under educated.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The key part of the Heller decision is the ruling that you do not have a right to any “weapon whatsoever for any reason whatsoever.” I drew you a picture for you in a previous post. All you have to do is read it. In the Heller decision the guy got his gun permit but lost his “right to own any weapon whatsoever.” He won the battle but lost the war. It was an extremely high price for a gun permit.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Shall not be infringed is not a right it only applies to the right to keep and bear arms hall not be infringed. That means that you can’t take the right to keep and bear arms away from the criminals and the mentally ill. At the time Constitution was written much of American population lived in the wilderness and without a gun to hunt with or defend themselves from Indians they would die. Shall not be infringe was included in the second amendment for that purpose but has been ignored in modern times. But what it isn’t is a right to bear any weapon whatsoever for any purpose whatsoever. At the time the constitution was written taking away someone’s right to bear a gun was a death sentence for many.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It has been more than 200 years and there has never been a reason to overthrow the government but their will always be a fringe right that would constantly want to overthrow the government.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You think that Timothy McVeigh and hundreds just like him would not try to overthrow the government every time that the government did something they did not like.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
If the inalienable appears in the Bill of Rights it is a modified copy and not the original.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Reading the second amendment as written is one thing but you read it as you wished it was. When it says right to keep and bear arms it does not mean an arsenal of weapons of war and it is not infringed if you have an arm to bear.
hightor
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 05:10 am
@Baldimo,
Quote:
Funny how this only applies to me and not the people pushing fake and false definitions.

As I explained, I'm discussing the subject with you, not anyone else here.
Quote:

Not a waste of time at all...

Instead of wasting effort on trying to compel everyone to accept your definition of the term just refer to the particular features which characterize the specific assault weapon you have in mind. Save yourself the hassle.
Quote:
It will have an effect on the 2nd Amendment because lies are being told to ban scary looking guns.

What effect does public discussion have on a constitutional amendment? Amendments need to be repealed and we're nowhere near that stage.
Quote:
You seem to always defend and protect the DNC.

I'm not protecting or defending the DNC, I'm simply correcting you when you misuse the term. You can pretty much say anything you like about the DNC and I won't object. I just think continuing to conflate the national party committee with the Democratic Party as a whole demonstrates either sloppiness or willful ignorance.
Quote:
My opinions and facts must be addressed, while Zardoz with his false info and lies can go about his business.

Aw, isn't that too bad. I consider this thread to be Zardoz's blog. I respect his experience and I'm generally interested in his observations. You, on the other hand, come across as angry, arrogant, and self-righteous.
Quote:
Your agenda is clear.

You're actually the one who shows up here with an agenda — you can't leave the thread alone!
Glennn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 09:54 am
@hightor,
Quote:
Instead of wasting effort on trying to compel everyone to accept your definition of the term just refer to the particular features which characterize the specific assault weapon you have in mind.

Instead of wasting your time trying to compel Baldimo to refer to the particular features that characterize the specific alleged assault rifle he has in mind, why don't you drop the counselor persona and actually make a point?

For instance, what particular features characterize the specific alleged assault rifle you have in mind?
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 10:05 am
@Glennn,
Quote:
For instance, what particular features characterize the specific alleged assault rifle you have in mind?


I recommend not using the term "assault rifle" at all because the term is defined in different ways, leading to pointless and repetitive discussion.

I don't intend to further waste my time engaging with you on this, or any other, subject.
Glennn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 10:11 am
@hightor,
Quote:
I recommend not using the term "assault rifle" at all because the term is defined in different ways, leading to pointless and repetitive discussion.

What you really mean is that the term is ill-defined. And those who ill-define it are the ones who cannot support their claim that a specific feature makes a rifle especially dangerous.
Quote:
I don't intend to further waste my time engaging with you on this, or any other, subject.

Well, bye . . .
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  2  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 03:17 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
I don't know what your beef is.

I'm not sure that there is point to me posting this since you deal in name-calling instead of facts, but I'll try to explain why civil liberties advocates make a stand on terminology.

Here's the problem. Progressives are arbitrarily mislabeling some guns as "scary weapons of doom". And then they are using the mere fact that they have mislabeled a gun as a "scary weapon of doom" as their sole justification for trying to outlaw that gun.

This mislabeling is deliberate and malicious. There is nothing random or accidental about it.


hightor wrote:
So instead of constantly repeating the same arguments here about whether or not a gun meets your definition of "assault weapon" just accept that people may be using the term differently, determine what they mean, and deal with the point they are trying to make.

If we disregard their malicious mislabeling, and we instead confine our arguments to the fact that there is no actual justification for outlawing a given gun, progressives simply disregard reality, because progressives were never trying to outlaw that gun based on alleged dangerous features to begin with. Their only reason for trying to outlaw that gun is the fact that they mislabeled it as a "scary weapon of doom".

By not allowing progressives to get away with mislabeling a gun as a "scary weapon of doom" we undercut their only justification for outlawing that gun.

So we aren't going to give up on this fight over terminology. It is the central battleground of the entire war.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 03:20 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
I recommend not using the term "assault rifle" at all because the term is defined in different ways, leading to pointless and repetitive discussion.

So long as progressives use the term as a weapon against civil liberties, it is necessary to confront their use of the term.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 03:39 pm
@Zardoz,
Boy you went off the deep end in that post.
Quote:
There were laws written specifically to protect whistleblowers otherwise they would never come forward because they would be retaliated against.

The retaliation happened.
https://www.longislandpress.com/2017/01/14/obamas-legacy-historic-war-on-whistleblowers/
Quote:
It has been more than 200 years and there has never been a reason to overthrow the government but their will always be a fringe right that would constantly want to overthrow the government.

I would hardly call the people trying overthrow the 2016 election Righties.
Quote:
You think that Timothy McVeigh and hundreds just like him would not try to overthrow the government every time that the government did something they did not like.

I only recall one Oklahoma City bombing.
Zardoz
 
  2  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 09:44 pm
@coldjoint,
The whistle blowers’ laws were passed in 1989 because they are in the public interest. Employees, like the employee who blew the whistle on Trump, have access to information not available to the general public. There was Trump selling out the national security of America to gain an edge in the next election. Just as the case with Boeing the general public needs to know that the plane they are flying in was wired by people that were not qualified to wire a go cart. Their very life depends on knowing that fact. They have a whistleblower to thank for it. Feedback
Web results

Whistleblower Protection Act (WPA) | CPSC.gov


https://www.cpsc.gov › About-CPSC › Inspector-General › Whistleblower-...

1. Cached
2. Similar
The Whistleblower Protection Act (WPA) protects Federal employees and applicants for employment who lawfully disclose information they reasonably believe evidences: ... Whistleblower Protection Enhancement Act (WPEA) In 2012 Congress passed the WPEA into law to strengthen protections ...

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Your source is a political pamphlet handed out for free, no doubt being authored by the KBG. You guys are so easy you will believe anything the Russians write. When something is handed out free you know somebody is paying for it. This election has nothing to do with Obama.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There isn’t anybody overthrowing the election results. Trump belied that he became king and cannot be removed from office for misconduct. Trump and his lawyers have already asserted in court that Trump can kill people and there is nothing anybody can do about it. The Founding Fathers put impeachment in the Constitution to insure we had a president not a king. Without the ability to remove a president for misconduct there would be no reason for a president not to have all his political rivals killed like they do in South America.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There have been a number of uprising including one in WV that is considered the biggest armed insurrection since the Civil War. It involved thousand of armed men. It is called the Battle of Blair Mountain. This incident was edited out of most history books even my West Virginia history did not cover it.
coldjoint
 
  1  
Reply Wed 1 Jan, 2020 09:56 pm
@Zardoz,
Quote:
The whistle blowers’ laws were passed in 1989

Tell Obama.
Quote:
There isn’t anybody overthrowing the election results.

Impeachment does if a president is removed.
Quote:
It is called the Battle of Blair Mountain.

You forgot about the Whiskey rebellion where Washington lead troops as a president. Very early on in our history.
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Thu 2 Jan, 2020 03:26 am
@coldjoint,
Quote:
Impeachment does if a president is removed.

No. Because Pence was elected by the same voters on the same slate for the very purpose of assuming Trump's position if he couldn't serve out his term. None of the other congressional races or presidential appointments are affected. It's the same administration.
coldjoint
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Jan, 2020 01:39 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
Because Pence was elected by the same voters on the same slate for the very purpose of assuming Trump's position

And Pelosi was elected to assume Pence's position and down the line. You know as well as I do if Trump goes it will not be the same.
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Jan, 2020 02:24 pm
@Zardoz,
Quote:
You don’t have to defend yourself from an investigation.

Is that the advice you got from a lawyer?

Quote:
If you haven’t done anything there is not enough evidence to bring you to trial.

Considering the old adage "A prosecutor could get an indictment against a ham sandwich.", I would say you were wrong.

Quote:
Trump been a life-long criminal that has that has danced between the rain drops because of his connections to organized criminals.

Nice personal opinion. Do you think anyone doing business with the Unions in NY could avoid Mob connections?

Quote:
I am reading the Fusion GPS book that used extensive court records of Trump’s scams.

It figures those scammers would write a book about Trump. Seeing as how their fake dossier failed, they have to keep trying. You should do yourself a favor and read an unbias book about the election. That company was knees deep in launching a fake investigation into a presidential campaign for the Obama admin to help Hillary.

Quote:
Do you not understand that facts are facts they don’t change you can’t spin facts? You can deny facts but you can’t spin them. Opinion however are different. Opinions however are all spin.

You should consider this when posting about guns, you are always fact free and opinion heavy. When you can't prove your opinion, you double down and make more ridiculous claims and examples.

Quote:
The actual facts show that the Dayton shooter went on line to hero worship the El Paso mass murderer. It looks as if he had a last-minute conversion before he decided to become a mass murderer. The El Paso mass murder showed him the true way.

Those are not actual facts, that is opinion. The facts are that he was a Bernie supporter and he chose to shoot up a bunch of people, including his own sister.

Quote:
There is no way around the fact that no innocent person has anything to fear from an investigation. In fact, an investigation will prove they are innocent.

Except lots and lots of innocent people are thrown in jail and convicted all the time.
Fact's time! Did you know there were 7 mistakes on the FISA applications to spy on Carter Page and the Trump Campaign... with 1 mistake, an application would be denied, how was one approved with 7 mistakes? How were 5 warrants approved with a total of 17 mistakes in all?
Fact! One of the judges on the FISA court has come out and written an article on the mistakes by the FBI, and demands that they follow the rules as written.

Quote:
There were laws written specifically to protect whistleblowers otherwise they would never come forward because they would be retaliated against.

That is the only law, they actually have no protections from being named and exposed, it only protects their job.

Did you know that Obama was the worst offender against Whistle Blowers and had several sent to jail?
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2019/11/21/where_was_the_love_for_whistleblowers_during_the_obama_administration_141782.html

Quote:
Not all politicians are pathological liars I have worked with hundreds.

That's your proof that they are not all liars? They must have been the politicians that supported the union, you would ignore their lies as long as it got you more money from the taxpayer.

Quote:
Whitehouse insiders have noted that Trump is a functional illiterate who only reads at an eighth or ninth grade level.

Keep telling yourself that. Are these some of the same "insiders" who have been exposed as liars in their own books?

Quote:
The key part of the Heller decision is the ruling that you do not have a right to any “weapon whatsoever for any reason whatsoever.”

That was not the key part of the ruling, the key part of the ruling was that people are allowed to own guns. What you think was the key ruling was an example of where the already existing laws would be in effect, like govt buildings and people who are restricted are those with felonies on their records. That is all that decision said, it's why you never posted the entire decision, you thought you could lie by omission.

Quote:
I drew you a picture for you in a previous post. All you have to do is read it. In the Heller decision the guy got his gun permit but lost his “right to own any weapon whatsoever.”

No misleading pictures required, I actually posted the decision and it doesn't come close to what you said it said. Just to prove yo lied and mislead, I'll post the decision again, since you don't have the guts to.
Because you are a liar:
(2) Like most rights, the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose: For example, concealed weapons prohibitions have been upheld under the Amendment or state analogues. The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. Miller’s holding that the sorts of weapons protected are those “in common use at the time” finds support in the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons.

Quote:
He won the battle but lost the war. It was an extremely high price for a gun permit.

You are a liar who is not honest about the decision! You will also have to take into account the Mcdonald vs Chicago decision, which also points to you being a liar about the rulings on gun laws:
Majority
The majority agreed that the Fourteenth Amendment incorporates the Second Amendment right recognized in Heller, but was split on the rationale. Writing for four members of the court, Justice Alito found that the Due Process Clause incorporates that right against the States.[22] While joining most of the rest of Alito’s opinion, Justice Thomas, in his concurrence, concluded that the right to bear arms is incorporated only on alternative grounds, namely through the Privileges or Immunities Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.[23] Alito also reaffirmed, in part of the opinion for four justices, that certain firearms restrictions mentioned in District of Columbia v. Heller are assumed permissible and not directly dealt with in this case.[24] Such restrictions include those to "prohibit ... the possession of firearms by felons or mentally ill" and "laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms."[24]

Quote:
Shall not be infringed is not a right it only applies to the right to keep and bear arms hall not be infringed.

You don't have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

Quote:
That means that you can’t take the right to keep and bear arms away from the criminals and the mentally ill.

Keep talking out of both sides of your face.

Quote:
It has been more than 200 years and there has never been a reason to overthrow the government but their will always be a fringe right that would constantly want to overthrow the government.

I think you forget the aims of the far left, which you fall into.

Quote:
Reading the second amendment as written is one thing but you read it as you wished it was.

Wrong, I read it as written. You read it as you want it to be.

Quote:
When it says right to keep and bear arms it does not mean an arsenal of weapons of war and it is not infringed if you have an arm to bear.

You would be wrong, that is exactly the reason the 2nd Amendment was written.


Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Jan, 2020 03:11 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
As I explained, I'm discussing the subject with you, not anyone else here.

Well you can take your one sided opinion and double dealing and keep them to yourself. I'll only discuss the subjects at hand, not your opinion on my postings.

Quote:
Instead of wasting effort on trying to compel everyone to accept your definition of the term just refer to the particular features which characterize the specific assault weapon you have in mind. Save yourself the hassle.

Are you here to make a point or critique my proper use of a term and back up a wrong use of a term?

Quote:
I'm not protecting or defending the DNC, I'm simply correcting you when you misuse the term. You can pretty much say anything you like about the DNC and I won't object. I just think continuing to conflate the national party committee with the Democratic Party as a whole demonstrates either sloppiness or willful ignorance.

Yes, you are protecting them. When was the last time the DNC gave money or support to someone who wasn't a Dem? They are the same group, supporting the same people and using the same money, distinction without a difference.

Quote:
Aw, isn't that too bad. I consider this thread to be Zardoz's blog.

Yeah, it is to bad, I'll commenting on his lies, you can keep protecting his lies.

Quote:
I respect his experience and I'm generally interested in his observations.

Socialists and communists do think alike.

Quote:
You, on the other hand, come across as angry, arrogant, and self-righteous.

I guess you haven't been reading his posts very closely then, have you?

Quote:
You're actually the one who shows up here with an agenda — you can't leave the thread alone!

Why should I, it's filled with lies and propaganda, and someone has to correct him on his lies.

Do you think a bank robbery is a mass shooting?
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Thu 2 Jan, 2020 08:06 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote:

Do you think a bank robbery is a mass shooting?

Wouldn't that be established by the number, frequency, and circumstance of the casualties in each and any individual case? I don't get your point.
Quote:

Yes, you are protecting them.

I really don't see how sharing a few responses within a long-running partisan discussion on somebody's blog in an obscure corner of a retro message board among a half dozen people provides any "protection" to an organization like the DNC.
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Thu 2 Jan, 2020 10:57 pm
@Baldimo,
Sorry, but the second amendment guarantees you only that you will have an arm to bear period. It is specific in stating that is what the right is. More complex statements are often open to different interpretations but this involves only six small words. What you are granted by the second amendment is a right to bear arms. The type of arm you can bear is left up to the government. We know this from past practices and supreme court rulings. Just because it was left open it is then in purview of government to make the laws to govern. The second amendment does not restrict the government from controlling what type of guns are legal.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Sorry, but that is a direct quote from the Heller decision, “you do not have a right to any weapon whatsoever for any purpose whatsoever.” This is also the past practice of laws and court decision on the second amendment. That comes directly from the horse’s mouth, sort of speak.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Did you notice other bodily functions are not addressed under the Constitution? The areas not addressed under the bill rights are left open for the government to make laws. The supreme court has ruled that abortion is legal under the bill of rights. Specifically, that women have a right to privacy of their most private parts. Just as criminals have a right that they can refuse to testify and incriminate themselves. The rights must be read to a suspect after an arrest that he is entitled to an attorney and anything he says can and will be used against him in a court of law. That was derived from the fourteenth amendment right to privacy. You still don’t understand that “shall not be infringed” does not mean you are entitled to own any weapon whatsoever. That simply means that you can’t take the right to bear arms from criminals and the mentally ill. If a gun nut was standing out in front of an elementary school with his AR-15 a cop could not take his AR-15 because you can’t infringe his right to bear arms. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
That was an exact quote from the Heller Decision. The second amendment does not give you the right to own any weapon whatsoever for any purpose whatsoever.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Feedback
Web results

Do guns make us safer? Science suggests no - Harvard ...


https://www.hsph.harvard.edu › news › hsph-in-the-news › do-guns-make-...

1. Cached
2. Similar
Conflicting statistics about guns—such as how many people in the U.S. use guns for ... how many people own guns—was the subject of a recent podcast featuring David Hemenway, ... the National Crime Victimization Survey, pegs the number of people who use guns in this ... Scientists agree: Guns don't make society safer ...
Missing: 76%

This one shows your CDC study was based on faulty presumptions and they only found 100,000 incidences of someone defending themselves or their property with a gun and you can bet 99,000 of them were drug dealers protecting their stash.


3 percent of US adults own half the country's guns, study says ...


https://www.bostonglobe.com › metro › 2016/09/21 › story

1. Similar
Sep 22, 2016 - 3 percent of US adults own half the country's guns, study says ... own half of the country's guns, according to a new study by researchers at Harvard ... 55 million gun owners in America own either one or two guns, according to the study. ... with a gun are more likely to kill themselves than people who don't.

This one shows the number of households that own a gun has declined 19% since 1977.

Despite mass shootings, number of households owning guns ...


https://www.cbsnews.com › news › despite-mass-shootings-number-of-hou...

1. Cached
Mar 1, 2018 - Half of all guns are concentrated among 3 percent of Americans. ... households with guns has dropped 19 percentage points from 50 percent in 1977 to ... These figures also do not capture private gun sales that don't require a ...
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When the 8-track tape was invented one of the major electronic companies called William Lear (designer of the Lear jet) and told him it could never be done. Lear informed him he had already done it. Gun laws are like that the NRA has always used their blood money to buy politicians and take any teeth out of any gun law. It is much like having a pit bull and pulling all its teeth. Like the 8-track it can be done if we just get rid of the Russian NRA puppets.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Fri 3 Jan, 2020 03:30 am
@Zardoz,
Zardoz wrote:
Sorry, but the second amendment guarantees you only that you will have an arm to bear period.

Wrong. The Second Amendment guarantees the right to have any gun that there is no compelling government interest in restricting.


Zardoz wrote:
What you are granted by the second amendment is a right to bear arms. The type of arm you can bear is left up to the government.

Wrong. The government is only allowed to restrict guns if it can justify those restrictions as serving a compelling government interest.


Zardoz wrote:
We know this from past practices and supreme court rulings.

We have 75 years of Supreme Court rulings that say that the government can only restrict a fundamental right if that restriction can be justified as serving a compelling government interest.


Zardoz wrote:
The second amendment does not restrict the government from controlling what type of guns are legal.

It does if there is no compelling government interest in restricting that type of gun.
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Jan, 2020 10:27 am
@Zardoz,
Quote:
Sorry, but the second amendment guarantees you only that you will have an arm to bear period.

You are still wrong, the term is arms, the plural of the word, not the singular. The problem with your take on Rights is that you are the tolitarian and think Rights are limited to what you think they should be. That wasn't the intention of the FF, it was for maximum freedom and liberty, in other words the opposite of everything you believe.

Quote:
It is specific in stating that is what the right is. More complex statements are often open to different interpretations but this involves only six small words.

The 2nd Amendment is more than 6 small words, it's actually 27 words. It isn't my fault you ignore the other 21 words. In fact the most important words are "Shall not be infringed", which only make an appearance in this Amendment and no others, why do you think that is?

Quote:
The second amendment does not restrict the government from controlling what type of guns are legal.

Yeah it does, the entire Constitution is a restriction on the govt. The FF intended this country to be for small govt and limited control over the people, they had just fought a war against a tyrannical govt and you think they were giving more power to the new govt? You really don't understand the founding of this nation at all do you?

Quote:
Sorry, but that is a direct quote from the Heller decision, “you do not have a right to any weapon whatsoever for any purpose whatsoever.”

It a partial quote, why aren't you providing the entire quote? Because the entire quore doesn't say what you seem to think it says, here it is again so you can't lie:
It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose: For example, concealed weapons prohibitions have been upheld under the Amendment or state analogues. The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. Miller’s holding that the sorts of weapons protected are those “in common use at the time” finds support in the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons.

Quote:
This is also the past practice of laws and court decision on the second amendment. That comes directly from the horse’s mouth, sort of speak.

You are providing a false interpretation of what the ruling said,typical of a leftists. Why are you also forgetting McDonald vs Chicago, which expanded on the Heller ruling.

Quote:
Did you notice other bodily functions are not addressed under the Constitution? The areas not addressed under the bill rights are left open for the government to make laws.

You are wrong again, the 10th Amendment states:
The Tenth Amendment (Amendment X) to the United States Constitution, which is part of the Bill of Rights, was ratified on December 15, 1791.[1] It expresses the principle of federalism and states' rights, which strictly supports the entire plan of the original Constitution for the United States of America, by stating that the federal government possesses only those powers delegated to it by the United States Constitution. All remaining powers are reserved for the states or the people.

Quote:
The supreme court has ruled that abortion is legal under the bill of rights. Specifically, that women have a right to privacy of their most private parts.

According to you, rights are not unlimited, so any and all laws restricting the practice of abortion are lawful.

Quote:
You still don’t understand that “shall not be infringed” does not mean you are entitled to own any weapon whatsoever.

Actually yes it does, there are no limits on the 2nd Amendment in the Constitution.

Quote:
That simply means that you can’t take the right to bear arms from criminals and the mentally ill.

You would be wrong on that count as well. You do realize you are batting 0 on this subject.

Quote:
If a gun nut was standing out in front of an elementary school with his AR-15 a cop could not take his AR-15 because you can’t infringe his right to bear arms.

If they are doing nothing wrong and the person is just standing there, you are correct the police can't do anything about it. That person isn't doing anything wrong, they might be weird and they might talk to him, but they can't take his weapon.

Quote:
That was an exact quote from the Heller Decision. The second amendment does not give you the right to own any weapon whatsoever for any purpose whatsoever.

No, that was a partial quote that left out the important part of that wording. When you read the full sentence, it doesn't say what you think it says.

Quote:
Do guns make us safer? Science suggests no - Harvard ...

So a bunch of liberal professors got together with their bias data and agreed that guns do not make us safer? Excuse me while I laugh at them, a majority of their work was done using probability stats and not actual crime stats. They actually have no leg to stand on.

Quote:
This one shows your CDC study was based on faulty presumptions and they only found 100,000 incidences of someone defending themselves or their property with a gun and you can bet 99,000 of them were drug dealers protecting their stash.

Of course they said it had to be faulty, the general public must be kept from the truth that guns do make us safer from crime. Even if the number was as low as they claim, which it isn't, then 100,000 is still way higher than the max of 14,000 killed with guns. I'll take the 100,000 people saved with guns over the 14k killed with them. See the stats are still not in your favor.

Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Jan, 2020 10:29 am
@hightor,
Quote:
Wouldn't that be established by the number, frequency, and circumstance of the casualties in each and any individual case? I don't get your point.

Don't be daft, you have been reading this thread, you know exactly what I'm talking about. Zardoz says the North Hollywood Bank Robbery was a mass shooting.

 

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