House of Reps. member Giffords shot in Arizona today

@Lash,

Lash wrote:

I'm claiming universal humanity....in humans. You don't have to be a cynic or an angry person to have experienced a moment of muttering that you prefer an unbalanced person not to act on.

Your narcissism is showing, dear, in your thinking that everyone must be like you.

1 Reply

@Lash,

Lash wrote:

I'm claiming universal humanity....in humans. You don't have to be a cynic or an angry person to have experienced a moment of muttering that you prefer an unbalanced person not to act on.

Moments of muttering would not have the same effect as widely disseminated political ads or popular media commentary.

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

Yeh, that's the hard part, how to tell.

Well, for me, it was even a bit hard reading the article in Slate; I'm the last person I know to be interested in fantasy or science fiction writing. Inception, the movie, would bore me silly.

So, for me, people interested in alternative reality as an interesting subject are living an alternative reality (and so on).

0 Replies

@realjohnboy,

Quote:

There is a bit of criticism about the audience, which treated this more as a pep rally rather than a memorial service.
Any thoughts on that?

I found the audience reaction very odd. It was really out of step with the fact that this was supposed to be a memorial service. In part, it may have been because the university really didn't establish a proper atmosphere or tone for such a service, in a venue that, I believe, is usually used for basketball games. The audience, for instance, could have been advised not to applaud or cheer the speakers, but to maintain the decorum appropriate to the occasion. But, perhaps, the sort of response that occurred just wasn't anticipated. Then again, I think the event was called, "Together We Thrive: Tucson and America", which may have also confused the nature of the program for those in the audience, and contributed to the upbeat "pep rally" response.

I also felt that the program could have been better organized and integrated, rather than just letting various people come to the podium and say quite different things. For instance, Eric Holder and Janet Napolitano just choosing to read passages from Scripture, with no personal comments, seemed somewhat out of step with what the other speakers were doing. There just wasn't a consistent tone or focus to the event. It was a hodge podge. And the audience cheers, which at times seemed inappropriate, just served to emphasize that.

President Obama seemed a little uncomfortable with all of the applause, particularly in the initial portion of his speech, since his tone was appropriately somber, and his remarks really didn't call for that sort of response--he was trying to reflect the sorrow of the country. And he was the one who focused most fully on the victims of the shooting. The audience reaction may have surprised him. He certainly didn't do anything to encourage a pep rally response, and as he got to the more uplifting portions of his speech, and a motivational focus on the future, the audience enthusiasm became more fitting to the content of his remarks and he and the crowd seemed more in tune. But, until that point, I don't think the audience reaction was at all useful in helping him to deliver a difficult speech. But, they certainly gave him a great reception. And he rose to the occasion.

I'm not sure there is a correct way to hold a memorial service after a tragedy of this kind, particularly when most of the people in the audience don't seem to be expressing an outpouring of grief. But, it honored the victims, and, I hope, brought some measure of comfort to their families.

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

I 100% agree.
That is not what I was responding to however.
POM made the statement that EVERYONE in AZ was a coward.
I was just wondering if that included the liberals, since she admits to being a liberal.

2 Replies

@firefly,

Quote:

I found the audience reaction very odd. It was really out of step with the fact that this was supposed to be a memorial service

No,but it figures that you would think so..

Quote:

Mark Bell is a therapist at Psychological Counseling Services.

"I've heard some people talking about it, turning it into a pep rally and in some sense that's not a bad thing, because the President's job is to come and to rally people in times of crisis and to give them some pep or some uplift, some optimism, some hope," says Bell.

"It's simply just that. It's their emotions in the moment that's taking them to a place that's helping them to release that energy that's there. It's just the human condition. And on top of that, that's the human spirit, when we turn tragedy into triumph. It's the American way."

http://www.myfoxphoenix.com/dpp/news/local/tucson/tucson-memorial-audience-1-13-2011

Quote:

White House press secretary Robert Gibbs was asked in his briefing Tuesday about "the pep rally aspect and tone of the event."

He responded that "part of the grieving process is celebrating the lives of those that were lost, and celebrating the miracles of those that survived."

"I read the speech several times, and thought that there wouldn't be a lot of applause, if any. I think many of us thought that," he continued. "But I think there was a celebration, again, of the lives of those that have impacted, not just at that grocery store, but throughout the country. And I think that if that is part of the healing process, then that's a good thing

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20028447-503544.html

And finally, are you familiar with the concept of a wake? This expectation that we are all supposed to be weepy at time of death is less in force now than it has ever been in my lifetime. It is now routine for people to request that others hold a party in their honor when the time comes rather than a black and teary funeral.

1 Reply

@plainoldme,

plainoldme wrote:

The entire state is full of cowardly, paranoid idiots.

Oh really?

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

mysteryman wrote:

I 100% agree.
That is not what I was responding to however.
POM made the statement that EVERYONE in AZ was a coward.
I was just wondering if that included the liberals, since she admits to being a liberal.

MM just my opinion but there are a number of posters here who self-label as "liberal" just as there are a number who self-label as "conservatives" both subsets misrepresent their actual ideologies. POM is not a "liberal" just as H2Oman is not a "conservative."

1 Reply

@dyslexia,

Quote:

. POM is not a "liberal" just as H2Oman is not a "conservative."

Holy Cow Dys, since you don't ascribe to the liberal orthodoxy the people are what ever they claim they are with no questioning of the assertion allowed you are not a liberal, they throw you out of the club for that....what are you ?

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

Yep, that's right. Preparations are underway (mostly paperwork) to evict Dys from the liberal fortress. Had he been a conservative, he could have prevented this by draping himself in a flag, but us liberals, we don't parlay.

Dys - Please clean out your desk by 4:00PM, and leave your liberal issue Birkenstocks with the secretary on your way out.

A
R
T

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

I've been out of the club since 1967

0 Replies

@failures art,

my Birkenstocks

http://www.replica-supplier.com/Replica_Shoes/images/Converse_Shoes_men87-1.jpg

1 Reply

@dyslexia,

the green matches your skin tone...

0 Replies

@mysteryman,

Quote:

POM made the statement that EVERYONE in AZ was a coward.

You can't read, can you? Stop misquoting me, girly man.

1 Reply

@plainoldme,

Here are your your exact words...

Quote:

The entire state is full of cowardly, paranoid idiots

So,since you said the ENTIRE state, that means you are calling everyone cowards.
Sorry if you dont like getting quoted.

3 Replies

@mysteryman,

Yes, commenting on the gun permits, was I.

I detest fire arms.

So what?

You should be in bed. It is nearly 1:00 AM EST.

2 Replies

@wandeljw,

But, I was talking about a moment of muttering.

0 Replies

@DrewDad,

You must know that I've observed related comments from a multitude of people to believe it must be universal. Most everyone I've known has done it at least once in my hearing. I feel like I've known a very wide, disparate group of people. Mostly done in jest - but done all the same. DrewDad - you are saying that you've never made a flip comment that could be construed as a wish for something negative to happen to anyone?

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

And finally, are you familiar with the concept of a wake? This expectation that we are all supposed to be weepy at time of death is less in force now than it has ever been in my lifetime. It is now routine for people to request that others hold a party in their honor when the time comes rather than a black and teary funeral.

I don't know that most people feel "an expectation to be weepy"--when you experience a loss, you genuinely feel it. And how can you not feel particularly sad when one of those killed was a 9 year old girl? Having a party to honor someone's life is a nice idea in some circumstances--but I don't think that when lives are snuffed out in a senseless act of murder that most people would be feeling upbeat.

Last night, the grief on the faces of the victims' families was quite real. It was the audience that seemed out of touch with exactly why they were there. They were obviously excited to see President Obama, but he was there because of a very tragic event. And a good part of his speech was very, appropriately, somber in tone. I don't think he expected to be delivering that portion of it to a cheering audience.

I don't buy the explanations of either the therapist or Robert Gibbs that you posted. They are just searching to make some sense of the audience reaction and give it a positive spin. The pep rally atmosphere was evident before the President ever took the stage. I think it had more to do with the way the university organized the event, and titled it--and the type of audience that showed up. It was an "event" (complete with special T-shirts for those attending) more than a memorial service for specific people. Other than the President's remarks about the actual victims, the rest of the program had an impersonal feel, particularly for a memorial service, and it lacked a cohesive tone. And that I'd blame on whoever organized it.

Had the President not attended, I doubt that the place would have been packed. It's great that he generates such excitement, and he delivered an excellent speech, but some of that audience enthusiasm did seem a little out of place last night--he was there to mourn the tragic murders of 6 people, and honor their lives, and the audience didn't always seem to connect with his somber emotional tone, which really did not call for some of that applause. Had the audience reserved their enthusiasm for the more clearly uplifting, motivational comments he made in the last portion of his speech, it would have made more emotional sense. As it was, the audience mainly seemed to be there because they wanted to cheer Obama--and that's certainly not a bad thing, but at times they seemed to be cheering a eulogy, and forgetting why the eulogy was being given. I'm sure the audience response might have puzzled Obama too. He was there to give support, not to look for it.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Quote:

I don't buy the explanations of either the therapist or Robert Gibbs that you posted. They are just searching to make some sense of the audience reaction and give it a positive spin.

Your mistake might be that you dont know people, and you dont believe people. The reports are that not only are you wrong that this was a flippant pep rally vibe but that before Obama spoke the tension in the air was thick. These are people who were tense which means that emotion was close to the surface. Furthermore, if you know anything about people you would know that in these kinds of moments where we face huge setbacks we emotionally deal with our situation either by laughing or by crying. The folks in Tucson decided on laughing, and I think that you might have a need to piss all over that choice because you are pissed about the immigration thing. Hopefully I am wrong, that you are really not THAT petty.

2 Replies

House of Reps. member Giffords shot in Arizona today

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know